Originally Posted By dshyates MM is owned by Six Flags not Cedar Fair. But I do agree that MM is just sad these days.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I have lost track then. Is 6 Flags now owned by CP too? MM used to be cool, then 6 Flags took it over - the demise...
Originally Posted By Autopia Deb For some reason I was thing Six Flags was under the Cedar Fair banner these days. Wishful thinking on my part.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo agreed though, 6 Flags trashed that place, just like Paramount trashed Great America too.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 I really hope he can restore something of the magic to Knott's - and yes, Knott's had that too, back in the day. Even when they added the first Arrow corkscrew (quite the innovation in its day, even though it was soon duplicated in lots of parks), the idea of a Roarin' 20's area was brilliant. Even though wildly different than Ghost Town, it still all felt of-a-piece. The last time I went to KBF, it just didn't have the same feel. It's hard to describe, but it was neither fish nor fowl. And I say this as someone who likes coasters and liked most of the Cedar Fair additions IN ISOLATION... but the coherence of the place was really lost. Cedar Point itself does feel coherent. It feels like "turn of the century beachside amusement park sticking out into Lake Erie that's still going" - which is exactly what it is. And as such, it really works. But Knott's used to have that something extra... charm, yes, but more than that... and I didn't feel it on my most recent visit. Here's hoping Ouimet can figure out a way to bring it back, and make the place hang together somehow.
Originally Posted By Autopia Deb I was crushed when I went to Knott's and The Corkscrew had been replaced by some stomach twisting abomination.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Yep, and the soap box racers, and Knott's Berry Tales, and the Haunted shack, all of them, classics. But to think the Silver Bullet ruining what used to be that wonderfully believable (to me as a kid) environment when on the stage coach. And Reflection Lake, a shadow of it's former self.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper Cedar Fair isn't a crappy hotelier. Their current CEO is a crappy hotelier. There are people within the chain that can make quick improvements if they are let off the short leash. I know this first hand. As to the comparison of Breakers to the Coronado...I'm just trying to temper any expectations that one would find a similar experience if they went to both places. A portion of the original Breakers is still the 20's (Bon Air built in 1926) as is the Main Section and Rotunday (1906). Otherwise, the more recent expansion via the East wing and Tower are in no way comparable other than they are on the water and are attached to the older wings.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper Oh, I should add that Breakers is a seasonal operation (as is it's sister, Sandcastle Suites and 2nd cousing, Breakers Express). And, all three of those hotels are operated nearly exclusively by seasonal staff. Castaway Bay (off property) is year 'round as is the hotel out at Knott's.
Originally Posted By avimagine I think in general most theme parks aren't quite as clean as we remember then. Also it's all about marketability and thrills. At CW you can't even go into the mountain any more. The Antique cars are long gone, as are the RC boats and all the little things of my ancient youth.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 I would expect Matt to do a phenomenal job if given the chance/resources. He was so crucial to DCL's being the product it is (one that even a dolt like Karl Holz hasn't ruined ... yet) ... and what he did at DLR is well documented. He is the rare breed of exec that has a great business head on his shoulders, has a passion for his product and making it as best as it can be, cares about people (his employees and his customers) and isn't afraid of criticism. I can't say I have spent much time in Cedar's parks. And I soooo want to like Knott's, but generally am disappointed in my once every eight year visits. But Matt knows his stuff, so this is good news for Cedar fans ... I wish him the best.
Originally Posted By brotherdave Hotel Breakers at Cedar Point is "ok", but it's far from the historic hotel it once was. The central lobby/registration and rotunda areas are pretty much all that's left of the historic structure. The rotunda area is absolutely stunning, but overall, the new sections of the hotel feel more like a Hampton Inn now than anything special anymore. There is one old wing left that they still use for guests, and usually offers the cheapest rates due to the smaller room sizes and dated, and very used, 1970s furniture. The newer rooms are nothing remarkable, but offers convenience to the park more than anything else. Although not a bad hotel experience in either the older or newer rooms, they are basically nothing special either. If you visit Cedar Point, make a point to walk through the historic and impressive lobby and rotunda area, but unless you're willing to pay out the nose for convenience, Hotel Breakers is just an overpriced "modern" mid-level chain-like experience.
Originally Posted By brotherdave Also, I'm very pleased to hear that Ouimet is replacing Kinzel. I hope he can live up to his hype for Cedar Fair!
Originally Posted By wahooskipper I was a manager at the Breakers for a few years and I think you gave an honest assessment. I really hope Ouimet's impact is felt immediately at the resort. Kinzel never got his head around the idea that the resort experience has to be more than an average room next to the amusement park. There is vitrually no nightlife in the hotels and I'm sure his philosophy is that people should be in the park spending money. But, people can be out of the park and spend money too. Even what many people would consider fairly basic amenities could be improved. I think the hotel managers want that but they have not been given much of an opportunity. Some support from the executive would be welcome.
Originally Posted By brotherdave Understood, skipper. This was no way a slam at the hotel or its management. I'm sure their hands have been tied over the years. I still feel that it's way overpriced for what you get, but you can get some more reasonable rates early in the season. But being convenient to the park, you can't get better, which is why we will sometimes splurge to stay there. I realize that Cedar Point "is what it is", and that's ok for us as we love their selection of roller coasters. But the park needs more, much more, for families to enjoy together. They try to pass themselves as a family friendly park and resort, which they are, but sorely miss attractions that the whole family can enjoy TOGETHER. They need more family friendly attractions suitable for all ages, such as dark rides and other attractions. Right now, they either have rides for thrill seekers or for little kids, but not much for those that are too short to ride the big rides and those a little too "old" for the thrill rides to ride with their kids or grandkids. They have a wonderful antique steam train, a boat ride, large Ferris wheel, skytower, skyride, and some antique car rides, but they need more for families. Hopefully we'll see more family friendly attractions over the coming years as well as newer thrill rides.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper You are preaching to the choir. I've been saying for YEARS that they are sorely lacking in the "for the family" rides. If you have little kids then you are pretty much relegated to watching them in their kiddie lands. Dick thought Maverick was a "family ride". Uh, not really.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Which is why I am not a huge fan of CF, same problem at KBF, much more than it used to be.
Originally Posted By dshyates Traditional amusement parks have always had the segragation between "kiddie" rides and thrill rides. It was trips to tradional amusement parks that inspired Walt to develop the "Theme Park" concept. And part of Walt's concept is that there would be more things that the family can do together. But I am OK with there being SOME offerings that are not family friendly. A lot of Disney fans would say there is no need to EVER build an attraction like Millenium Force because there 3 year old princess can't ride it.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I enjoy coasters (or I used to in my smaller days), and think they have their place. But there is a big part of me that says, unless it is a new concept, they are not worth travelling the globe for. I appreciate folsk do (and I used to). I think variety is the spice of life. Though I want something that really does try to beat Disney at their own game. I have found many things that excel in some areas of beating them and succeed, but so far I am yet to find the right mix.
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>The last time I went to KBF, it just didn't have the same feel. It's hard to describe, but it was neither fish nor fowl... the coherence of the place was really lost.<< Totally agree. I am particularly saddened at the addition of massive steel coasters right next to (and even OVER) the lovely (and pretty well themed) Indian Trails. School groups still go to Knotts for history lessons, but it's a bit difficult to sit and be enthralled by a storyteller with a coaster full of screaming guests roaring by every couple of minutes.
