Originally Posted By DlandDug If the only choices are success or failure, I would have to say failure. Mission: Space was heavily promoted, got of to a rocky start, and has never recovered. I like M:S a LOT. I rode it repeatedly during the AP previews. Couldn't understand all of the alarm over the intensity of the ride. This was, obviously, before anyone ended up dead. But guests were not "dropping like flies." (Two guests have died after riding on Mission: Space.) I loved Horizons, and miss it. It has always been my view that anything at a Disney theme park can be removed, as long as something better is put in its place. Sadly, in recent years this has not been the case. Mission: Space is a good example of this.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper <<All slow dark rides and basically the same thing.>> The only two that were similar were Horizons and SSE, IMO. And even if you count WoM, JII was nothing close to the "Same thing" as the other two. <<HISTA show had imagination with 3D and 4D effects instead of the recycled mess known as Captain EO or what should be named "He's dead let's exploit him" show.>> Both shows suck eggs. The theater has never had a decent show in it. <<The question of this thread was "Is MS a success or fail? Someone answered "neither"...that is probably pretty close to the actuality. With time it will lose its "death" logo and when discovered will be a success, I believe.>> It's already too late to be considered an operational success. As a ride, I love it (Though it should never have replaced Horizons, a far superior WDI/WED masterpiece), but even if it line gets a bit longer down the road, it will never drive Epcot's attendance as it was supposed to do. Therefore, it's a failure in that regard.
Originally Posted By ChiMike And Mission Space isn't that intense. That is why its a failure. It serves no audience. Forget the death stuff, all of that was way overblown, the only time I would reference it was to point out that Horizons never aggravated a pre-existing condition. Which is true. M:S is a failure because it is not intense enough to compete with thrills nationwide whether it be at IOA, Knott's or something like TTD at Cedar Point. It is too intense or claustrophobic for the family audience Disney already receives at EPCOT and it brings with a height requirement. It is a failure because it did not perform to the level Disney expected, Disney's investment would have demanded, and that it neither caters to families or the thrill seekers. Its appeal is stuck in a middle, muddled, mess. One that doesn't come across as attractive for repeat visits either. If Horizons had to be modified or completely replaced, M:S is an example of how NOT to do it. It is a shame too because of the money that was certainly wasted on it and that there were so many other proposals leading up to it for a real space pavilion.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper <<If Horizons had to be modified or completely replaced, M:S is an example of how NOT to do it. It is a shame too because of the money that was certainly wasted on it and that there were so many other proposals leading up to it for a real space pavilion.>> And THAT was some breathtaking art right there. The Space pavilion would have been a certifiable home run with all audiences.
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>Within a short time from EPCOT Ctr's. opening there were 4 rides that, themed differently, were all the same. There was SSE, Imagination, Horizons and WoM. All slow dark rides and basically the same thing,<< Totally disagree. The four AA extravaganzas were great complementary attractions. Space Ship Earth: History of human communications, played straight. World of Motion: History of transportation told with great humor. Journey Into Imagination: A visually splendid look at how creativity functions, in the only character driven attraction in EPCOT. Horizons: A hopeful look at the future-- with a completely different ride system, to boot. I agree that a big issue with Epcot was the lack of truly thrilling attractions-- but eviscerating two of the park's original signature pavilions to deliver the somewhat tepid "thrills" of Test Track and Mission: Space hardly seems like a good trade-off to me. Particularly in light of the fact that there are still undeveloped areas where new attractions could have been added.
Originally Posted By sjhym333 I would consider MS a failure in terms of what it delivers to EPCOT as an attraction. It was expensive, never delivered on attendance and for many is not a repeat attraction, which to me is its biggest problem. Rode it twice...once during CM previews and once with my wife who was sick to her stomach for most of the rest of the day. Haven't rode it since. Has a eh factor about it...do you want to ride again...eh.
Originally Posted By 3disneylocations The original Epcot Pav's WERE redundant (IMO) hence the reason Horizon's parts were recycled into SSE (so were some of WOM's if I'm not mistaken - the future city at night). M:S does deliver and you can ride mutiple times (as a different position in your "Launch Team"). It's too bad they turned down the G's, but poop happens... I've rode M:S w/others, who wanted to go back and try a different experience right after finishing the first ride (spinning, then non) and these are people who hate coasters... So I would say M:I is sucessful; It doesn't matter what we think anyway, cause we all no Disney isn't going to get rid of the attraction.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper <<It's too bad they turned down the G's>> That's a fallacy. Never been turned down since official opening.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Sadly, the ride that was standing on that land ended up to be a massive failure as well, except to a very few. Maybe it's something about the location.<<< I don't understand how it can be called a failure when it always had a line, was a fantastic show, and still has, to this day, a following. It was killed off, it didn't die off. Blame Eisner and GE. GE will only bring good things to life as long as they don't play around with Uni! -GFC-
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>As much as I'd love to agree with you ChiMike, I can't. Horizons (there I said it) had lost it's popularity long before it lost it's sponsorship. It was a nice ride, but in Epcot the dark rides were overdone, and one looked just like the other. It had no pop!<<< I really don't see that being true. I remember waiting in line for it up until the mid 90's, when it was first closed and went seasonal. that's what REALLY did it in.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>When does HP's sponsorship expire? I doubt they will renew it (they inherited it from Compaq). Will anyone pick it up if tha happens?<< 2013! Can't wait!
