(Lots) of Room(s) at the Inn(s) ...

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<IMHO, "Religion" is not evil. Men and women who ABUSE people in the name of faith to gain power is evil.>>

But see, people can -- and are -- quite evil. And religion is the tool that has been used since the beginning of time to control and persecute people.

More human beings have been killed in the name of 'My God's better than your God' than anything else.

Sorry, but that makes it evil in my book.

You can believe in God. You can be a moral person and have a belief system. But when it becomes organized, it envariably leads to bad things.

When it becomes part of the government, then you know it's time to either change that government or run for the hills.

<<That is just as immoral and lying, cheating, stealing, muder, etc. The Ten Commandments had it right. And yes, we do need a savior.>>

People can be saviors. You don't have to be all-powerful to make huge differences in the lives of hundreds of millions.

Religion is, in this country, used as either a crutch or an excuse to discriminate. If I see someone ask another 'what would Jesus do question' I'll shoot my TV!

It's also so easy for 'believers' to treat others as less than ... after all, they probably had it coming.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<You know only Spirit can start a thread like this. Here's his initial post.>>

>>> Disney has a large marketing campaign here in Florida print for discounted rooms from 1/1-2/13 for residents. The same discounts are being offered to APers.

The rooms are $49 at values, $99 at mods and $149 at Saratoga Springs, with other deluxes available at various rates (I think WL is going for $199).

This is a usual time for discounting, although starting on New Year's Day is a bit early considering the World celebrates Christmas thru 1/6 or 1/7.

And those rates are awfully low, except for the mods ...

So do you guys think this is a reflection in the softness in bookings due to the GREAT economic conditions in the USA or do you think this is just typical?

I'm not real sure myself ... and my sources on booking levels has already gone on extended Turkey Week vacation.

Thoughts ...<<<

<<It has managed to morph into a politcal, religious, and philosophical debate. Man, and some people would call this a mere forum of Disney Geeks! If we all had a video camera hooked up to our computer I think we might be able to unseat Bill O'riely from that number 1 slot of cable news commentator. Maybe even unseat Rush Limbaugh as the #1 talk radio program. If nothing else it certainly is never dull, and always entertaing over here at LaughingPlace.com.>>

Yes. But you'll also realize I stayed out of this derailing until recently.

I just am so tired of hearing the monies right-wingers in this country basically blame the poor for their lot in life. I feel it is sickening and, well, un-American.

 

Originally Posted By DouglasDubh

<I just am so tired of hearing the monies right-wingers in this country basically blame the poor for their lot in life. I feel it is sickening and, well, un-American.>

I'm tired of the left-wingers blaming the rich for the poor's lot in life. I feel it is sickening and, well, un-American

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

^^I'm no left-winger. I'm a realist.

I have a brain and can see reality through ideological blather from both sides of our screwed up political spectrum.

It's very common sense that those with wealth want to keep as much of it as possible, grow it even greater, and very few feel any compunction to help those less fortunate instead believing that either 'they got what they had coming for their poor choices' or worse 'it's God's will' ... and I guess I wouldn't have such a problem with this if we weren't throwing away billions of dollars a day, money that could help Americans in all sorts of ways, in an illegal war in Iraq to get 'the evildoers' (gotta love when Bush digs back to the Middle Ages for his words.)

Nah, on second thought, I'd still have a problem.

We all share the planet. Eventually, even the wealthy will suffer greatly by creating a hopeless underclass ... if you look in our prisons, you might even say that time has already come.

 

Originally Posted By DouglasDubh

<I'm no left-winger. I'm a realist.>

Who continually spouts left-wing rhetoric.

 

Originally Posted By mstaft

Spirit, every group of people that organize in some manner has fringe and evil elements. Overall, religious groups are no more good or evil than any other group- be it right or left leaning. Remember, most hospital were started by faith based organizations, too. As long as human nature exists as it is, there will be both evil and good in the world.

PS- I think that more humans are aborted every year than are/were killed in the name of religion. But of course, it is politcally correct to allow this activity, and quite the fad to bash religious organizations. We humans are a complex mix, aren't we?

 

Originally Posted By kennect

Spirit, Like you, organized religion scares me to no end and yet I consider myself a christian...

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<I'm no left-winger. I'm a realist.>

<<Who continually spouts left-wing rhetoric. >>

No rhetoric from me, just common sense, just what I see happening and am not bound by any party affiliation or blind 'faith' to ignore.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<PS- I think that more humans are aborted every year than are/were killed in the name of religion.>>

I doubt the number is even close.

But, of course, there is a difference. One group are already alive, living, breathing, feeling life forms ... the other aren't.

Only when religion enters the equation does the fetus become a human life.

<<But of course, it is politcally correct to allow this activity, and quite the fad to bash religious organizations. We humans are a complex mix, aren't we?>>

Yes, we are.

