Originally Posted By oc_dean How about the evangelicals who love to shout obscenities like "those DA** gay people should all go to hell." The Republican party loves to cuddle those evangelicals. See a problem with this? Yes ... the democratic party has it's flaws. But who's responsible of the messes of the last 8 years. The truth hurts, doesn't it!
Originally Posted By utahjosh You guys have said THIS, so we get to say THAT! Really, that's your comeback? I want conservative principles being used in our government. That does not make me stupid. It means we disagree.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << I want conservative principles being used in our government. That does not make me stupid. >> It is pretty stupid to equate anything with the Bush administration or Republicans in office as being conservative. Runaway budget deficits and debt -- not conservative. Government take-over of financial institutions and unprecedented manipulation of financial markets -- not conservative. Destabilization of the globe through escalation of violence in the Middle East -- not conservative. Massive expansion of federal power through the creation of the Department of Homeland Security -- not conservative. Anyone who votes on "conservative" values would not be in line with the current administration or McCain's platform based on what we have see during the past 14 years of Republicans in Congress and the White House.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>I'm tired of reading that those who like conservative policies are irrational, stupid, etc.<< When people swallow that up is down, left is right, and black is white, what are we supposed to think, Josh? Conservatives are actually believing this nonsense about Palin and McCain as mavericks, despite all the evidence to the contrary. Conservatives, after having been in charge for the last 6 of 8 years, are now running on change, saying Washington is broken. What exactly are we supposed to think of people who swallow that kind of nonsense?
Originally Posted By utahjosh <It is pretty stupid to equate anything with the Bush administration or Republicans in office as being conservative.> AMEN!! I agree completely.
Originally Posted By utahjosh McCain is not my first choice for President. But he's closer to (though still far from) my ideal than Obama.
Originally Posted By utahjosh <Conservatives are actually believing this nonsense about Palin and McCain as mavericks, despite all the evidence to the contrary. Conservatives, after having been in charge for the last 6 of 8 years, are now running on change, saying Washington is broken. What exactly are we supposed to think of people who swallow that kind of nonsense?> Maybe they just don't like Obama's policies. Ever think of that?
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << Maybe they just don't like Obama's policies. Ever think of that? >> What policies don't you like, and why?
Originally Posted By utahjosh <What policies don't you like, and why?> Here are a few off the top of my head: *Health Care = don't want it run by government and will be too expensive *War on Terror & Iraq: The surge is succeeding and I think we should leave when Iraq is secure, and it looks like it could only take a few more years. *Taxes: I want them lower, for the rich and the poor *Pro Choice: I'd rather see less abortions. I know these are all very complex issues. I've stated them very briefly here, and don't really want to debate each of them in this thread.
Originally Posted By utahjosh Oh, and another: Oil: I think we need to drill here in the USA. And I think we need to pursue cleaner and renewable sources even more! But I still think we should drill in the meantime.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "*Taxes: I want them lower, for the rich and the poor" When you have a deficit like we do, does it really makes sense to limit the revenue?
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << Health Care = don't want it run by government and will be too expensive >> News flash! Health care is already too expensive! Private industry has really worked wonders here, with 40 million Americans who are without health care. So, the conservative position is that health care is a luxury for only the privileged. Its OK for others to suffer if they can't afford coverage.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << *War on Terror & Iraq: The surge is succeeding and I think we should leave when Iraq is secure, and it looks like it could only take a few more years. >> Great. Bush just announced that he is going to begin drawing down troops in Iraq -- and sending them to Afghanistan where violence is escalating. So, now we have a "conservative" surge of forces in Afghanistan. How much longer will we perpetuate this shell game before we figure out that endless wars are not productive for anyone?
Originally Posted By utahjosh Again, I don't want to debate each of these issues in this thread. They each deserve their own thread.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << *Taxes: I want them lower, for the rich and the poor >> So, how do you propose paying for the continued war in Iraq without money to pay the bills? Are you realy in favor of the United States government declaring bankruptcy? Is the conservative position that a bankrupt U.S. government will somehow be beneficial to people?
Originally Posted By ecdc >>Maybe they just don't like Obama's policies. Ever think of that?<< Yet here we have evidence of McCain and Palin lying. But you trust that they'll follow through on their policies? Good luck with that.
Originally Posted By utahjosh And, sorry if I disappointed you. It seems like you may have wanted me to respond by saying "I don't reckon them issues is impartant. I just knows that Palin is hot and McCain is an American HERO! That's why this country bumpkin' will be votin' fer 'em!"
Originally Posted By utahjosh ecdc, maybe I SHOULD vote for Obama. If we can't trust politicians to do what they say, then Obama might end up doing what McCain SAYS he'll do. I think i just confused myself.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << *Pro Choice: I'd rather see less abortions. >> You do realize that the number of abortions declined during the Clinton administration without infringing on a woman's right to choose. McCain/Palin are both on record of saying that they are in favor of a Constitutional amendment to outlaw abortions.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << Oil: I think we need to drill here in the USA. And I think we need to pursue cleaner and renewable sources even more! But I still think we should drill in the meantime. >> Why do you advocate more drilling? Are you looking for cheaper gas prices? There are no more cheap sources of oil left. All of the offshore sites being discussed are far more expensive to explore and drill than just importing our oil from the Middle East. You might gain some energy independence, but it won't come at a lower price per gallon at the pump. Oil producers are not going to sell oil for less than it costs to produce. Oil from the Atlantic Ocean is a lot harder to get at than oil from the Gulf of Mexico. They are apples and oranges. If you want true energy independence, renewable sources are where we need to invest our resources.
