Originally Posted By sjhym333 20 years from now? I think that is up for grabs. 20 years from now Disney could be just a shell of its glory days or it could be the premier vacation resort it was built to be. The answer lies in decisions that are made in the next several years. Will the parks be sold? Will there be a CEO who is more intrested in the creative end rather the financial sheet end? Will Disney continue to lag behind in innovation within the parks as other companies push the boundries? Will the econmy continue to push people to be prudent with their discretionary spending? I am sure WDW will be there. I am not confident on what shape it will be in. Manfried keeps saying if you dont like it, dont go. I agree. We have certainly cut back in our spending on all things Disney especially the parks. Is it possible more and more people will do that? Sure. Disney's biggest challenge will not be will people still go to WDW, the bigger problem in my opinion is can Disney keep them on property as long as they would like to. Everyday a guest drives down the road is money that Disney isnt making. If Universal keeps pushing the window with new attractions and Sea World wakes up and starts doing something (anything please), Disney is in danger of guests spending more and more days away from their resort.
Originally Posted By fkurucz "Will the econmy continue to push people to be prudent with their discretionary spending?" You can count on that. Globalization isn't even close to being done with us.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>.I don't think you will be anywhere near as thrilled as you imagine. For one thing, an undeniable mental connection with folks is the Disney (direct) connection. That is where all the warm fuzzy's come from. It isn't that 80 year old mouse that was never particularly funny or entertaining to begin with. It was and, to a large extent, still is the Disney mystique.<<< I could care less who owns the parks. As long as there is the current content, and new content in the same vein, and it's kept up, I will be happy. That's more "Disney" than what we have now.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> I don't think you will be anywhere near as thrilled as you imagine. For one thing, an undeniable mental connection with folks is the Disney (direct) connection. << I don't get it. What's the "Disney (direct) connection"? The company hasn't been run by the Disney family for many years now. Does that affect how you experience the parks? Doesn't for me.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost Nostalgia, leobloom, reputation and warm memories of youth. If someone else owns it, what happens to that. Everyone is so convinced that outside organizations can do better than Disney at being Disney. I am not convinced. It is mentioned that OLC does it better than Disney because Disney holds them to that. I say, bunk, Japan does the park that way because they are better then us at pride. They will spend money to look good, they have done everything they do, better, cheaper and more detailed, because they are the culture that they are. It is who they are. Unless you can guarantee that they are the future buyers of the parks, I say there is no guarantee that someone else will even be able to meet the standards. Then what happens? Does Disney take the parks back, I truly doubt it and I doubt they could find a buyer for a 40 and 55 year old park complex when it would probably be cheaper to start from scratch. I don't see, under most circumstances, a happy ending here.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer If there was no difference in operations, and things actually go better, and the only "change" was behind the scenes, how does that effect nostalgia...?
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer It's like having a computer, which runs OK, installing a new OS on it, and it suddenly runs better. (Can you tell I'm looking at moving up to OSX Lion? LOL)
Originally Posted By leobloom >> Nostalgia, leobloom, reputation and warm memories of youth. If someone else owns it, what happens to that. << Nothing happens to it. You've still got your nostalgia. You would still have the parks and resorts that are there now. What's the big deal?
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost OK, but I feel that nostalgia is deeper than just an attraction. It is a direct connection with what it was. A direct, this is Disney, operation. A direct link, albeit flimsy at the moment, to Walt himself. No, I feel it would be different, I feel it would have different internal vibes. Within a generation someone without any knowledge of history or tradition will pull the plug on Walt's freezer to charge up their I-phone...and that will be that. Like I stated somewhere before, it isn't, in my mind, likely to happen anyway. When you think of the amount the asking price would be (don't think it's $182.00 an acre anymore) and that they are basically saying...give me all your money and oh, by the way, you have no control over your investment, we are going to call all the shots and most of your Gross Profit will be send Direct Deposit to us I would think it only a good investment as a way to go broke. JMHO!
