Originally Posted By leemac <<E-Productions doesn't exactly handle all entertainment...it's a little confusing (Lee? Lee?), but from what I understand they handle the more day to day stuff. So, OLC (or, for the big shows, WDAJ?) comes up with the concept and provides the producers and all that...E-Pro handles the logistics. So, obviously, E-Pro is very concerned with the cost angle of things.>> All of the big projects are handled by WDI-Creative Entertainment - in particular the portfolio creative director and producer shepherd those projects through development. There is also a WDAJ-Entertainment team based at TDR and they are there to partner with OLC on the local entertainment front and help liaise with WDI-CE. Ultimately the local entertainment is a partnership - it is important to get consistency of product whilst also affording the local team with the opportunity to create projects themselves. Watarumi-san was the OLC managing producer for entertainment for a long time - he recently left the company. He was responsible for shows like Over the Waves, Big Band Beat, Minnie O Minnie and One Man's Dream II.
Originally Posted By leemac <<That's what I was trying to explain in post 13...it's not that OLC didn't "put it on", it's just that you've got this subsidiary in the mix as well, and as some have noted the entertainment seems to have gone downhill since they went online.>> X - I don't think there is any correlation between life before and after E-Productions. OLC has always had a very complex corporate structure (which is typical of Japanese conglomerates - there are tax and accounting benefits to this) and just because they ring-fenced the local entertainment producers into one dedicated subsidiary doesn't change anything.
Originally Posted By Malin <<< Watarumi-san was the OLC managing producer for entertainment for a long time - he recently left the company. He was responsible for shows like Over the Waves, Big Band Beat, Minnie O Minnie and One Man's Dream II. >>> I don't know if to be happy by this news or not. From the shows he was responsible for it appears his tracked record was a bit hit or miss. But I'm sure more people within the company share his vision for TDR shows and entertainment!
Originally Posted By X-san ***X - I don't think there is any correlation between life before and after E-Productions.*** I can't really say for sure about the quality of entertainment, but I can definitely say that the relationships between the booking staff and their talent has changed incredibly...for the worse, sad to say. TDL used to be the gig I always recommended to ANY performer, but after the past 5 years or so I absolutely can not. Whether or not that will someday translate into a noticeable drop in performance quality is debatable, of course.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>I was just in Walt Disney World for nine days. I would say, compared to Anaheim and Tokyo, that the Orlando resort has the least heart, and therefore anything it does will feel less successful. <<< Amen, please tell the folks on the WDW board. They are so star struck because of the ditances they cover that they are blind to this. I am just glad I am not alone in this because it feels like it.
Originally Posted By X-san Actually, and with NO implications towards your visit Dave or anyone elses, I personally had a wonderful time at WDW late last year. Maybe I just missed the boat on noticing the crappy stuff, but I had a great time and found the resort to be just as friendly and expansive and fun as ever. I find that the place has a lot of "heart" too, and that (of course) has a lot to do with the employees...I encountered many great ones in my travels. I hope I'm not particularly "star struck", in the sense that my comments become invalid (I did live there for a time, actually got SICK of the place after a while, and also worked there...but returning after many years of absence I didn't find things to be significantly "worse" whatsoever, though certainly "changed"...the great vibe of WDW was alive and well for me though anyway). And I certainly don't mean to dismiss your legitimate complaints about the place, Dave, because obviously every experience is personal and just because I was fortunate enough to have a great week with no hiccups doesn't mean it applies to anyone else... But in any case, I had a great time, quite recently...and I have to wonder if SOME of the negatives being offered by folks just might have to do with the rose colored glasses just being fitted on the face a little too tight...so tightly that they actually FELL OFF (just a theory), to reveal the reality of ALL Disney parks, just maybe. Since I've pretty much spent my life in them for the past 12 years, off and on (talking daily here), I start to appreciate what is real "bad quality" and what might just be customer expectations getting ahead of what has EVER been true. I've talked extensively to CM's from 3 different resorts about the "good old days" and every one of them talks about how badly "Orlando"/"Anaheim"/"Tokyo" sucks now compared to when the company "actually cared". The true answer is that the company *never* really "cared". At least not in modern history. It's just the ebb and flow of a corporate behemoth going for "cheap" sometimes and then more for "quality experience" sometimes, and sometimes a bit of both. HOWEVER, I thought the quality and friendliness was just fine in Orlando last year (Christmastime), and in fact I was pretty darned impressed with how nicely all of the cast members treated us , not just "as customers", but many of them