Originally Posted By DVC_dad The technology to automate the monorail is expensive but easy I would think. The Atlanta airport, is an automated rail system and to my knowledge runs very well. I am sure that its work load is greater than that of WDW.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<a run from Epcot to Boardwalk to Studios is short. And perhaps at the Studios end there could be a parallel station beam where an inbound traim could dock, and then the outbound train take off while the inbound is cycling it's load. A single beam solution with two trains sharing it could work. No, it wouldn't much help empty the park at closing. That would not be it's intent.>> So what would the intent be then? How do you justify the expenditure of $100 million (or whatever the number is) for a monorail when it's only purpose would be to add atmosphere? What everyone here is crying about is all the buses running around WDW. A short, low-capacity line would do nothing to solve that problem. Don't get me wrong, I'd love for there to be more monorail service at WDW, but TWDC isn't going to build one just for the sake of "coolness factor." A short monorail line from Epcot to the studios makes no sense when the same job is already done by the boats.
Originally Posted By ChiMike ^ That about sums it up. I'm entering this late but I would add that there would be no purpose or advantage in the world for Disney to invest in an expansion of the monorail system only to create a shuttle-mode operation. As somone who has suffered through the reduced operations at Disneyland on multiple trips I can say that it was far from plesent. It was down right pointless. It was easier to walk or take a tram. Even with Disneyland running two trains in shuttle mode; to wait for one train to unload, back up, a second train to unload, then load, then the first train to come back and load and then repeat the whole process at the other station was tedious at best. They did this because the monorail IS considered an attraction out there and especially during DCA construction they needed every attraction operating that they could in TL. Plus walking to DLH was a big, big chore (when they were doing it for DCA). The flipside of the situation was that the mark V's took a huge beating operating like that for a long time too. It added to their woes. A shuttle-mode operation is something of a last resort. Disney would never intentionally design an expansion to do it. No matter how short the route. Any expansion would need be along a route that desire high-capacity. The exact opposite of what a shuttle-mode operation would allow. And to keep to the nitpicking, back to whoever corrected Spirit on what Spurs are, if they were to ever build a one-way beam/line for shuttle operation it would no longer be a "Spur" in the traditional sense.
Originally Posted By SuperDry ^^^ I think that's the key to any monorail expansion at WDW. It has to definately be designed with functionality in mind primarily, and it being a technology showcase or novelty factor as secondary considerations. I think that one aspect of being very functional and a replacement to most bus service is that it support a high volume of passengers.
Originally Posted By Lake Nona Someone asked about the sin city monorail, the link is below... <a href="http://www.lvmonorail.com/" target="_blank">http://www.lvmonorail.com/</a>
Originally Posted By TDLFAN >>^^^ I think that's the key to any monorail expansion at WDW.<< And here I was it was MONEY holding it up.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< And here I was it was MONEY holding it up. >>> Of course it's the money. Let me clarify my point of view: I think the only way that a substantial expansion of the monorail will happen at WDW is if it's a) generally useful as a primary means of transport for a large number of guests and not just a novelty, and b) as a result, can allow bus service to be greatly reduced to help offset costs. The only way these things are going to happen is if the monorail is extended to a significant number of other destinations (including DTD, the two other parks, and many of the other resorts) and if it can handle peak crowds. It seems to me that this would best be done by some sort of grand loop route rather than several point-to-point routes, and with high capacity trains like are in service at HKDL and TDR.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN Yes, but you have to remember that Disney did not pay for those train systems... as far as I know. Why would they care to invest on this now??
Originally Posted By SuperDry They would make the investment if they could make the numbers work. If the monorail expansion was done right, they may be able to eliminate bus service altogether from the resorts that were on the monorail, and dramatically reduce it from other locations by making bus service simply a shuttle between those locations and the nearest monorail station. Plus, I think they could charge a small premium for resorts that were on the monorail. The initial buildout would certainly be large, but for a company like Disney, that's not really the issue: the comparison would be between the buildout costs amortized over many years plus annual operating expenses, vs the operating expenses of the bus system. As I've said before, I don't feel that I have a good intuitive sense as to what the numbers are, but apparently there are some figures that are at least "in the ballpark" floating about if the plans that have reportedly been on the table recently are to be believed.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN >>They would make the investment if they could make the numbers work.<< The only way that could happen is if another company takes over the project and share the expenses with Disney. Similar to how the MTR was built at HKDL.
