Originally Posted By TDR_Fan ^ And they find Pirates of the Caribbean, one of the best Disney attractions ever, boring for some reason! There's never a line for it, or Sindbad at Tokyo DisneySea. Hopefully, the refurbs will increase the popularity of both. Back on topic, I thought the new film for Epcot's Soarin' was trip around the world to fit in with the Land Pavillion. When did they decide to change the film to a trip around America?
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA <Personally, I don't think it's necessary to have Disney characters, or any characters in every single attraction.> Boy, amen to that sentiment. I think 'Soarin' Over California' works great as it is. And there ain't a character to be found. Then again, I like 'Golden Dreams' and 'Seasons of the Vine' so take that for what it's worth.
Originally Posted By The Goddess Mara Jim, my new-found pal: I ALSO like Golden Dreams and Seasons of the Vine. Both are excellent films (Golden Dreams being made by an Oscar award winning Dutch director). They've really been lost in the "I-Hate-Whoopie" and "DCA is a Shithole" kick that so many feel the need to go on.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros There is plenty of space to build Soarin behind the ruins in TDS. Using the ruler on Google Earth, I measured the DCA building to be about 100 ft X 255 ft (plus some little attached building off to the side that I'm not sure what it is, either backstage for DCA or DTD). Measuring the space behind the ruins, using the right angle in the trees that border between the park and all the pavement, there is about 150 ft before reaching the water, and around 375 ft before having to work around the access road behind the Monorail roundhouse. There seems to be a backstage road leading up to the top of the ruins (diagonally across the site), but it looks like that could probably be moved so it would run between the current building (appears to be part of the Mira Costa, but may just be a random backstage building) and the new Soarin' building. Since the path inside the park right there is much higher than on the other side of the trees, this would also allow them to hide the building better, as it would have a much smaller portion of the building above the height of the current ruins and trees. As for building it over the water, I think that would be a really bad plan. The building in DCA is huge, and the actual floor level of the attraction is about 20 feet below ground level. This would require that the entire building be built an additional 30+ feet in the air, making it at least 50 feet taller than its DCA counterpart. While I have no doubt that it could be disguised to fit in, it would be huge and would compromise the visual impact of Mt Prometheus. It would also be extremely difficult to actually construct, due to the massive ride equipment inside the building, which is very heavy, and would also require an amazing foundation. Add into that the earthquakes in the Tokyo area and the park being built on landfill, and it would be a real feat of engineering that would really not be worth it, especially when they could just relocate a backstage parking lot.
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA The Goddess Mara, my new BFF! I don't follow the negativity toward Whoopi Goldberg. Then again, I don't follow the negativity toward Rosie O'Donnell, either so there ya go.
Originally Posted By The Goddess Mara Ferret: if you had seen the Soarin' building in Orlando you'd know how enormous it is when none of it is underground (which it can't be because of the water table in Orlando). The building is so huge that, from the other side of the World Showcase, it looks like an airplane hanger. It would really kill the whole look of that area between the two Tokyo parks unless they were really clever about it. What's the water table like in an area that's all built on landfill like DisneySea?
Originally Posted By TDLFAN >>TDLR<< ARGH!! The place is NOT called "Tokyo Disneyland Resort"!!!! The proper name is TOKYO DISNEY RESORT. TDR for short. Please learn this for once and for all!!!
Originally Posted By The Goddess Mara Lots of people don't like Whoopie (however you spell it) Goldberg for various reasons, but one of them is that her appearances became ubiquitous and too much of anything becomes tiresome after awhile. She's a talented woman, very funny, and a good (not great) actress. I think she does an excellent job in Golden Dreams, and the movie itself is a well-done look at how the state of California came to be. Of course, it was tainted from the getgo because initially it was supposed to be an enormous production with moving sets and lots of audio animatronic figures along the lines of The American Adventure at Epcot--that was before the budget got slashed. So, you end up with a good movie (which may be out of place in a theme park) with one small special Madame-Leota-type effect. It's just an easy thing for the DCA smashers to carry on about. The fact that it draws few people says more about the number of patrons in the park than anything else--this type of attraction is always most used when the park is busy and there are long lines for everything else.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo For me, Golden Dreams and Soarin' were the high point attractions at our last DL visit. Love them both (but I too like Seasons of the Vine and think Space Mountain is not worth waiting more than 10 minutes for).