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Within a short time from EPCOT Ctr's. opening there were 4 rides that, themed differently, were all the same. There was SSE, Imagination, Horizons and WoM. All slow dark rides and basically the same thing. Then there was Energy which was a coma inducing commercial for Exxon and the land had a slow boat to nowhere. The sea's had a slow and extremely short ride through the aquarium (not much different today) but at least it had the Hydrolaters.<<< If you look at them at face value, yeah. If you actually ride the attractions and see how DIFFERENT they were thematically, you are wrong. Sorry about that. But telling me that the humorous and airy World of Motion is the same as the dark and mysterious Spaceship Earth doesn't work. And even so, Horizons was ALL about the future. Totally different. That's like calling POTC and HM the same ride. >>The question of this thread was "Is MS a success or fail? Someone answered "neither"...that is probably pretty close to the actuality. With time it will lose its "death" logo and when discovered will be a success, I believe.<< That woulda been me. LOL. But I don't think it'll loose that stigma unless it goes through a massive thematic refurb. Or addition.
Originally Posted By 3disneylocations <<It's too bad they turned down the G's>> That's a fallacy. Never been turned down since official opening.<< They went from 3 to 2 g's in response the the deaths. Rode it when it first opened and after the change; there were noticable differences to the ride experience. I knows me some g's, the first version was a virtual face lift.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost >>>But guests were not "dropping like flies." (Two guests have died after riding on Mission: Space.)<<< Yes, I know there were only two deaths, but compared to the other attractions, that was a pretty high rate. The real problem came from the vivid imaginations of the guests. My god...people died on that...I'm not riding it. Those were the wimpy ones...the more adventurous of the guests looked at is as the ultimate thrill ride. "See if you can survive" was probably the mantra. Anyway, the actual danger was blown out of proportion and spread around like wildfire. I would venture to say that even the majority of the "motion sickness" was self inflicted. If a person had an actual diagnosed inner ear problem then the centrifuge was not for them. If not, then it was mostly imagined. Anyone that has ever ridden it...do you remember any sensation that even slightly felt like spinning. Of course not, it felt like acceleration. No sensation of spinning at all. That would have required a point of reference and there was none. Perhaps, I should have been more detailed on what I meant by "basically all the same". Agreed, they had different messages but there were to many of that type. I, personally, love that many dark rides, but the general public apparently didn't. You can tell yourself forever that Horizons had maintained it's popularity, but you are just kidding yourself. Remember how big that indoor "Q" was? Remember in the 80's how it was always full? By the end of its time if there where more than 20 people in that line it was nothing short of a miracle. I know, I was one of the 20.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> The original Epcot Pav's WERE redundant (IMO) hence the reason Horizon's parts were recycled into SSE (so were some of WOM's if I'm not mistaken - the future city at night). << What parts of Horizons were recycled for SSE? >> M:S does deliver and you can ride mutiple times (as a different position in your "Launch Team"). << Can't believe no one pounced on this. Are you joking? The different roles on the launch team? You mean I get to press a different button at a different time that has the same nonexistent effect on the ride? Uh, yeah. Let me ride four times so that I can hopefully get to press all four prop buttons.
Originally Posted By leobloom Someone alluded to this earlier when they said how disappointing it is to exit on Mars and then walk out into Future World. I think the decision to treat the ride as a "training" simulator was a poor one. Thus, we're never on Mars. Thus, the designers get around letting the riders seeing the ride contraption when they load. Thus, the video game graphics. ("It doesn't have to feel like a real experience...it's just a training simulator.") How much more magical would Star Tours be if we were merely "training" for space flight, or if Haunted Mansion was simply "introducing" us to the behavior of artificial playful spooks. Part of the Disney magic is the suspension of disbelief, and M:S completely misses that point. By the way, what's in the area after you exit the ride? I've never had any desire to spend time in there. Am I missing anything good?
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>Can't believe no one pounced on this.<< I think we were all being kind. The world needs more kindness, don't you think?
Originally Posted By 3disneylocations What parts of Horizons were recycled for SSE? << The majority of the AA/Video Screen sections showing the future of communications (teacher-classroom, doctors, boyfriend-girlfriend chatting) Those were moved to SSE.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> The majority of the AA/Video Screen sections showing the future of communications (teacher-classroom, doctors, boyfriend-girlfriend chatting) Those were moved to SSE. << So are you saying that the AAs were moved from Horizons to SSE? Or the video screens were? I don't think it's the former, but maybe it's the latter. And if it's video screens were recycled, then how does that prove that SSE and Horizons were redundant?
Originally Posted By 3disneylocations >> M:S does deliver and you can ride mutiple times (as a different position in your "Launch Team"). << Can't believe no one pounced on this. Are you joking? The different roles on the launch team? You mean I get to press a different button at a different time that has the same nonexistent effect on the ride? Uh, yeah. Let me ride four times so that I can hopefully get to press all four prop buttons.<< More engaging than watching the same AA dark ride over & over... Oh wait, you could choose a different way to return to earth (pushing one button - and seeing all the ride vehicle tech, when leaving... Sound familiar?)
