Originally Posted By jonvn "If anyone ever had such a claim in the Disney World it would have been Paul Pressler" He was a public figure. He was an executive and corporate officer of the company, not a mid to low level manager. But he probably did have a case, but did not pursue it.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << I do remember an on-topic conversation regarding an officer of a public corporation. >> And, once again, this topic does not involve an officer of a public corporation. People get enamored with titles like VP and think "Oh wow, a big wig executive!" but in reality, this position is at the mid-level of management. An officer in the corporate structure would be identified by name in the company's SEC filings. This position doesn't meet that standards at all. In general, I don't have a beef with criticism levied at someone who holds a particular position. However, I do think it is extremely out of line for a poster to repeatedly introduce the names of Disney employees into numerous topics, encourage others to contact them by phone, and track the movements of Disney employees as they move throughout the organization. If this happened on a single occasion, I might give it a pass, but the repeated behavior to track down the names, locations, and positions of dozens of Disney employees is not normal or appropriate "fan" behavior. Disney spends millions of dollars each year to investigate and take action against crazy people who stalk their employees. While name-dropping a discussion board might be brushed off as benign "fan" activity, there is no way for someone to know whether or not the activity is benign or actually a symptom of more disturbed behavior that could actually lead to someone becoming a victim of emotional or physical harm.
Originally Posted By CMDad <<If this happened on a single occasion, I might give it a pass ...>> Careful folks ... if anything here could be interpreted as a threat ... I think it has just happened ... Sport Goofy has just appointed himself as enforcer ...
Originally Posted By barboy You know jonvn Spirit is nowhere near these intentional torts to which you are alluding. And Sport, If I pay to go to the San Fran Giants game and some unknown 3rd base coach recklessly sends a baserunner home you better believe that I will get on him verbally.(not that I'm saying merchandise Dan is necessarily making blunders). Since they are decision makers and policy setters these Disney cats are fair game.... yep it's open season all year long until these heads clean up the parks and stop selling us stamped out junk on Main street or anywhere else. Hey, Spirit keep up the info. and commentary because like you have been saying "Walmarting" the parks is unacceptable.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << And Sport, If I pay to go to the San Fran Giants game and some unknown 3rd base coach recklessly sends a baserunner home you better believe that I will get on him verbally >> Great! Do you go home after the game, look up his name and broadcast it in a message to all the other fans at the game that day? When the 3rd base coach transfers to another team, do you make a point to let those same fans know that he's made a move to another position? Your analogy is irrelevant to the point I have been making. Be a fan! Boo! Cheer! I'm all for it!
Originally Posted By MPierce >> In general, I don't have a beef with criticism levied at someone who holds a particular position. However, I do think it is extremely out of line for a poster to repeatedly introduce the names of Disney employees into numerous topics, encourage others to contact them by phone << Did I miss something? I don't remember a phone number being posted or anyone encourage to contact this person. You keep referring to him as a mid-level manager. Admittedly he is not a CEO or even on the board. However he is the #2 person at the Magic Kingdom. A park that draws 16 million people a year. That's more than any other theme or thrill park in the world. I do not see where anyone could consider this mid-level management. I sure don't see how he are anyone else at the Disney Corp. could interpret discussing his promotion, and past performace from a bunch of Disney Geeks as unhealthy, and border line stalking.
Originally Posted By barboy " Do you go home after the game, look up his name and broadcast it in a message to all the other fans at the game that day?" No, but if I were an avid Giants fan I probably would bring up the caoche's name on some Giants or baseball message board and lay into him. "When the 3rd base coach transfers to another team, do you make a point to let those same fans know that he's made a move to another position?" I don't know if I would-- unsure on that one.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << I sure don't see how he are anyone else at the Disney Corp. could interpret discussing his promotion, and past performace from a bunch of Disney Geeks as unhealthy, and border line stalking. >> You should have some conversations with people who work in some of these entertainment companies. The behavior of some fans is down right scary. I know someone who actually had to have escorts to and from his place of business because of stalker activity -- activity that first manifested itself in a "fan" chat room.
