Originally Posted By gadzuux That ignores who those people are. For people who come to the park frequently, or even obsessively, the idea of a three hour line might be more agreeable than to the guests who are infrequent visitors. Their priorities are totally different. So you end up with a three-plus hour line of mostly APers - at least for the first several months.
Originally Posted By PJ82858 Most of the people that I have talked to(non APers) say that they will wait until after the Summer and ride opening rush to even try to go on it, so I am in agreement that the lines will be mostly APers for the first several months. That's OK with this APer!!
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "But the point is, if no one thinks it is worth it, the line will NOT be long." All lines are not created equal. It doesn't matter if the line is long or not. The Sub's capacity dictates that it will be slow moving either way. From what I recall, waits were often up to an hour in the late 70's even when the line was contained within the switchbacks under the Monorail Station.
Originally Posted By monorailblue gadzuux: It doesn't ignore anything. Lines are just mini free markets. Do you possibly think it would be better to have AP-only days and non-AP-only days? Then you would never have a mixed line. Maybe AP's and non-AP's should have separate lines? People are never offended that a great ride, operating normally, has a long line--indeed, they expect it!. They might determine that they don't want to wait for it, but that's just an economic judgment. Now if they see something abnormal (like 4 subs in storage) which appears to be causing the line, you've got a different situation.
Originally Posted By dresswhites for me a long line at a new attraction is exciting. it build the suspense for what your going to see. i remember when star tours, splash and indy opened. the line stretched all over the place. it was fun to see. even rocket rods had a very long line. that started to drop when people started hearing that it wasn't a great ride.
Originally Posted By monorailblue ^^ And seeing it constantly breaking down. And seeing it literally fall apart, sometimes in flames. And seeing that it really didn't look exciting or interesting. And hating it so, so, so deeply.
Originally Posted By gadzuux >> People are never offended that a great ride, operating normally, has a long line--indeed, they expect it!. << They may expect a long line, but they don't expect that DLs latest and greatest e-ticket will only have a max capacity of 950 pph - optimal. The average joe may not know the specifics about capacity issues, but he'll have a good long time to consider what the problems might be when he's standing in line for hours on end. >> i remember when star tours, splash and indy opened. the line stretched all over the place. << Each of those attractions has an hourly capacity of over 1300 pph. If even one sub out of the fleet of eight is `101', capacity drops to about 800 pph. At what point does 'low capacity' reach 'unacceptable capacity'? This idea that the queue will somehow self-stabilize in relation to the perceived value of the attraction is overly simple. Some people are more willing to devote the time and stamina required to ride the attraction. This doesn't make them heroes any more than people who are unwilling or unable to suffer the queue. Assuming the line goes beyond three hours, this includes virtually all children under the age of perhaps ten or twelve - nemo's target audience. There are plenty of people who want to wave off the concerns about the ultra-low capacity issues and say "no big deal", and that all disney rides get long lines at opening. I'm saying this one is significantly different, and will create a significantly bigger problem.
Originally Posted By berol The ones that remember the old ride will expect long, slow lines. I don't know how many, but I bet it's a significant chunk. If this is the worst problem disneyland has, they're doing pretty well.
Originally Posted By monorailblue It isn't different, and it isn't a crisis. Or even a problem at all. IMHO.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt No, it's hardly a crisis, as long waits at DL are hardly anything new. However, long waits have been noted as Disney's number one complaint, which led to the creation of Fastpass. Management percieves it as a problem. Given that the Subs are one of the most notoriously inefficient major attractions in the park in terms of capacity, consider yourself forewarned.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan One positive is that at least after this wait, the subs will be more than a 3 minute experience.
Originally Posted By dresswhites some people will pass up the subs because of the lines. for years my family avoided star tours because the lines were always so long when it opened. we waited until 1996 to experience Indy because the lines were so long in 95. even in 96 the line stretched all through Adventureland, parts of frontierland. they used to have guest control agents working the lines. for years Pirates routinely had over 1 hour line.(it does again) splash on a busy summer day is a two hour wait. People expect lines at disneyland. some people may be annoyed by the line, but the majority will expect and prepare for it.
Originally Posted By spacejockey Does anyone know if the subs will be included in the early mornig enrty for Disney hotel guests?
Originally Posted By Darkbeer ^More than likely yes, but NOT on Monday, June 11th, due to the Press Event. More than likely the ride won't open until Noon for guests that day.
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA I remember the subs being very cramped and claustrophic -- with that little tiny air vent pushing out a stream of recycled air. [*cough* *gasp*] It freaks me out, and will probably keep me from riding. Also, everytime I think of the subs, I can smell gasoline. Did they use gasoline to power them back in the good ol' days? Or is that just a post-heroin flashback?
