Originally Posted By Darkbeer Hey, if they did merge the parks, would they serve beer in the Golden Horseshoe Saloon?
Originally Posted By markedward Besides the financial issues, there's a logistical reason why Disney should be against combining the parks, and, in fact, should be against Park Hoppers (assuming DCA gets to the point it can stand on its own). If there are 20,000 people in one park and 20,000 in another, then when there is a new attraction, there are 20,000 people a day in line for it. And when there's a parade or fireworks, there are 20,000 people trying to watch it. But with combined parks, or Park Hoppers, everyone in both parks make their way to the new attraction, so 40,000 people are in line. And 40,000 crowding to see the parade. I'm convinced this is why transportation at WDW is so far short of Walt Disney's ideal. Because if there was good transportation and Park Hoppers, what would stop everyone at WDW from crowding into the Everest line, hopping on a monorail, then crowding into the Mission Space line, then packing the Magic Kingdom parade.... You get the idea. Seperate admission spreads the crowds out and shortens the lines at the mega-attractions.
Originally Posted By schoolsinger Right now many people spend a whole day at Disneyland and not even bother with DCA because it is not worth the extra money. But if the parks were combined, almost all of Disneyland visitors would spend some time in DCA because it is included in the admission. This means many people who spend all of their time in Disneyland will now spend some time out of it. Here is what I think combining the parks will do to crowds overall. The lines on the DCA side would go up, while the lines at the Disneyland side would go down. While it is true that more people being able to access the major attractions, those people will also have a bigger selection of other attraction to draw their attention away from them. And no matter where the people go, if the lines go up for one attraction, the lines for will go down for another. If there is an increase in lines over all, it is because of the extra guests Disney will be bringing in because the big super park is so appealing.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<Right now many people spend a whole day at Disneyland and not even bother with DCA because it is not worth the extra money. But if the parks were combined, almost all of Disneyland visitors would spend some time in DCA because it is included in the admission.>> You continue the point that combining the two parks and charging the same one-park price is something Disney won't do. Why should they combine the two parks and give away all the admissions fees they are now getting from DCA? Or are suggesting that the parks be combined, and the Passport price be raised to the current hopper price of $79.00?
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< Disney still can't bring themselves to making the admission price $15-20 lower than it should be. >>> One thing they have finally done in the last year is price DCA a lot closer to what it's worth in its current state: a $20 add-on to a day at DL.
Originally Posted By schoolsinger Under the combined park model Disney’s pricing will be based ONLY on how much time you spend in the park, and not based on how many rides you have access to during that time. What the guests do in that time is up to them. Remember that whether the parks are combined or not, the amount of rides a person can fit into a day will be the same.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<Under the combined park model Disney’s pricing will be based ONLY on how much time you spend in the park, and not based on how many rides you have access to during that time.>> Huh? Are you suggesting that if a guest comes at opening, they will pay full price, and if another guest comes in a few hours later, they will pay less?
Originally Posted By dr jones Separate gates, just make it better. for the love of all that is good just make it better!
Originally Posted By schoolsinger Assuming that the parks will never be combined, here is what I would do to fix DCA itself. I would broaden the theme from California to the whole world. It will have different areas based on different countries. While this may sound like World Showcase at Epcot, it will be distinct in two main ways. First, it won’t have the educational stuff. Second, the park will be more focused on myths and legends than reality.
Originally Posted By karlg RE #62 by markedward >>> Besides the financial issues, there's a logistical reason why Disney should be against combining the parks, and, in fact, should be against Park Hoppers (assuming DCA gets to the point it can stand on its own). If there are 20,000 people in one park and 20,000 in another, then when there is a new attraction, there are 20,000 people a day in line for it. And when there's a parade or fireworks, there are 20,000 people trying to watch it. But with combined parks, or Park Hoppers, everyone in both parks make their way to the new attraction, so 40,000 people are in line. <<< A very hypothetical example as the reality is that DL draw more like 40,000 and DCA more like 15,000 on a busy day. The further reality is that much of DCA’s attendance it made up of people with hopper/AP privileges or are there on a two for one or some other deal. Your logic doesn’t work when one park is drawing so much more than the other park. Thus they often close DCA when the fireworks and Fantasmic begin at DL. They tried in the beginning to make DCA a separate admission no AP stands on it own park and it failed. They pulled every trick they could just to try and get people to go there including making it free for DL APs and the 2-for-1 (talk about setting the price low, go to DL and get into DCA for free). What they have done in effect it make it a single park via hoppers but with some hassle. It does little to help the crowding at DL an instead dumps people into DL for the fireworks and Fantasmic. The people not able to jump over to DL already are mostly locals there on a 2 for 1 or a few people doing a very short vacation that decide to sample DCA. >>> I'm convinced this is why transportation at WDW is so far short of Walt Disney's ideal. Because if there was good transportation and Park Hoppers, what would stop everyone at WDW from crowding into the Everest line, hopping on a monorail, then crowding into the Mission Space line, then packing the Magic Kingdom parade.... You get the idea. Seperate admission spreads the crowds out and shortens the lines at the mega-attractions. <<< There certainly is little incentive for WDW to improve the transportation between parks at WDW, but DL is a totally different physical arrangement. Exactly the type of movement you talk about happens at DL. People go over and cherry pick a few attractions at DCA and then are back to DL for the nighttime entertainment. The fundamental problem is that DCA just does not stand on its own.