Originally Posted By danyoung >...the repeated behavior to track down the names, locations, and positions of dozens of Disney employees is not normal or appropriate "fan" behavior.< Are you at all familiar with Disney fans and their passion for the subject? Seems to me that the behavior that you describe above is EXACTLY the kind of behavior that is both normal and appropriate within the Disney fan base. As long as '74 isn't camping out on anyone's doorstep and trying to get kinky photos, I see what he's doing as a service. I'm most interested in who is doing what and where within the Disney park management structure. And I'm obviously not alone. >Disney spends millions of dollars each year to investigate and take action against crazy people who stalk their employees.< And again with the unfounded hyperbole. Where is your information coming from? This is just silly, unsubstantiated talk until you trot out some kind of proof.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<In general, I don't have a beef with criticism levied at someone who holds a particular position. However, I do think it is extremely out of line for a poster to repeatedly introduce the names of Disney employees into numerous topics, encourage others to contact them by phone, and track the movements of Disney employees as they move throughout the organization.>> Bull*&^%. The only people discussed are at the high management/executive positions. And I only encourage people to contact them if they have complaints, compliments or issues to raise. It is no different from any other company. You really need to tone down your rhetoric. If I have an issue at the local Red Lobster or Best Buy, I get the manager's name and call or write. If that doesn't lead to satisfaction I move up to the regional VP etc ... that isn't stalking. That's what you do when you have an issue that can't be resolved by someone making $7 an hour. I don't discuss front-line employees. Just execs. And if you don't believe Dan qualifies I'd invite you to send him a note and ask. I somehow doubt he views his position as No. 2 exec of the most-vistited them park on the planet as being 'a mid-level manager.' You're really ignorant. <<If this happened on a single occasion, I might give it a pass, but the repeated behavior to track down the names, locations, and positions of dozens of Disney employees is not normal or appropriate "fan" behavior.>> YOU are the arbiter of what is normal or appropriate? Sorry, Goof. You're just a poster on a Disney fan site with a strong pro-management pull, which is fine, and a strong desire to slander me, which isn't. You don't have to 'track' down anyone if you happen to know the management structure of WDW. I do. Maybe that upsets you since you obviously would like a chance to be an MK manager and since you'll never be, you're just an angry, bitter wannabe on a fan site who attacks people who know more than you do about what goes on inside the Team Disney building. <<Disney spends millions of dollars each year to investigate and take action against crazy people who stalk their employees.>> That is crazy hyperbole. Really. Crazy. Perhaps some of their actors may have a problem once in a while, but if you really think people are stalking Phil Holmes, Ed Grier, Erin Wallace etc ... you have a very weak grip on reality. <<While name-dropping a discussion board might be brushed off as benign "fan" activity, there is no way for someone to know whether or not the activity is benign or actually a symptom of more disturbed behavior that could actually lead to someone becoming a victim of emotional or physical harm.>> You need to tone down the rhetoric, seriously. You're accusing someone -- namely me -- of potentially criminal behavior and I won't stand for it, so you decide if you want to continue this line of crap so you can win what you view as a pissing contest.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Hey, Spirit keep up the info. and commentary because like you have been saying "Walmarting" the parks is unacceptable. >> I intend to, although life has limited the time I can currently spend here in the Laughing Place. I hope circumstances change soon. For many reasons
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Did I miss something? I don't remember a phone number being posted or anyone encourage to contact this person. You keep referring to him as a mid-level manager. Admittedly he is not a CEO or even on the board. However he is the #2 person at the Magic Kingdom. A park that draws 16 million people a year. That's more than any other theme or thrill park in the world. I do not see where anyone could consider this mid-level management. I sure don't see how he are anyone else at the Disney Corp. could interpret discussing his promotion, and past performace from a bunch of Disney Geeks as unhealthy, and border line stalking.>> Thank you, MPierce. And rest assured, I sincerely doubt Dan the man would disagree. I do hope someone points him to this thread if they haven't already because I do wish him the best and I want him to know that us 'purists' (I hate that term) are watching. ;-) <<Are you at all familiar with Disney fans and their passion for the subject? Seems to me that the behavior that you describe above is EXACTLY the kind of behavior that is both normal and appropriate within the Disney fan base. As long as '74 isn't camping out on anyone's doorstep and trying to get kinky photos, I see what he's doing as a service. I'm most interested in who is doing what and where within the Disney park management structure. And I'm obviously not alone.>> Thanks, Danny. You must understand that without 'labeling' Sport Goofy, he in his various incarnations on LP.com generally views things in a very strong, very pro-management prism. It likely has something to do with what he does (or wishes he did) in the real world. So if I were Al Lutz, I'd place him squarely in the DoM category. But I'm not Al!
