Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "Modern traffic engineers are too preoccupied with moving cars instead of moving people." That seems to be the case in Orange County, but not everywhere else as the numerous examples in this thread illustrate. The region is woefully behind when it comes to modern transportation. It's ironic considering how forward thinking Walt Disney was. "I'm just talking about DL's possible responses if the city and state don't come through, which is sadly a distinct possibility for any number of reasons." I hear you Dabob, and I doubt if Disney Co. will pick up the slack (beyond their own interests) because there is no real motivation for it to do so.
Originally Posted By alexbook Sometimes I get the impression that the OCTA would like to get out of the bus business altogether. After all, "real people" (i.e., voters) own cars.
Originally Posted By Mr X I'm obviously very late to the topic, but still in response to Dr Hans Reinhardt (if you're still reading)... ***I've ridden monorails at both US Disney resorts, Seattle, and Vegas (the new system not the WDW hand-me-down).*** I've been on all of them save Seattle (which seems like a rather rickety, old system from what I've seen), and all I can say it, you haven't experienced a decent monorail system and what you have checked out is nothing but sub-par crap. ***Compared to rapid transit systems like BART, light rail, and automated peoplemovers found at airports like JFK and SFO the monorails I've ridden just don't compare for real world purposes.*** Your examples are certainly wonderful compared to sub-par crap. HOWEVER, monorails can and DO provide comparable, even superior service when designed correctly. I definitely live in "real world" Tokyo, and even beyond the excellent Tokyo Disney Resort monorail system there are several others of note. They are clean, quiet, efficient, and a model for mass transit of a (hopeful) future on the move. ***They're nice for amusement parks though, and I'm sure TDL's is fine.*** You need to come to Japan and experience some REAL monorail systems that work wonderfully. NOT just for amusement parks. The one at TDL is more than "fine", it is but one example of excellence. Others which are working just fine in the "real world" here in the Tokyo area include (but are not inclusive to); The Chiba Urban Monorail system (don't let the acronym gross you out...it's a fantastic monorail line which zips around and above the city in near silence, traveling routes that could NEVER be accessed by bus, train, or any other mass transit system due to the small footprint coupled with the excellent elevation potential of such a line around and above and between buildings). <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiba_Urban_Monorail" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...Monorail</a> Another monorail system of note is the Haneda Airport Monorail in Tokyo, one of the busiest Monorail systems in the world ferrying more than a quarter of a million passengers per day on weekdays. <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokyo_Monorail" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T...Monorail</a> And going beyond Tokyo we can also find a very useful and successful Monorail line in Okinawa, opened very recently just seven years ago and now serving as the ONLY rapid transit rail line for the island. <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okinawa_Monorail" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O...Monorail</a> +++Still, there is something about monorails that seems more hype than substance.+++ I hope that my comments and links above have indicated otherwise. I'm a big fan of monorail technology, in particular it is VERY advantageous in modern city environments for it's whisper quiet passage through busy places, it's relatively small footprint both physically and environmentally, and ALSO cause it's so freakin cool (Walt Disney thought so, and so do I!)!
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt Thanks for the post X. Just to be clear, I'm not against monorails, and like I said, *I* have never experienced a monorail that seemed to match all the hype. That isn't to say that such a system doesn't exist. Still, I have to wonder if monorail systems have the potential to be so fantastic, why aren't there more of them in use?
Originally Posted By FerretAfros "I've been on all of them save Seattle (which seems like a rather rickety, old system from what I've seen)..." I was on that one in the fall, and rickety and old only begin to describe it. It was just not a terribly pleasant experience at all. Add in that it really doesn't go anywhere (the entire track is about a mile), and it's really just a weird experience. "...don't let the acronym gross you out..." Too late.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "...don't let the acronym gross you out..." Not only that, it only travels 15 km (or 9 miles) - hardly an example of the kind of mass transit needed in OC. For comparison the WDW Monorail system travels roughly 14 miles. The Tokyo and Osaka monorails are better examples of real urban transportation systems with some teeth.