Originally Posted By WorldDisney <<Right now many people spend a whole day at Disneyland and not even bother with DCA because it is not worth the extra money. But if the parks were combined, almost all of Disneyland visitors would spend some time in DCA because it is included in the admission. This means many people who spend all of their time in Disneyland will now spend some time out of it. Here is what I think combining the parks will do to crowds overall. The lines on the DCA side would go up, while the lines at the Disneyland side would go down.>> Your just NEVER going to get this are you?? Everyone here has (once again) said its a bad mistake for every reason in the book: Financial, logistical and ideological. It would pretty much be a nightmare to have all these people in this new 'mega-park' while not raising the price one dollar just isn't feasible. Please, you have been throwing out this idea for YEARS and no one bites. There's a reason for that . Honestly, not trying to be harsh but there comes a time you have to realize no matter how many times you say it, it nots going to finally persuade people to see your POV. Trust me, I use to have a girlfriend, I know that all too well ;D. And besides, its been said, the park basically IS combined with the 2fers, APs and park hoppers. Disney probably isn't getting the numbers they want, but at LEAST they are making some kind of profit off it while still giving people the chance to experience the park at a discounted rate---which it should be. DCA doesn't need to be tacked on to DL for people to see it. It just needs to be BETTER!!!! Period.
Originally Posted By WorldDisney <<RE: worlddisney #57: Totally agree with you.>> Rivkah86, Thanks . It's obvious you're not my ex-girlfriend though .
Originally Posted By schoolsinger Let us say that before the parks are combined, a person can fit 20 attractions in their day. Now, if the parks were combined does that mean the person fit 40 attractions in their day? No. Because of the limits of time, it will still be 20. This is why there is no need to increase prices. The only difference combining the parks make is that now the person has more of a choice as to what those 20 attractions are. Saying that Disney needs to raise prices if they combine the parks is like saying that a restaurant needs to raise prices because they increased the size of there menu. In both cases, increasing selection does not increase how much each person consumes. What increased selection does is make the place’s offerings appeal to more people, which leads to more customers.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss I will give it one more shot, and then I will give up. <<Let us say that before the parks are combined, a person can fit 20 attractions in their day. Now, if the parks were combined does that mean the person fit 40 attractions in their day? No. Because of the limits of time, it will still be 20. This is why there is no need to increase prices.>> But you are asking Disney to DECREASE their price! They are currently getting $49.00 for a one park ticket, and $69.00 for a 1-day hopper. Disney will not lower their price $20.00, nor will many people want to pay $20.00 more for a combined park!
Originally Posted By oc_dean Park Hoppers are a standard thing in WDW with 4 gated parks. Has been for years. No reason to "combine" anything there. Here we have 2 parks. Okay,maybe 1&1/4th ... but nonetheless ... eventually the "park hopper" phenomenon will catch on here in SoCal. Until then ... the 2fr1s will help pull bodies in.
Originally Posted By schoolsinger For those who think multiple parks are better than one super park, let me ask you this. Would you want Disneyland itself to be split in two separate parks? Then the resort could have three parks: DCA, Disneyland West, and Disneyland East. The more parks, the better, right? You are probably thinking that the idea of dividing Disneyland into two parks is silly. But what you are thinking about that idea, is probably similar to what I think about the current park divide at the Disneyland resort.
Originally Posted By oc_dean Park Hoppers are not making much sense to many SoCals .. but intime .. we'll understand their use better when DCA can stand on it's own two feet .. and when a possible 3rd park arises. Just look east to WDW. The park-hopper thing is a standard that makes perfect sense for them .. and intime .. can make sense for the DLR. It's only because that nitwitted Eisner thought going so cheap on a 2nd Gate that really messed up the "park hopper" thing to begin with!
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<For those who think multiple parks are better than one super park, let me ask you this. Would you want Disneyland itself to be split in two separate parks?>> I officially give up.
Originally Posted By idleHands I have come to the conclusion that DCA can never be "fixed." It was a moronic decision to build a second gate in Anaheim, in the first place. Any second gate at the DLR will never perform to Burbank's ultimate satisfaction. Westcot, DisneySea, Villains thrill park... all would have been failures. Disneyland is too dependent upon the local one-day visitor. Disneyland will always have more than 50% local attendance, day in and day out, no matter what. And single day park hopping is a major strain on operational costs. Anaheim will never become Orlando. And it was beyond dumb*ss stupid to even attempt the transformation. DCA will always be the red-headed stepchild in the Anaheim family. There is no "fix."