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Originally Posted By Goofyernmost So, Road Trip...I hear what you are saying, but I have to ask. What more are we to say about vbdad? If he's made the decision to be "out of it" that is up to him. No disrespect meant to vb here but this is hardly the first time that he has bowed out. He got very upset with me, years ago when I had a thread removed because the meaning of it was completely distorted. I felt that I had the right to do so, he didn't. Fine, that was his right as it was mine to discontinue a thread that I started. There really isn't more to be said about it. I don't think pulling out completely is necessary, but he did so, that is his right. Personally, I think it is better to stay and "fight the fight" so to speak. As far as the selling of the parks is concerned, you should try and enjoy it because I don't think you will find it discussed any other place on the planet besides on this particular board. It's kind of an exclusive.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip Nothing else to say, really. I just wanted to say that I'm sorry he's leaving and will miss him. I understand why he's doing it, on the other hand I'm just stubborn enough I continue to stick around. He may be back after a break... I hope so.
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom << Kind of like still loving a spouse after many years of marriage even though over the years you have discovered all the ways they fall short of perfection. You accept them as they are and continue to love them without feeling the need to constantly criticize them for their shortcomings.>> It's a theme park not a life partner! And personally I think your distorting marriage. It's not as if someone takes a sacred "vow" to uphold the virtues of WDW till death do they part.
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom As for vbdad leaving. He's a great guy and I look forward to talking with him elsewhere. Personally I think in the past he has weathered more criticism than what has been going lately on LP. I don't understand why he went on a crusade to protect WDW at all costs. Especially when he has made comments in the past remarking that Honey I Shrunk the Audience was older than his High School age son. It's not as if vbdad has been oblivious to the lack of new offerings within WDW parks. DVCs totally different story. vbdad told me in a post here on LP that he didn't appreciate DVCs being brough up when discussing WDW and it's parks. I fail to see how the two are mutually exclusive. Orlando is the timeshare capatial of the world. And WDW constribues to that in a big way. DVCs are to WDW like white it to rice. So to me suggesting that DVCs are a taboo subject and off limits WDW conversation was childish and inept. Have the conversations here been negative in general, yup! But I think the typical WDW fan is seeing an ongoing pattern or a lack of new offerings and more and more current offerings closed, shuttered or worse bulldozed. I should add that much of the "new" offerings geared completely toward other demographic age groups entirely aka Princess meet and greets, Fantasyland expansion.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 To post 30: That's just going so far beyond, that I am shocked it's still here. It is a very crude, venomous post on a thread started by another longtime poster who decided to 'leave' LP.com. It was posted by someone who shares a fair amount with the one who left and (unlike many of us, who come here to talk about Disney and media and entertainment only) also shared a great deal of his own life, very off-topic (and, quite frankly, some of it very depressing and troubling), with the LP.com community. One started the thread to grandstand and the other used it this morning to show just why Social Media was not only an appropriate and well-positioned thread, but a topic that demanded a platform. LaughingPlace gave it that platform, and we're all better for it. When a discussion is simply shutdown like one might close a door, it diminishes us all. No matter what direction you look at it from, no matter where your personal interest/opinions may be. That was the point of the Social Media thread. It is great to have a firm hand on the rudder, but once you've sold the sail for false promise I fail to see the reason for the boat.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<It's a theme park not a life partner! And personally I think your distorting marriage. It's not as if someone takes a sacred "vow" to uphold the virtues of WDW till death do they part.>> I guess you missed the commitment ceremony I had in 1996 on the bridge between Ol' Man Island and the Riverside Mill at Dixie Landings. It was a lovely ceremony… the early morning eastern sun bathed the area in lovely soft light. The flowers seemed more colorful than ever and you could hear the music of nature in the background that is so often overlooked once the crowds arrive. I was dressed in my Finest Tux-painted T-Shirt; WDW was represented by a lovely DVC saleswoman named Heather dressed as Snow White. We exchanged Churros and committed ourselves to each other for life. She was really cute and I was quite looking forward to consummation of the marriage until I found out that it entailed riding Snow White's Scary Adventures continuously for 6 hours. After 6 hours of that I just wanted to be as far away from Ms. White as possible! But it was a truly lovely day and one that I will never forget. I wish you could have been there.
