Originally Posted By woody >>><BTW: I love it when Democrats won't admit they love Saddam.> >>And this is the kind of thing that gets you pegged. That's how I pegged you. Gee whiz!!!
Originally Posted By patrickegan >>Isn't Howard Dean a big voice for the left?<< <<No, he's a voice on the left. That's the difference between the rabid right where you dwell and the left. The left is made up of many voices.(Talking points from Comrade Pelosi.)The rabid-right is like the Borg...everyone speaks the same thing and in unison.>> This smacks of Franken “No, he's a voice on the left.†Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain he’s only the chairman of the Democratic party.
Originally Posted By cmpaley >>>>Isn't Howard Dean a big voice for the left?<< <<No, he's a voice on the left. That's the difference between the rabid right where you dwell and the left. The left is made up of many voices.(Talking points from Comrade Pelosi.)The rabid-right is like the Borg...everyone speaks the same thing and in unison.>> This smacks of Franken “No, he's a voice on the left.†Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain he’s only the chairman of the Democratic party. << Which, unlike the Republican Borg Collective, is made up of many voices. As far as I've seen, the biggest issue that the Democrats are united on is abortion. Republicans require absolute, complete and utter obedience to the party platform or be shunned from the Collective as a RINO.
Originally Posted By patrickegan POPE: REMEMBER THE UNBORN... The Pope also made a reference to the Church's total opposition to abortion, saying the love of God shines on each child, "even on those still unborn." <a href="http://reuters.myway.com/article/20051224/2005-12-24T235231Z_01_SIB485953_RTRIDST_0_NEWS-POPE-CHRISTMAS-DC.html" target="_blank">http://reuters.myway.com/artic le/20051224/2005-12-24T235231Z_01_SIB485953_RTRIDST_0_NEWS-POPE-CHRISTMAS-DC.html</a>
Originally Posted By cmpaley Duuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhh! I know the Church's position on abortion. I can probably explain the philosophical reasons for it far, far better than you could ever hope to. Being a Christian, however, means a WHOLE lot more than being opposed to abortion. The whole issue of life along with the moral and SOCIAL teaching of the Church means that you can NOT be an ideological Republican OR an ideological Democrat. Ideological republicanism, which amounts to social darwinism and an complete and utter abrogation for social responsibility, is completely contrary to the social teaching of the Church and ideological democratism is contrary to the life and sexual morals teaching of the Church.
Originally Posted By ADMIN <font color="#FF0000">Message removed by an administrator. <a href="MsgBoard-Rules.asp" target="_blank">Click here</a> for the LaughingPlace.com Community Standards.</font>
Originally Posted By ADMIN <font color="#FF0000">Message removed by an administrator. <a href="MsgBoard-Rules.asp" target="_blank">Click here</a> for the LaughingPlace.com Community Standards.</font>
Originally Posted By patrickegan Well I guess it safe to say I hit on a sore subject. Maybe you should give it a rest on the political discussions as it seems that your ideological stances and politics don’t mesh. The wild accusations self-indulgent use of judgmental superlatives and holier then thou sanctimony lends little to your credibility Mr. Kettle. Oh and on a side note, hard to accomplish any of that good stuff for Lord if you got aborted!
Originally Posted By cmpaley >>Well I guess it safe to say I hit on a sore subject. Maybe you should give it a rest on the political discussions as it seems that your ideological stances and politics don’t mesh. The wild accusations self-indulgent use of judgmental superlatives and holier then thou sanctimony lends little to your credibility Mr. Kettle. << Once again, LIAR, what the hell are you talking about, LIAR? You don't know what you're talking about, liar. Get this straight, you lying irreligious fool, disagreement with the anti-working person, anti-poor person and bigoted parts of the Republican platform doesn't I am pro-abortion. Get it? Understand? Of course not. To you, unless you believe that the hungry should be left on the street to starve, that the thirsty should be left parched and dehydrated until they die, that immigrants of all sorts should be oppressed and deported, the naked should be arrested for indecent exposure and forthwith tossed out into the street to freeze, that sick people should be left to die alone if they can't afford insurance, that those in prison should not be visited and ministered to, that working people have absolutely no workplace rights whatsoever and should be left to the tender mercies of the corporate marketplace, war at the drop of a hat is a good thing, the death penalty is the only way (even if there is exculpatory evidence or other means to protect society), YET abortion should be banned, you are a terrible unchristian demon. Give me a break. There is no contradiction whatsoever, liar, to the idea that abortion is a great moral evil that should not be permitted by a moral and just society and the concept that we, as a nation and culture, should ensure that the hungry are fed, the thirsty are quenched, the stranger (immigrant) is welcomed, the naked are clothed, that those who are sick are cared for and visited, that those in prison are visited and helped, and that workers DO have rights in their workplaces. Those are all good, Christian ideas that Christ commends. There's no contractiction whatsoever to that...except in your addled, lying mind. >>Oh and on a side note, hard to accomplish any of that good stuff for Lord if you got aborted!<< What an asinine thing for you to say...but I guess only a liar would think of such garbage.
