Originally Posted By hopemax > One thing though, Alex was already dead...so why would Ben wait? < They introduced the idea that the characters had to be "ready" to move on. Desmond told Hurley Ana Lucia wasn't ready yet. Alex and Danielle probably weren't ready either. And it makes some sense, the Oceanic 815ers shared a common bond so they went together + Desmond/Penny. Ben really was never a true part of that group. It would make sense that he needs to wait and gather his people. We could imagine, that in addition to Alex and Danielle, there might be Others...Tom, Mikhail, Ethan, maybe even Richard etc. I'm actually disappointed that they didn't think they could bring Walt in for the Church scene. Aaron was there as a newborn, even though in real timeline life he was at least 3 and we could assume that Claire & Kate made it back to real timeline life and they lived out a full and happy life. Walt could have showed up as a 18 yr old (Malcolm David Kelly's current age). Rose & Bernard might have given him a look before recognizing him as Walt and welcoming him back into the fold with a hug. It wouldn't even have required dialog. Just maybe another quick set of flashes for the audience sake.
Originally Posted By Labuda I haven't seen teh alternate endings yet, but plan to finish watching that Jimmy Kimmel episode tonight when I get home from work
Originally Posted By velo >>and we could assume that Claire & Kate made it back to real timeline life and they lived out a full and happy life<< see, this is what I'm trying to understand...I wasn't sure that I saw an actual "real timeline" somewhere? Was this season's alternate timeline the real one? Or was it..not? At the end of the episode, when people talk about "leaving" - have they all died (I'm guessing in the original crash, or? That wouldn't account for Penny being there however).
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA After the whole thing is over, I feel slightly manipulated and I'm left disappointed. I have a hard time believing that the creators of this show had this in mind from the beginning. Overall, it began beautifully (the opening show was one of the best openings of any TV show I've ever seen) Unfortunately, it ended with a thud.
Originally Posted By hopemax >I wasn't sure that I saw an actual "real timeline" somewhere? Was this season's alternate timeline the real one? Or was it..not? At the end of the episode, when people talk about "leaving" - have they all died (I'm guessing in the original crash, or? That wouldn't account for Penny being there however).< Surviving the crash on the island, finding the hatch, fighting with the others, some characters getting home, the time travel, characters coming back, the bomb going off, the battle between Jacob/MIB, the light...that was all "real." Sideways world, the stuff we saw this season, was a sort of limbo/purgatory where the characters lived between the moment of their individual deaths and when they were all together again. Shannon, Boone, Sun, Jin, Locke, Sayid, Jack all died on the island. Kate, Claire, Desmond, Penny, Sawyer survived the events on the island to live what we assume was a pretty normal life after that, dieing eventually. We did not see the circumstances of their deaths. Ben and Hurley stayed on the island for some undetermined amount of time. It could have been thousands of years. But at some time each of them died, and their souls, essence whatever you want to call it, went to sideways world, until they were all there. At which point, they all went "into the light" together.
Originally Posted By hopemax DH and I joked that the characters were, "heading into the West." I suspect that happiness with the ending is going to be highly dependent on if you thought the reason Lost became the phenomenon as big as it became because of its characters or its mystery/mythology. DHARMA, polar bears in jungles later to be found in deserts, time travel...The lengths that the producers/writers went to, remember the Lost Experience, the Oceanic and Hanso Foundation commercials inserted into the regular commercial breaks. These are all components leading to a mystery. Even the characters flashbacks seemed more to reveal character mystery details than showing the path to eventual character enlightenment. What did Kate do, how was Locke injured, who was the original Sawyer, who fathered Sun's baby etc. The early seasons also seemed to try hard to have a "TV science" explanation for things. Even as late as last year, with the writers using the Faraday character to explain the framework in which a world where time travel is possible. But then, we introduce the MIB character and suddenly this season, we are in an almost purely spiritual allegorical tale. One in which the characters and their relationships are what matters. Good vs evil, the essence of faith, what happens when you die, etc. I think these ARE interesting concepts, and would make for a compelling story. But my frustration and disappointment is that this not how the show was setup. I feel like I started reading a mystery novel and in the final chapters it became some other type of story. I don't see how I could go back and rewatch season's 1-3 and then look at the finale and see much that would tie the two together. Maybe John Locke's journey since his story has always been about faith. I renew my frustrations on how DHARMA was HUGELY important, until they weren't. How Charles Widmore was HUGELY important until he wasn't. I'm now wondering what Desmond's "sacrifice" that Widmore alluded to when he brought him back to the island. It seemed like it was setting up that Desmond would have to sacrifice the existence of his son to "fix" the timeline. But as it turned out, we are left assuming Hurley found someway to get Desmond home to Penny and his son to live happily, ever after. Which was the only thing he ever wanted. It didn't seem like Desmond was a "failsafe" for anything, Jack figured out the "loophole." I'm happy the characters got to be together in the end...Juliet & Sawyer, Sun & Jin, Charlie & Claire. And as a closure for the MIB/Jacob, protecting the light, I think it was well done. I can be satisfied with the Season 6 arc, and the character resolution. But as an ending for the entireness of the show...nope. If you look at just slivers of the Lost timeline, there is some very, very, very good storytelling. But not as a big picture. I feel like the show was telling us the audience's journey didn't matter. Only the destination. We should be satisfied because the characters were happy and together in the end. The specifics of what happened to the characters ended up not being of any importance, just the simple fact that they experienced them together mattered. Since they had it all planned out from the beginning ;-), the producers/writers should have done a better job of reigning in the fan community that was becoming increasingly obsessive about the mystery elements of the show. Instead, they egged them on, and dropped even more elaborate "hints" into the narrative, prompting even more questions concerning the nature of the island. They could have included gentle reminders that this was first and foremost a character show, not a mystery show.