Originally Posted By bobbelee9 <<<If I have an issue at the local Red Lobster or Best Buy, I get the manager's name and call or write. If that doesn't lead to satisfaction I move up to the regional VP etc ... that isn't stalking. That's what you do when you have an issue that can't be resolved by someone making $7 an hour.>>> Because if you don't complain, then you are adding to the downfall of that establishment. Don't do it enough times and it's the downfall of society. Look around you, WDW isn't the only place that isn't what it use to be. Complacency is not acceptable.
Originally Posted By CMDad It's simple ... Dealing with someone regarding his professional issues on a business level is acceptable. Getting into his personal life is not. Spirit - and the rest of us who care about WDW and TWDC have been dealing strictly with professional/business issues. I defy anyone to show otherwise.
Originally Posted By jonvn "You know jonvn Spirit is nowhere near these intentional torts to which you are alluding. " I'm just saying be careful. These are NOT public figures. "some unknown 3rd base coach recklessly sends a baserunner home you better believe that I will get on him verbally" He's a public figure, and has placed himself into a position where he should expect such things.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy If I have an issue at the local Red << Lobster or Best Buy, I get the manager's name and call or write. If that doesn't lead to satisfaction I move up to the regional VP etc ... that isn't stalking. That's what you do when you have an issue that can't be resolved by someone making $7 an hour. >> Except that's not what you are doing here. Rather than addressing a specific issue in a manner where you might have some sort of fruitful discussion with the person you have an issue with, you are anonymously posting information on a message board. You expose the names and job assignments for a host of WDW employees and describe their roles in the organization according to you own point of view. These people have no recourse to address any inaccuracies in your statements or ways to verify if you are taking any other actions to further intrude in their personal lives. There is a big difference between lodging a formal customer complaint and publishing opinions on a discussion board under the cloak of anonymity.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << I do wish him the best and I want him to know that us 'purists' (I hate that term) are watching. ;-) >> Yup, I'm sure he is quite aware of all the people watching him -- some legitimately and others in a manner that probably keeps him and his family on edge at times.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Except that's not what you are doing here. Rather than addressing a specific issue in a manner where you might have some sort of fruitful discussion with the person you have an issue with, you are anonymously posting information on a message board.>> I am posting on a forum designed by Disney lovers and frequented by them ... as well as Disney CMs, including many of the people we talk about here. If I make one comment to someone, I am one Spirit. But if we get a thread going, there are dozens of people posting and likely thousands of people reading here on a daily basis. That does a whole lot more. Especially in an era where a company can simply send you to an 'escalation department' (how Orwellian is that? and it is why you should never buy a GATEWAY product!) simply because they sold you a defective product and are unwilling to repair/replace it. I don't need Disney keeping a recorded list of how many times I have a complaint (and it is far less than you likely believe) so they can say I'm the problem not the way they now do business, sorry. <<You expose the names and job assignments for a host of WDW employees and describe their roles in the organization according to you own point of view. >> Please. Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? 'Expose' ?! The people I talk about are executives at high levels of the WDW leadership tree. I am not picking a leaf off a far branch. And I don't describe their roles according to any POV ... I simply state the facts. <<These people have no recourse to address any inaccuracies in your statements or ways to verify if you are taking any other actions to further intrude in their personal lives.>> Intrude?!?!? You're crazy. Plain and simple. And possibly dangerous. Play with yourself. Literally and figuratively, because I'm done with you.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy << If I make one comment to someone, I am one Spirit. But if we get a thread going, there are dozens of people posting and likely thousands of people reading here on a daily basis. That does a whole lot more. >> So, essentially you are saying that you use these discussion boards as a bullying tactic to get your own point of view amplified beyond the normal methods that can legitimately be responded to. Disney or their employees can't respond directly to your message board postings. The WDW employees you name can't repond to you because you remain anonymous and it would be inappropriate for them to publicly respond to your accusations and rhetoric directly on this site or any other. It's a convenient outlet for you. You can say whatever you want about whoever you want whenever you want. You get an audience for your rhetoric. No one has any recourse to respond to you in a meaningful way because you are behind a cloak of anonymity. It really is the hallmark of a bully. << Intrude?!?!? You're crazy. Plain and simple. And possibly dangerous. Play with yourself. >> And when you are met with legitimate criticism you do exactly what a bully would do -- resort to name calling and venom.
