Originally Posted By utahjosh I think it would be a terrible idea to lose an honor code because a few of the football team members fight and act like pathetic imbeciles. They are a tiny portion of the 30,000 yearly students at the school. (Although I think the honor code is not perfect, I really like most of it.)
Originally Posted By Dabob2 "It does accept non-mormon students, but they must abide by the "honor code" as well." I would think that a gay student would be able to challenge that honor code as being discriminatory. Especially if they were legally married. And would probably win.
Originally Posted By ecdc <a target="blank" rel="nofollow" href="http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/2108746-155/we-all-can-be-more-civil">http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyl...re-civil</a> This is an interesting article on the church's press conference for a lot of different reasons, but one that stood out is this: >>The church doesn't "seek apologies," he [Apostle Oaks] said, "and we don't give them."<< That's a shockingly arrogant attitude. Jesus asks for forgiveness for the men who nailed him to the cross. But the Mormon church apologize for: 1) Advocating physical violence against gays, 2) Saying homosexuality is the sin next to murder, 3) Saying it would be better to be dead than gay, 4) Dozens gay Mormon youth suicides. Nah, Mormonism has nuthin' to apologize for. It's a stunningly petty attitude. Saying sorry is an easy act, full of healing and good will. Make a mistake and apologize. Simple, and we all do it. But not the Mormon church. They. Don't. Apologize.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder Well, unsurprisingly, the "honor code" and this latest proclamation just proves yet again Mormons are a bunch of hypocrites.
Originally Posted By utahjosh It's true. Of course, every person who's ever said they want to live up to a certain standard and failed is a hypocrite. Which means pretty much everyone is.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt Who cares what the LDS Church says. Let legislators legislate based on what's fair and proper for every citizen without the influence of religious entities. No one should give two squirts of pee about the LDS Church and the opinion of its "apostles" when it comes to the civil rights of individuals.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer They see that gay marriage will be legal in all 50 states by the end of the year and they are trying to avoid looking as bad as they did on gay marriage as they did on race issues up until 1978.
Originally Posted By utahjosh It's not about avoiding looking bad. Our doctrine is still such that sex outside of a Man and Wife is sin. We'll never change that, no matter how bad it looks to some. It's about protecting our religious rights, and speaking out for fairness to all.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>It's about protecting our religious rights, and speaking out for fairness to all.<< Which is defined as Mormons still being allowed to discriminate in housing and against gays.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt How about they apologize for the terrible thing they did by encouraging their members to contribute financially to Proposition 8, the passing of which overturned same-sex marriage rights in California? Maybe this is the church's roundabout way of finally admitting defeat on this issue.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>How about they apologize for the terrible thing<< They don't apologize. Repentance or asking forgiveness isn't really big in the Mormon culture.
Originally Posted By oc_dean Heck, it's fine with me the Mormon church is this adamant about their rules. As time marches on, the contrast between their world and the REAL world most people live in, becomes more painfully obvious. More people will begin to question the very existence and relevancy that church has in the real world.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "More people will begin to question the very existence and relevancy that church has in the real world." As religious organizations go I think this comment applies to Catholics far more than it does to Mormons. Outside of Utah they are completely irrelevant. That's why no one should care about their "progress" on this matter.
Originally Posted By utahjosh The LDS church is small. It's very relevant to people to whom it matters and not to people who don't care. Funny how that word means what it means.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt The LDS Church didn't act "small" when its members contributed to the dismantling of gay marriage rights in California to the tune of $5 million (not to mention the nearly $200,000 in contributions made by the church that it admitted to lying about).
Originally Posted By oc_dean If the Mormon's knew the word of god ... as they think and say they do .. then they would have been ~divinely inspired~ to give that money to the poor and the needy. Not on a campaign to strip a minority of the right to marry. Hans .... I know there's a been a lot of reporting of figures since prop 8 .... I thought the Mormons, Baptists, and some other Christian denominations put into the tune of 22 million or more?
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt Dean, I was wrong about the $5 million. According to this article LDS Church members contributed approximately $20 MILLION to the Yes on 8 campaign. <a target="blank" rel="nofollow" href="http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/04/prop-8-mormons-gay-marriage-shift">http://www.motherjones.com/pol...ge-shift</a> >>In the five years since the LDS church sent busloads of the faithful to California to canvass neighborhoods, and contributed more than $20 million via its members to support the initiative, it has all but dropped the rope in the public policy tug of war over marriage equality.<< And there's this HP article that published the following year that claims church members gave $25 million to the campaign. <a target="blank" rel="nofollow" href="http://www.huffingtonpost.com/fred-karger/mormongate----the-churchs_b_163016.html">http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...016.html</a> As the Mother Jones article states, the only reason they're trying to be nice and back away from the gay rights issue is because of the backlash from their members and the public.
Originally Posted By EdisYoda Back to the BYU Code of Honor, I would be interested to know if the University of Notre Dame has something similar.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer Josh, up until 1978 it was doctrine that people with black skin bore the mark of Cain and couldn't be fully participating members of the LDS. Up until 1904 the LDS recognized marriage as existing between a man and any number of women. Doctrines change.
Originally Posted By utahjosh TomSawyer, of course I am familiar with both of those changes in policy. They are not really comparable to a change in what the Law of Chastity is and means.