Originally Posted By patrickegan <<To you, unless you believe that the hungry should be left on the street to starve, that the thirsty should be left parched and dehydrated until they die, that immigrants of all sorts should be oppressed and deported, the naked should be arrested for indecent exposure and forthwith tossed out into the street to freeze, that sick people should be left to die alone if they can't afford insurance, that those in prison should not be visited and ministered to, that working people have absolutely no workplace rights whatsoever and should be left to the tender mercies of the corporate marketplace, war at the drop of a hat is a good thing, the death penalty is the only way (even if there is exculpatory evidence or other means to protect society), >> < ------is this your assumption of the political platform of the“rabid right� I don’t remember personally advocating for what was in that rant but I’ll forgo the wild accusations and emotional outbursts. <<YET abortion should be banned, you are a terrible unchristian demon.>> I fail to see any Christian love in that line but I will turn the other cheek, although it is difficult to imagine Jesus uttering the same. I’m a little confused on the more supportive of a candidate/party/ideology because he/she advocates for the poor whilst on the other hand also the killing of unborn children. Anywho, I don’t think it lie to say it would be hard to do the Lords work if you’ve been aborted. The following is a short list of activities that I figure are darn near impossibly to participate or accomplish after being aborted. "For the poor will never cease out of the land; therefore I command you, 'You shall open wide your hand to your brother, to the needy and to the poor in the land.'" or The corporal works of mercy consist especially in feeding the hungry, sheltering the homeless, clothing the naked, visiting the sick and imprisoned, and burying the dead (Cf. Matthew 25:31-46). or Among all these, giving alms to the poor is one of the chief witnesses to fraternal charity: it is also a work of justice pleasing to God: (Cf. Tobit 4:5-11; Sirach 17:22; Matthew 6:2-4)
Originally Posted By cmpaley >><<To you, unless you believe that the hungry should be left on the street to starve, that the thirsty should be left parched and dehydrated until they die, that immigrants of all sorts should be oppressed and deported, the naked should be arrested for indecent exposure and forthwith tossed out into the street to freeze, that sick people should be left to die alone if they can't afford insurance, that those in prison should not be visited and ministered to, that working people have absolutely no workplace rights whatsoever and should be left to the tender mercies of the corporate marketplace, war at the drop of a hat is a good thing, the death penalty is the only way (even if there is exculpatory evidence or other means to protect society), >> < ------is this your assumption of the political platform of the“rabid right�<< Damn straight! Considering the mocking rhetoric of the rabid-right wing and statements made by right-wing talk show hosts, as well as the actions of the rabid-right wing Republican Congress, I think that these are the political goals of the rabid-right. Of course, the public face doesn't say these things. These social evils are couched in nice sounding lies like, "rugged individualism," "pulling one's self up by their own bootstraps," or "capitalism." >>I don’t remember personally advocating for what was in that rant but I’ll forgo the wild accusations and emotional outbursts. << You're a rabid-right wing Republican who uses the rhetoric...it's part of you and you don't even know it. Do you believe that, as a nation and a culture that we have a responsibility to: Feed the hungry? The Right says that they need to get a job (of course, let's not mention that there aren't very many good paying jobs out there, are there? Oh, well they should have thought about that and gone to school. By the way, let's reduce school funding and eliminate more worker rights and give massive tax cuts to the rich while cutting services that benefit the poor). Quench the thirst of the thirsty? See above. Welcome the stranger? Uh huh. Like our immigration laws are welcoming to ANYONE. Clothe the naked? See "Feed the hungry" Care for and visit the sick? See "Feed the hungry" Visit those in prison. The Right says that they are sub-human scum that don't deserve to live. Kill them so they can go to hell. Ensure that the rights of working people are protected by law. The Right says, "if you don't like the situation you're in, then get another job, you lazy piece of crap! Go to school, oh, wait, they've cut school funding...never mind. Screw you, anyways." >><<YET abortion should be banned, you are a terrible unchristian demon.>> I fail to see any Christian love in that line but I will turn the other cheek, although it is difficult to imagine Jesus uttering the same.<< Ah, the tactics of a bald-face LIAR. See how you took that out of context? Anyone who is honest would see it. And, do you want to know what Jesus would say? Let's look at Matthew 25:41-43 "41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not." I think my words are rather benign compared to the horrific sentence being passed on those on those who refuse to acknowledge their social responsibility and act accordingly by Christ Himself. >>I’m a little confused on the more supportive of a candidate/party/ideology because he/she advocates for the poor whilst on the other hand also the killing of unborn children.