Originally Posted By velo hmm...that does help, thanks Hopemax! Question: did anyone else see "the numbers" on the wall of the Light Cave as they were lowering Desmond down? My kids could see, and read them, but I just saw a black space with squiggles (lol, I was never good at those hidden picture books either).
Originally Posted By A Happy Haunt these are funny!! <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0ukIQXfC0E" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...kIQXfC0E</a> Ok, Newhart wins!!
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA <I think these ARE interesting concepts, and would make for a compelling story. But my frustration and disappointment is that this not how the show was setup. I feel like I started reading a mystery novel and in the final chapters it became some other type of story.> Very well put, hopemax. That's the manipulation I'm feeling. As for 'how would I end it'? I don't really know. For my entertainment, it became way too complicated, way too important (it lacked much humor), and ultimately too boring. They just talk-talk-talk and then suddenly a musical squeaky violins flourish -- boom! -- black out -- commercial break.
Originally Posted By hopemax So something that may be important to some people. In the US, after the black Lost screen shot, we see the remains of Oceanic 815 on the beach. This has caused the theory that they were dead the entire time. Like this all was just a dream in Jack's head while he was dieing. These shots did not air in Canada, and presumably won't air in the other international versions. Those shots are not part of the narrative of the show. If they were supposed to mean anything, they would make sure they were seen everywhere. It was just a "bookend" shot to fill time normally devoted to a promo. Although, I did read a nice little fan theory... we all wondered what the remnants of DHARMA were, or the broken Eqyptian statue. At some point, in the future, people will arrive on the island and wonder what the heck this wreckage was from, what happened to the people on that plane? Well, we all know the answer.
Originally Posted By DyGDisney What did Widmore want with the island? Why did the psychic tell Claire it would be terrible if anyone else raised Aaron? And the "Help" in the cabin....anyone?
Originally Posted By ecdc Disclaimer: I have not followed Lost closely. My feelings are pretty well in line with Jim's. In fact, the reason I haven't followed Lost too closely is that by the end of the first season I had strong suspicions that the writers were more focused on blowing my mind with shocking twists and turns than they were on telling a dense, compelling narrative. I do think Lost has some great characters, and they do a good job of drawing you in, usually. That said, I was terribly disappointed in the last 15 or so minutes of the show. They abandoned any creativity for this inoffensive, homogenous, one-size fits all, "we're spiritual without being religious" message about life and death. It's this bland, oft-used by Hollywood, attempt to seem "deep" about human existence while appealing to as wide an audience as possible. And for a show that kept so much close to the vest and that you had to watch literally hours and hours of just for the tiniest nugget of information, it was SO heavy-handed, not to mention maudlin. Bleh.
Originally Posted By DyGDisney I was reading a fan site. They said that on the after show last night, Matthew Fox said the whole show was in Jack's mind for a nano-second between when the plane crashed and his death. I guess when Jack stumbled to the place where he died there was a fresh, bloody shoe hanging in the tree, and only ONE set of footprints coming from the crash site they showed --- supposedly being Jack's prints. So maybe they all died in the crash except Jack, who had this whole thing happen in his mind while he was dying.
Originally Posted By Longhorn12 >They abandoned any creativity for this inoffensive, homogenous, one-size fits all, "we're spiritual without being religious" message about life and death< See I don't feel that way... I felt it was overtly christian. The entire time he was in the church with his dad all the items from other religions were screaming at me "LOOK IT'S NOT JUST CHRISTIAN IT'S ALL RELIGIONS KK?" I felt that those items actually enforced the christian feel rather than bringing all religions together. Just my opinion however.
Originally Posted By Labuda "Matthew Fox said the whole show was in Jack's mind for a nano-second between when the plane crashed and his death" Not quite. IIRC, Jimmy Kimmel suggested that, and Matthew Fox admitted that COULD be the cast.
Originally Posted By hopemax I just watched it, and it also seems like Matthew could have been referring to the idea that the trip to sideways world could have been only a nanosecond in terms of real time. And actually, it was a faded shoe in the tree during Jack's death scene. And he was wearing an entirely different wardrobe than he did when the plane crashed. It was a mirroring of the opening scenes in the pilot, but it was not meant to say that it was all in Jack's head at the moment of his death.
Originally Posted By hopemax Review from the NY Times. Sorry in advance if the link breaks, cut and paste... <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/25/arts/television/25lost.html?pagewanted=1&adxnnl=1&adxnnlx=1274733002-6dNE0i84cuxWlQqUH/B7mw" target="_blank">http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05...qUH/B7mw</a> There are two paragraphs that are good summations for how I feel. "Rendered insignificant, in this scenario, were the particulars of what they had done on the island. Pushing buttons, building rafts, blowing up hatches, living, dying — all the churning action and melodrama that made “Lost” so addictive in its early seasons — none of it was directly connected to this final outcome, beyond the fact that it constituted “the most important part” of all their lives." and "As it so often had been, “Lost” was shaky on the big picture — on organizing the welter of mythic-religious-philosophical material it insisted on incorporating into its plot — but highly skilled at the small one, the moment to moment business of telling an exciting story. Which is to say, the picture that actually fit on the television screen."