were super nice to us and VERY friendly and talkative and "where are you from?" "are you having a good time?" in the grand old Disney tradition...at least that was my experience. Heck, one of my most memorable moments was when I was sitting outside the Monsters thing in Tomorrowland waiting for my family to exit and a CM came up to me (really, found me and walked right up!) and said "you look sad". I was like "no, not sad. just bored." lol. And we chatted for a bit til the ride got out and he then met my wife and daughter. Seriously, how cool is THAT!? Where else can you find an employee that would walk up to some person just sitting around, and engage them in conversation (just to "make sure" that person was having a good time, sitting there on a bench in the magic kingdom)? I would say with a reasonable degree of certainty that that would NEVER happen in Tokyo Disneyland. I thought it was pretty cool, and that particular example of great customer service (heck, it was really beyond that...just straight-up Disney friendliness) was not the only nice experience I had during the week by a long shot. In fact, I could tell 10 comparable stories from that week (I guess it was a good week lol), but I don't want to bore anyone. But, everyone's millage may vary, right? I certainly don't mean for this post to discredit or diminish any negatives people have experienced, because I ALWAYS hold Disney up to these kind of expectations and when they are NOT met, Disney loses dollars from me (I didn't visit Anaheim for a LONG TIME, for example, back in the days when, let's face it, Disneyland totally sucked. I didn't reward them ONE PENNY of my money, and in fact visited SoCal a couple of times while skipping Disneyland (why would I go, when the place was in disarray as it was back then right?).
Originally Posted By Malin <<< I was just in Walt Disney World for nine days. I would say, compared to Anaheim and Tokyo, that the Orlando resort has the least heart, and therefore anything it does will feel less successful. >>> Do you care to open up on this a bit, as I'd be interested to know exactly it is about WDW that makes you feel it has less heart. <<< Amen, please tell the folks on the WDW board. They are so star struck because of the ditances they cover that they are blind to this. I am just glad I am not alone in this because it feels like it. >>> WDW will always have its supporters no matter what it does. You only have to look at the recent news about Pleasure Island to know in some people's eye's it can not do anything wrong, but on the other side there are the people who think WDW can't do anything right. I'd personally like to see more debates where the criticism was a bit more fair and balanced.
Originally Posted By The Goddess Mara I'll preface my remarks by stating that I always stay on property in Disney hotels (or, in the case of Tokyo, sometimes at the Hilton Tokyo Bay--which is pretty much the same thing since it's on the monorail line). One of the reasons I prefer both Anaheim and Tokyo is because of ease of access between the hotels, parks, and shopping. In Anaheim, you can walk everywhere in just a few minutes. In Tokyo the Resort Liner transports you anywhere within just a few minutes. In Orlando, unless you are staying on a monorail hotel, it's a pain in the ass to get almost everywhere because of the buses and boats. After days of that you really get sick of it. And, while I love Epcot, it's too damn big! The cheap bastards who run the place really need to provide some sort of transportation from front to back because it's an enormously long walk. I didn't mind it when I was 20 or 30, but at age 50 I resent the lack of transportation. And I love Animal Kingdom, but that place is an inferno. It is by far the hottest Disney park on the planet and it's also too damn big to have no transportation around the park. What would Walt do? This one's not hard to figure out. Look at the template: Disneyland. It has a train running around the perimeter with stops. Every non Magic Kingdom park with the exception of Tokyo DisneySea (all built after Walt's death) lacks a form of parkwide transportation. With some parks, like those in Tokyo and California Adventure, and Disney's Hollywood Studios in Orlando, the parks are not so big that you are walking miles from back to front, so it's not a problem. But the other parks ... MY FEET ACHE. And it's hot and humid in Orlando for a lot of the year. While it's deadly hot and humid in Tokyo in July and August, the rest of the year isn't so hot. And it's cold in the winter--had my first winter experience in Tokyo this past February. Damn cold with the wind coming off the bay. But the park was packed! I would rather be cold, where I can bundle up, than hot, where I can never cool off outside. You really have to wonder if Walt was down in Orlando in the summer months before he made his decision. I guess he was, but I can't imagine what the hell he was thinking. He wanted to build a city, not a theme park--yes? My opinion is that Orlando is just too physically uncomfortable to really relax in. Tokyo and Anaheim are exactly the opposite. (I've avoided Disneyland Paris here because while I've visited it, having never stayed on site it was an entirely different experience because we would train in from Paris on random days.) I could continue, of course, but that's good for a start.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< And I love Animal Kingdom, but that place is an inferno. It is by far the hottest Disney park on the planet >>> You obviously have not been to HKDL in August or September!