<< Prove that I support an ideology that supports the killing of unborn children. I support ensuring that the poor are tended, the sick and imprisoned are ministered to and that working peoples' rights are defended. The teaching of the Catholic Church involves being pro-life (anti-abortion, anti-euthanasia, anti-unjust wars and anti-death penalty) as well as adovating for the poor. The Republicans, by their actions are only anti-abortion and anti-euthanasia when politically expedient but are pro-war under all circumstances and pro-death penalty (even where there is exculpatory evidence or other alternatives to protect society) BUT they'll cut all kinds of protections and services to the poor, sick and working person at the drop of a hat. You don't see a contractiction there? I sure as hell do! A Christian is truly pro-life and believes that we have a responsibility as a culture and society to the corporal works of mercy. >>Anywho, I don’t think it lie to say it would be hard to do the Lords work if you’ve been aborted.<< On that, we can agree. Your insistence that anyone who disagrees with the Republican party automatically is a pro-abortion Democrat is utter poppycock. >>"For the poor will never cease out of the land; therefore I command you, 'You shall open wide your hand to your brother, to the needy and to the poor in the land.'"<< That's Deuteronomy 15:11. So, let's close our national hadns to the poor so we can open them to the rich by giving the rich tax cuts while cutting services to the poor. And let's not considering alternative solutions that will take the place of those things being cut. >>The corporal works of mercy consist especially in feeding the hungry, sheltering the homeless, clothing the naked, visiting the sick and imprisoned, and burying the dead (Cf. Matthew 25:31-46).<< CCC 2447 All things being cut by Republicans with no equivalent alternative solution to meet those needs. Just hope that charity takes up the slack...Hmmm...I think St. James has some words for you: James 2:15-16 "If a brother or sister is ill-clad and in lack of daily food and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, be warmed and filled," without giving them the things needed for the body, what does it profit?" >>Among all these, giving alms to the poor is one of the chief witnesses to fraternal charity: it is also a work of justice pleasing to God: (Cf. Tobit 4:5-11; Sirach 17:22; Matthew 6:2-4)<< Once again, more stuff cut by Republicans without an alternative other than idle words about charity and expanding the economy and blah blah blah.
Originally Posted By ADMIN <font color="#FF0000">Message removed by an administrator. <a href="MsgBoard-Rules.asp" target="_blank">Click here</a> for the LaughingPlace.com Community Standards.</font>
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>Like our immigration laws are welcoming to ANYONE.<< How are they not welcoming? For those immigrating here legally, I think they're pretty fair.
Originally Posted By cmpaley >>>>Like our immigration laws are welcoming to ANYONE.<< How are they not welcoming? For those immigrating here legally, I think they're pretty fair.<< Um...no. They're race-based and have unbelievably onerous waiting periods (15-20 years in many cases but rarely less than 10), mostly because the agency in charge of providing these services is severely understaffed and underfunded as well as laws that are intentionally written to be as confusing and difficult to follow as possible. This country is certainly guilty of NOT "welcoming the stranger" as a matter of law. But as a culture, we're even worse. Did you know that every single immigrant group has been subjected to horrific treatment by the culture? Ever hear of the term "Mick?" A slur against Irish immigrants. How about "WOP?" A slur against Italian immigrants. I don't even need to go into how terrible the Chinese were treated. The current anti-latino sentiment is a continuation of this cultural anti-immigrant sentiment. In my opinion, it's the sign of an immature and unchristian culture...which gives lie to the right-wing claim that the US is a "Christian nation."
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>Did you know that every single immigrant group has been subjected to horrific treatment by the culture?<< Of course, that's true. But you're talking about how members of society treat some immigrants, not a matter of current policy. And I still say, the reason those wait times are so long is because we have tens of thousands of people coming here illegally every month, in effect, cutting in line, bogging down the system.
Originally Posted By cmpaley >>>>Did you know that every single immigrant group has been subjected to horrific treatment by the culture?<< Of course, that's true. But you're talking about how members of society treat some immigrants, not a matter of current policy.<< I'm talking about both policy issues as well as how we, as a culture, act towards the poor and the stranger. >>And I still say, the reason those wait times are so long is because we have tens of thousands of people coming here illegally every month, in effect, cutting in line, bogging down the system.<< Actually, the numbers were set way low when the current "quota system" came into effect. If illegal immigration were to end today and all the illegal immigrants went home, there would still be a 10-20 year waiting period for all new immigrant applicants.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>If illegal immigration were to end today and all the illegal immigrants went home, there would still be a 10-20 year waiting period for all new immigrant applicants.<< I don't know that that's the case. But even if it is, clearly we're doing SOMETHING right if that many people want to come here. >>how we, as a culture, act towards the poor and the stranger<< I think as a nation, while far from perfect, are pretty generous, especially when compared with many other countries. We have our share of red tape and racists, no argument, and we have room to improve. But overall, I think saying that as a nation we're less than welcoming to immigrants, in a country that is made up almost entirely of immigrants, is a huge stretch.