Originally Posted By believe The Seattle Monorail might be a bad example for today. It was built almost 50 years ago, and have probably NEVER been upgraded. I think it was built as part of some Pacific Expo type of thing. So if you think about it, considering it's 50 years old with no upgrades, it's a pretty darn good system.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< "...don't let the acronym gross you out..." [Chiba Monorail] Not only that, it only travels 15 km (or 9 miles) - hardly an example of the kind of mass transit needed in OC. >>> But, it might be an excellent example of what Anaheim needs. The city of Chiba is a medium-size urban city that's part of the greater Tokyo area. It's monorail serves only as transport within the downtown urban area of the city - connections to other areas further afield or back toward Tokyo itself are handled by connections to regional rail. So, Anaheim might be a near-perfect comparison: imagine a system that stopped near the Esplanade, DTD/DLH, Toy Story parking (or a potential third gate), Mickey and Friends, the Convention Center, a potential additional parking structure somewhere, as well as the regional bus and train hubs. The single system could be used by park guests getting to/from their cars in the parking lot, park hopping to the third gate if it ever gets built, resort guests coming into the area via longer-range bus or rail, Disney CM's and local hotel employees doing the same, and people going to the Convention Center.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt Yes, that would probably work. Still, it seems strange to me that if I fly to SNA from the Bay Area there's no rail transport directly to DLR. Usually I take a cab. Given the millions of people that traverse that route daily you'd think there would be an alternative to what's available now.
Originally Posted By CuriouserConstance You boys and your fascination with cars, trucks, trains, buses, monorails,....
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt Beats talking about princesses, mermaids, and fairies. I really think Disney is missing the boat by not appealing more to males. When you think about it when it opened Disneyland had far more things that might appeal to guys than it does today. So much of it is overly cute and precious now.
Originally Posted By oc_dean >>On another note I did meet Darkbeer at that public meeting, haha. Nice guy. You wouldn't know from meeting him that he's a right winger << OMG :O) LOL His criticisms of the Democrats get to me in World Events ... but aside from his politics ... he is the COOLEST guy you could meet, as I have gotten together with him myself .. including a Knott's Halloween Haunt where we had a blast!
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>Beats talking about princesses, mermaids, and fairies. I really think Disney is missing the boat by not appealing more to males. When you think about it when it opened Disneyland had far more things that might appeal to guys than it does today. So much of it is overly cute and precious now.<<< Sadly so. Disney used to be very adventurous and cool. Most of what they have made in the last 10 years is pretty fey and yawn producing.
Originally Posted By oc_dean With all the back and forth going on for what's best for Anaheim and the DLR .... Is everybody in agreement that whatever they do exactly needs to have it's own dedicated path? (IE - away from the current set of busy surface streets, and be elevated.) If anybody thinks plotting something in with the rest of all the cars, busses, hotel shuttles, taxis, pedestrian traffic, etc, etc, etc. .... I think your heads need to be examined. ;~)
Originally Posted By CuriouserConstance "especially since males are more important" lol Seriously though, you're right Dr Hans, they should do more to appeal to guys. Like for example, they should do some kind of meet and greet where you could get up close and personal with characters dressed up as hammers, screwdrivers, nail guns, etc. Oh! And they could have Mickey and Goofy do some cage fighting against each other, with some flesh pounding live action! And to top it off they could have Minnie and Daisy walk around the park scantily clad in thongs bathing suits and lingerie.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros All they need to do is to finally set up a Jessica Rabbit meet and greet, and we will be set. I don't think there's anything else we could ask for, really.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "Is everybody in agreement that whatever they do exactly needs to have it's own dedicated path? (IE - away from the current set of busy surface streets, and be elevated.)" No. It hasn't been proven that it must be elevated to do what is needed. The point is that good rapid transit reduces the need for vehicular traffic and thus reduces it. If some sort of efficient and cost effective transit can be built that runs down the center of a wide avenue why not build it?
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "All they need to do is to finally set up a Jessica Rabbit meet and greet, and we will be set. I don't think there's anything else we could ask for, really." Actually, all they would have to do is give Tomorrowland some balls like it once had and it would be fine. With the exception of Space Mountain, the incredibly dull Innnoventions and maybe Star Tours it's mostly for kids now.