And while I personally find abortion abhorrent and feel there are far, far too many, I would NEVER restrict a woman's right to have one.

It isn't my place, my government's place or your church's place. And let's be blunt, this whole push to reverse Roe v. Wade is all coming from the church. Again, attempting to place its value system on people who don't care to believe in them. And, sorry, but our country isn't 'well, you have the freedom to worship as you see fit, but we're a Christian nation and we're going to go by extreme right Christian values to determine the laws of this country that you have to live by.'

And since so many children go unwanted once they are here, I'd love it if the religious right focused on those instead of worrying so much about fetuses.

Of course there wouldn't be so many abortions if the zealots would allow birth control to be given out in schools withOUT parents permission (because if a kid wants sex, they'll have it whether mommy and daddy and Jesus approve or not), and if sex ed was taught instead of having abstinence (again pushing church morality on the masses) shoved down kids throats.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<Spirit, Like you, organized religion scares me to no end and yet I consider myself a christian...>>

That's perfectly inline with what I am saying, ken.

I never said I was against religion or any concept of a higher power ... I am quite spiritual.

But no one is ever going to convince me that the world wouldn't be a better place if ALL organized religions simply disappeared.

We'd be better to worship at the alter of the Mouse!

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

I totally apologize ... for all the horrendous spelling and grammar boo-boos in the last few posts.

I shouldn't be posting at 3 a.m. on cold medicine ... no more!

 

Originally Posted By davewasbaloo

>>><<PS- I think that more humans are aborted every year than are/were killed in the name of religion.>>

I doubt the number is even close.<<<

Even if it was, one could argue that abortion could be a lesser evil than an unloved baby be born into an uncaring family or a family where they are abused, cannot be aforded, or where there is a massive disability that in a country without social medicine would bankrupt them.

Should abortion be a solid answer to contraception? No. But is it an answer to try to stem further depravation - yes, absolutely.

 

Originally Posted By davewasbaloo

>>>>Of course there wouldn't be so many abortions if the zealots would allow birth control to be given out in schools withOUT parents permission (because if a kid wants sex, they'll have it whether mommy and daddy and Jesus approve or not), and if sex ed was taught instead of having abstinence (again pushing church morality on the masses) shoved down kids throats.<<<

right on, here in the UK contraception is available to all for free, and no questions asked - condoms, the pill, even my wife's coil. And guess what, we have less abortions and teenage pregnancies than in the US.

 

Originally Posted By DouglasDubh

<No rhetoric from me, just common sense, just what I see happening and am not bound by any party affiliation or blind 'faith' to ignore.>

That's what a liberal would think.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<That's what a liberal would think.>>

At least a liberal would think!

(BTW, I don't label myself a 'liberal' but that was just too easy a lay-up to not take!)

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<right on, here in the UK contraception is available to all for free, and no questions asked - condoms, the pill, even my wife's coil. And guess what, we have less abortions and teenage pregnancies than in the US.>>

Yeah, Dave, but in the UK you don't have a government run by religious fundamentalists.

Funny how we're so hyprocritical that we have a problem with fundamenalist Muslim governments who commit all sorts of terrible things from discrimination to human rights violations to mass murder in the name of God, but when we do the same it's because we're a righteous people.

See, that's the problem of playing 'my religion's better than your religion.'

It's not. They all suck.

I think even Jesus would agree.

 

Originally Posted By DouglasDubh

<I don't label myself a 'liberal'>

Lots of liberals don't. They're delusion in that way, as well as others.

 

Originally Posted By mrkthompsn

I'm starting to agree with my pastor when he says "I'm not religious. I'm only saved".

More things that I believe:
~ Evolution does in fact exist, has always existed, and is one of God's most ingenious mechanisms post-creation.
~ The separation between government and religion should be a billion miles thick.
~ There is no separation of our Lord & Creator and State according to the US Constitution, Bill of Rights and Declaration of Independence.
~ Global Warming does slightly exist.
~ It's 99.999999% natural causes.
~ When viewed from an airplane, SUVs look just as much like ants as hybrid cars do.
~ Nobody has ever gotten a job from a poor person.
~ More than 80% of American millionaires wear jeans, a cowboy hat, drive a Ford F-150, and prefer Budweiser over scotch.
~ More than 80% of people who live in gated communities with houses above 7,000 square feet aren't rich, but are in debt and living far beyond their means.
~ Straight people and gay people commit an equal amount of sin, none more than the other.
~ Straight people and gay people each equally have a civil right to live peacefully in any manner they choose, as long as they don't inhibit the equal rights of others.
~ Marjiuana and hemp are natural.
~ So is molten lava and uranium.
~ Laughingplace.com rules.

 

Originally Posted By mrkthompsn

<<>None of the amendments have added rights.
Not even those first 10 that were added in 1791?>>

I get what Hopemax is saying

I amend my statement to replace "1787" with "1791"; the execution of the Bill of Rights, in the year of our Lord 1791.