Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< How many atheists does it take to change a light bulb? There's no point in changing a bulb, because there's no light. If there was, all light bulbs would be the same. >>> There's quite a bit of ground between RCC or LDS has a monopoly on the truth, and there being no light. All too frequently, people who point out issues with organized religion are branded as non-believers.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder I believe in God and the Golden Rule. The Mormons believe in something entirely different.
Originally Posted By utahjosh We believe in loving one another. We look at Prop 8 differently, but we still try to love everyone.
Originally Posted By DAR <<There's quite a bit of ground between RCC or LDS has a monopoly on the truth>> As a member of the RCC I believe that everyone else is just a bunch of pagans
Originally Posted By fkurucz <<It was quite clear that it was more than that. That was what he was taught. >> Then he was taught wrong: From the Catechism of the Catholic Church. PART 1, SECTION 2 2, CHAPTER 3 3, ARTICLE 9, PARAGRAPH 3, SUBSECTION 1, HEADING 2 819 "Furthermore, many elements of sanctification and of truth" 273 are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: "the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements." Christ's Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him, 275 and are in themselves calls to "Catholic unity."
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>As a member of the RCC I believe that everyone else is just a bunch of pagans <<< Nothing wrong with being a Pagan, in fact after Unitarian sentiments, paganism comes closest to my theological standpoint in life.
Originally Posted By fkurucz Some of you may have noticed that I refer to Fundamentalists (of the Jerry Falwell stripe) as "Protestant Fundamentalists" instead of as "Christian Fundamentalists". I use this nomenclature because there are Christian Fundamentalists who are not Protestant. For instance, there are Catholic Fundamentalist groups out there, many of which who do not recognize the current Pope as the leader of the Church (some even appoint their own Popes). It is often within the confines of these groups that one encounters the "Protestants are not Christians" mindset.
Originally Posted By fkurucz Oh, and I would suggest to anyone who is confused or curious as to what the RCC teaches to consult the Catechism. There is an online version at: <a href="http://www.kofc.org/publications/cis/catechism/index.cfm" target="_blank">http://www.kofc.org/publicatio...ndex.cfm</a>
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<We believe in loving one another. We look at Prop 8 differently, but we still try to love everyone.>>> Seems like you haven't tried hard enough... If you really did you would truely see both sides of prop 8 - and realize how selfish your side was.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>If you really did you would truely see both sides of prop 8 - and realize how selfish your side was.<< Hear, hear. But after 2,000 some posts on the subject, Josh is right where he was on post #1. He won't budge on this until he gets the word from his church to do so. They give the marching orders, he follows them without question. He claims that some members of the LDS voted no on Prop 8. Why can they think for themselves but he cannot? Will they face some sort of afterlife retribution for voting against their church's wishes? That's for him to wrestle with.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***>>If you really did you would truely see both sides of prop 8 - and realize how selfish your side was.<<*** This has nothing to do with the topic. In fact, Josh, you haven't actually commented on the topic itself despite your several posts. Do you have any thoughts on the matter? Kindy save your other comments regarding mormon bigotry for those other topics.
Originally Posted By Mr X Oops, meant to quote Josh's thing about "we see prop 8 differently". No matter, the quote is also off along the same tangent (though I realize it's a reply to Josh). That stuff has plenty of dedicated threads so can we at least keep this one on topic? Josh, if your point is to just come in here and derail the thread, please don't.
Originally Posted By utahjosh Ok - back on topic: Here is the church's response: <a href="http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/commentary/church-responds-to-jewish-news-statements" target="_blank">http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnew...atements</a> "The Church stands by its word. It has no intention of performing baptisms or other rites in its temples for Holocaust victims, except in the very rare instances where such people may have living descendants who are members of the Church." "Church leaders and members empathize with the depth of feeling of all Jews regarding the Holocaust. Such regard and empathy have motivated the Church to remain in talks about this subject for so many years."
Originally Posted By Mr X What garbage. So, essentially, they "won't do it", except when then deign to make exceptions? You're perfectly okay with this, huh Josh?
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains Wait --- so if a Jewish person has survived the Holocaust and for some reason their descendants become a member of the LDS then the feelings of the Holocaust victim is not important... The LDS member's feeling somehow superceed that of the Survivor??? That is so wrong... Ohh and this is only regarding those that have survived the Holocaust!?!?!?
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "...except in the very rare instances where such people may have living descendants who are members of the Church." So does this mean the descendants are consulted or does it just happen anyway?
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder Still and all, it doesn't sound like they're doing it to the dead with the permission of the dead.
Originally Posted By beamerdog btw, I'm sure the number of just Jews killed was in the millions, not thousands. That doesn't count other ethnicities, gays, "mentally deficients" and catholics, including nuns who were raped and tortured. How does the Catholic church feel about that? <a href="http://tinyurl.com/6mcz6j" target="_blank">http://tinyurl.com/6mcz6j</a>
Originally Posted By iamsally >>>I just can't get over this. The arrogance of it all. I've never heard of such a thing. There is no defending this practice.<<< Hear hear! ! ! I could not have stated it better myself. When I first heard of *baptisms for the dead* I was appalled. Though I feel it really will have no effect on my soul after I am dead; I find it terribly offensive that anyone would try to change my faith (or lack of it).
Originally Posted By DVC_dad <<<Personally, I'm down with it myself (I always hedge), >>> X,sometimes you post something that brings me to tears of laughter.