Originally Posted By ChiMike >> I don't understand why he went on a crusade to protect WDW at all costs. Especially when he has made comments in the past remarking that Honey I Shrunk the Audience was older than his High School age son. It's not as if vbdad has been oblivious to the lack of new offerings within WDW parks. DVCs totally different story. vbdad told me in a post here on LP that he didn't appreciate DVCs being brough up when discussing WDW and it's parks. I fail to see how the two are mutually exclusive. Orlando is the timeshare capatial of the world. And WDW constribues to that in a big way. DVCs are to WDW like white it to rice. So to me suggesting that DVCs are a taboo subject and off limits WDW conversation was childish and inept.<< Both RoadTrip and VBDad have done the same thing in this very thread. They don't like posters that are negative about the things that those two specifically enjoy, so they hurl all these negative smears towards the messenger of the differing opinion. The folks expressing the negative opinions, refrain from the personal attacks both before and after the personal insults fly. They just are negative about a theme park offering. This is a common phenomenon of attacking the negative messenger instead of the message - across the internet. It typically comes about when the attacker doesn't feel they can argue the merits of the opinion so just take it personal. It's a cowards way of discussing things in fandom. However, on here both RoadTrip and VBDad have no problem sharing a negative opinion on those issues that bother them, just watch out though, if you bother to insult one of their sacred cows. It's pretty sad. I've refrained from responding to VBDad and Roadtrip to try not to escalate the venom. Well, and that it is obvious that they are unwilling to let other influence their views on things. Even at this point, I take all sorts of contemporary observations/trends into account in my own view on things.. It's not hard. This is how I see it, I've said my peace, and will continue to not respond when they want to take it personal.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip Sorry Spirit... I didn't see it as venomous at all, but an accurate reading of how many of us feel about the direction LP has been heading in lately. It was targeted at no one person, so I hope you don't see it as being directed at you. Although you initiate many of the critical discussions, you for the most part are NOT one who then claims that anyone who disagrees with your opinion is ignorant. I have a couple of names in mind when I say this, and they are NOT you. It really is nothing any one person says... it is more the combination of you saying XXX and then someone else saying XXX is 100% right and anyone who can not see that is blind, ignorant or both. It is that witches brew that I see as being bad for LP, not any one component in it. As I said before, opinions are one thing and I certainly support having a diversity of them. But when people who don't happen to agree with the "opinion leaders" are judged to be ignorant or mentally ill, that is something else entirely. Unfortunately, your generally well thought out arguments (though I may not agree with them) are used by some others as a springboard to launch personal attacks against people who do not agree with that point of view. That is all I really have to say.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<This is a common phenomenon of attacking the negative messenger instead of the message - across the internet. It typically comes about when the attacker doesn't feel they can argue the merits of the opinion so just take it personal. It's a cowards way of discussing things in fandom.>> The people I refer to do this ALL THE TIME... vbdad and I tend to reserve it for only those occasions when we've become truly fed up. People here whose opinion differs from the "opinion leaders" are constantly put down. We are constantly told that we are Defenders of Mediocrity... that we are unable to see things clearly because we are high on pixie dust... that DVC'ers have brought the WalMart crowd to Disney Deluxe Resorts. Do you think NONE of that is personal? REALLY? You do it so often you never even notice it. But when we go out of character and do it all of a sudden the sky is falling. And it doesn't feel very good to be on the other end for once, does it? Perhaps now that you have some inkling of how it feels, you will be somewhat less judgmental of those whose opinions differ from yours in the future. But frankly, I'm not counting on it. As with most of what we say, it will be dismissed as uninformed drivel by someone not intelligent enough to see the truth.