Originally Posted By The Goddess Mara No, I visited Hong Kong Disneyland in late October or early November and it was plenty hot, thank you! At Animal Kingdom last week (or the week before) it was 95 degrees and about 89% humidity, with no breeze at all. Just deadly.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>Actually, and with NO implications towards your visit Dave or anyone elses, I personally had a wonderful time at WDW late last year.<<< Yes, but you did not stay on site - I think that can make a huge difference. In and out, not as noticable. Immersed, more likely to see the problems. And to be fair, with the exception of the MK, most of our problems were transport, hotel, DTD related.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>Where else can you find an employee that would walk up to some person just sitting around, and engage them in conversation (just to "make sure" that person was having a good time, sitting there on a bench in the magic kingdom)? << Disneyland!
Originally Posted By Malin <<< In Orlando, unless you are staying on a monorail hotel, it's a pain in the ass to get almost everywhere because of the buses and boats. After days of that you really get sick of it. >>> I can apreciate you not liking the sheer size and scope of the Resort but I fail to see why this lacks any heart. Not being able to walk around Epcot is more of a design issue than it lacking any heart. To me lacking any heart is entering TDL and walking though that poor mans Main Street which lacks any kind of atsmophere. I'm not saying you don't have a point but I think you gave out a bad example for why WDW lacks any kind of heart.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 ^^I would agree with that. The weather in Central Florida can be miserable in summer, and it usually is. But overall? Spring and fall are damn near perfect, especially late spring. Winter can also be beautiful and 80, but also 50 and bitter cold. I can't fault Disney for that. I've been fortunate and always had perfect weather in Paris. But in Anaheim I've had hellish heat, and they lack the shade you get in Florida (although the MK VP has been on a tree removal binge the past 4-5 years!) As for walking, that too may be a resonable criticism (or not), but that doesn't relate to heart and quality. EPCOT once had buses that circulated around the lagoon, but they were lawyered away. They also still have the Friendship launches to take you from one side of the lagoon to the other. I guess what I'm saying is what you've listed may affect your enjoyment of a visit, but they certainly don't equate to a lesser experience at WDW. Weather and walking just aren't really Disney's responsibility.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< Weather and walking just aren't really Disney's responsibility. >>> Hmmm... Spirit, I normally agree with what you say, but I've got to disagree on this point. It's not as if the weather conditions in Florida are the result of some freak storm that appeared out of nowhere - they are ongoing patterns that should be dealt with in the design of the parks. Maybe they are to the extent they can, but to argue that Disney doesn't cause the weather so it's not Disney's responsibility is passing the buck. Also, regarding the walking at Ecpot, I personally don't have a problem with it. It's more than at other parks, but so be it. But the layout of the park is 100% a result of Disney decisions.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 I just think they're weak criticisms. Disney has taken into consideration the weather in terms of having more covered and AC'd queues than Anaheim. Heck, almost all of EPCOT's FW is inside. You're only walking outside from pavilion to pavilion and they're all next to each other. WS is worse, but all of the attractions are still inside. I just don't see layout of the parks as a major issue. It would be akin to complaining about the fact that DL's walkways are tiny and there's no room to walk around, so they should do something. I don't discount them as opinions, I just have more meatier issues to complain about when it comes to WDW!
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< I just don't see layout of the parks as a major issue. >>> I don't think they're a problem either. What I took issue was the notion that the layout of the park is not Disney's responsibility.