Originally Posted By leemac <<Personally, I don't think it's necessary to have Disney characters, or any characters in every single attraction. >> Try telling that to OLC. The refurb of Sindbad was an uphill struggle that took five years to get approval as they were desperate to get the characters in there. They also forced them on to Mythica too. <<Besides, you really can't tell what the Japanese will enjoy or reject: look at Raging Spirits, which is a dreadful coaster. >> To be fair the coaster has two major issues: a low capacity and a very poor operational record (both for 101s and guest loading) so I'd expect it to have lines. They also assign significantly more FPs to RS than normal.
Originally Posted By Malin Lee's right here and another example would be BraviSEAmo,which only added the Mickey intro to please OLC. As for OLC plans for the future I don't see them adding a non Disney park,as most theme parks execs realise without a suscesful brand a theme park is nothing.But I could see them opening new parks with the Disney name on them in other areas of Japan.And than we have the other rumour that Al Lutz made about a possible third park being planned on reclaim land out in Tokyo bay,next to the other two parks.
Originally Posted By The Goddess Mara "To be fair the coaster has two major issues: a low capacity and a very poor operational record (both for 101s and guest loading) so I'd expect it to have lines. They also assign significantly more FPs to RS than normal." If it's a stinky ride, no one wants to go on it. The Japanese think Sindbad is a stinky ride and they don't want to ride it--so there's no line. They must like Raging Spirits because they go on it--they get FastPasses for it, and so they're going on it, and they like it because they're willing to wait on the ridiculously long standby line (no matter what the cause is--that's irrelevant to the fact that they DO wait on it). What kind of wait does the identical Indy ride have at Disneyland Paris?
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< >>Personally, I don't think it's necessary to have Disney characters, or any characters in every single attraction. << Try telling that to OLC. >>> <<< Lee's right here and another example would be BraviSEAmo,which only added the Mickey intro to please OLC. >>> I don't think that it's some sort of hangup with OLC - it seems pretty clear that putting the characters in TDS is being driven by guest response, not just some quirk of OLC management. I would imagine that it's a constant creative struggle, trying to keep the unique aspects of TDS intact ("it's not just another TDL") while at the same time responding to what seems to be an overwhelming guest response to the characters.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN Similarly^^^ when they opened EPCOT in 1982, it was free of Disney Characters and MK connections. That concept failed as guests demanded the characters...and look at EPCOT now. >>Try telling that to OLC.<< Seems to me this they are very much in tune with what the japanese audience wants, which apparently Imagineering isn't. >>The refurb of Sindbad was an uphill struggle that took five years to get approval as they were desperate to get the characters in there.<< And look how it bombed in attendance, and while the jury is out on the new changes, I believe they will do little to imporve it, but I reserve my right to change my opinion after I ride it. >>They also forced them on to Mythica too.<< And the show is just as glorious with them, and play an important part to what otherwise would have been a boring show, had not the characters been included. Besides, I heard no complaints from you or Lindsay when we watched it *together*.
Originally Posted By The Goddess Mara Isn't this the same situation in which Disney found itself with California Adventure, and Epcot, neither of which had any traditional Disney characters in place upon opening, and have since seen a heavy infusion of characters in direct response to guest requests?
Originally Posted By leemac <<And the show is just as glorious with them, and play an important part to what otherwise would have been a boring show, had not the characters been included. >> I would have preferred the characters not to feature in the show. I never felt that they were needed and that they do detract from the rest of the storyline and show. However you have to pick your battles with OLC when you are at Disney and that battle may have been lost by the creative team but they managed to win many others.
Originally Posted By leemac <<a boring show>> I don't believe that there has ever been a better example of Disney entertainment product so the removal of the characters would never make it "boring" in my eyes. The show is flawless. Only Finding Nemo comes close to that level of amazement and creativity.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN I agree. Nemo is right up there. I even told Doobie personally on our first show viewing how TDR-quality the production was...and definitely an asset to DAK. I am quite pleased to see this level of quality at WDW.
Originally Posted By leemac ^^ You should see it again if you have the chance. A lot of tweaks were put in place last Wednesday that make a difference. Try and spot the differences.