Originally Posted By ChiMike SuperDry, Even w/ monorail service, resorts on a line would still need bus service. Even the monorail resorts today employ bus service.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< Even w/ monorail service, resorts on a line would still need bus service. >>> But why is this? Part of the reason may be the limited capacity of the Mark VI trains, but as I mentioned, there are other train models that can hold several times as many people. Assuming capacity was not a problem, why would there need to be bus service when there's monorail service between two points, especially if it was done in a manner where the Epcot line was extended to become more of a "grand loop" around the resort, such that transfers would be minimal? Also, I can't remember the accessibility issues with regard to the Mark VI (is a temporary ramp necessary for wheelchair loading?). The HKDL and TDR design of the monorail has wide doors and a floor that's flush with the platform, such that wheelchairs simply roll on and off the train along with the other passengers. <<< Even the monorail resorts today employ bus service. >>> Is there bus service between the Poly or GF and the MK? (I'm asking - I don't know). If there is, I'd be interested in the rationale.
Originally Posted By ChiMike No but there is between the GF/Contemp/Polynesian and MGM, AK, Downtown Disney, Water Parks. So, if say, Dolphin has access to a monorail station on a line servicing MGM & AK, there will probably still be bus service to MK from there.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< No but there is between the GF/Contemp/Polynesian and MGM, AK, Downtown Disney, Water Parks. >>> Obviously - those destinations do not have monorail service. <<< So, if say, Dolphin has access to a monorail station on a line servicing MGM & AK, there will probably still be bus service to MK from there. >>> You keep saying this, but I don't see why it has to be. Especially if savings from greatly reduced bus service would push the numbers for a monorail expansion plan over the top such that it gets done, I'm all for it.
Originally Posted By ChiMike But see, this is it, even if there are monorails all over the place, there is always going to be bus service between the GF and AK. Maybe in RollerCoaster Tycoon, we could have this resort with monorails only, but in practice even with a huge expansion, even with a regional rail hub on property from the airport, there will be bus service. Savings from reduced bus service certainly would be 'savings'. But they wouldn't eclipse the capital outlay for expansion. So you couldn't really say that since 7 routes are eliminated that is more the reason to be able to have even MORE expansion. It's like saying that because I choose not to pay and stay at the All Stars, I now have more money to stay at the GF. So, yes, if the Dolphin is situated on a mega-line from Downtown Disney to TL to Epcot to MGM to BB to AK. It still is going to have bus service to MK. It will still have boat service to Epcot & MGM. If such a mega-line is built, the Contemporary will still have bus service to AK. They aren't going to expect, and frankly I don't think they could handle the load, of Contemporary guests using the resort beam, switching to the Epcot beam, then switching to the mega-line beam at Epcot for 3 stops to AK. That's why those on this thread and others who argue that monorail expansion is pointless or impractical have some ammo. Because the debate is always framed, unrealistically, that it would be busses or 'rails. When in reality it would be an efficient mix of both. High traffic patterns would be supplemented with rails, and the low-load point-to-point routes will still have busses. Without a doubt bus usage would decrease, but it would still be required. WDW has been way to built out to have the advantage of the other worldwide resorts, including DL, that could get by and a really well designed monorail system.
Originally Posted By ChiMike Strike that.. WDW has been way to built out to join the other worldwide resorts, including DL, that could take advantage of depending solely on a really well designed monorail system.
Originally Posted By Socrates Can anybody think of a WDW destination that could never be on a monorail beam? How about Shades of Green? Socrates "The unexamined life is not worth living."
Originally Posted By ChiMike ^ But I could see them add some sort of transit ground transportation between AK and AKL.
Originally Posted By ChiMike Which potentially could get it close to a potential, hypothetical monorail stop at AK
