Originally Posted By CuriouserConstance It may not be politically correct to say it, but it's too bad laws and legislation have to be made by people because 99% of people suck!
Originally Posted By Mr X ***Many Americans have this idyllic notion of the 1950s in their head and they lament that we can't get back to the "good old days." *** Many heterosexual white men, you mean (and some stepford-style wives of said men). ***They don't get how insulting they're being; the "good old days" weren't that good for blacks, women, gays, single-parents, etc.*** I'm not so sure they don't "get it". For your typical North American bigot, the 50's WERE paradise on Earth. And I'm sure many of them would love to vault America right back to the way things were, and are in fact trying hard to do so (like in this example). I'm also getting sick of this "how can we use GOVERNMENT dollars to insert-thing-personally-morally-outraged-about-here!" notion. If it's legal, and Americans engage in it, it deserves government dollars just as much as anything else that's eligible for government dollars.
Originally Posted By Sport Goofy I don't think it's fair to say that the 50's were only paradise for bigots. I think you have to look at the total context of what happened in the decade after World War II. The United States was the only country with inudstrial capacity left on the planet. The New Deal provided a framework for a middle class to exist in America that never existed at any other time in this country's history. Depression-era families soon obtained middle class wealth. The nostalgia of the 50's isn't all about Jim Crow and segregated society -- America's middle class truly advanced in way that were unprecedented. Now, we live in a society where the next generation will be worse off than the one that came before. It has nothing to do with racial norms or bigotry, just plain old economics. Unfortunately, there are bigots in this world that use 50s nostalgia to advance their agenda of hate. They call themselves conservatives, and ignore the progressive actions of the United States government that allowed the 50s (and 60s) to be an economically uplifting time for so many middle class Americans.
Originally Posted By mele I love that people think their tax dollars shouldn't go towards any sort of acknowledgment that there are homosexuals in the world. A former LPers actually said that his children shouldn't have to learn that there are gay people while attending PUBLIC school. They say they just don't want the definition of marriage to change but then the same people back laws that make it legal to fire someone because they are gay. They say that they don't care what people do, they just don't want it jammed down their throats. But, in reality, they want gays to go back into hiding. For them, the 1950's were GREAT because nearly every homosexual was in the closet. Their precious children didn't have to know that there were people unlike themselves on the planet.
Originally Posted By CuriouserConstance This whole topic makes me so angry, I can't even stand to talk about it. And when I think that a lot of the people in charge of creating and enacting laws are trying to keep this country from becoming more accepting and equal to everyone, it just makes me feel like screaming.
Originally Posted By gurgitoy2 "It's really sad, and a complete re-write of what history was! I get the feeling that what these people are really "nostalgic" for is this fairy-tale, perfect white-people world that is depicted in the tv shows. Nevermind that it never actually existed - they want it anyway, and screw anyone else!" Yes, on the surface the 1950's seemed like the perfect time to be white and middle class. Like Sport Goofy stated, the middle class exploded in the 50's after the war. The thing about that period though was that so much was boiling under the surface. There was this perception of squeaky clean "family values" image, but beneath that, was the usual sort of stuff that people didn't want to talk about. It was all about trying to repress any undesirable feelings, people, or ideas. I'm sure from the perspective of a minority in the 1950's they wouldn't feel the least big nostalgic about it. I've spoken to my friend's dad who came to New York from Puerto Rico in the 50's and said just how tough it was to survive then. Lord help you if you were not white and middle class.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox For those who haven't seen it, check out "Far From Heaven" with Julianne Moore and Dennis Quaid. Totally nails the myth of the Fifties' White Suburban Middle Class.
Originally Posted By gurgitoy2 That one and "The Hours", which came out the same year and also starred Julianne Moore.
Originally Posted By snappyfun >>Totally nails the myth of the Fifties' White Suburban Middle Class.<< I know right, there was no White Suburban Middle Class in the fifties, it was all made up by evil white men.
Originally Posted By plpeters70 <<I know right, there was no White Suburban Middle Class in the fifties>> Do you have reading comprehension problems or something? I don't know why I bother, but no one was saying that there wasn't a White Middle Class in the 50s, just that it wasn't at all like what was depicted on all those old tv shows. But I'm sure you already knew that...
Originally Posted By snappyfun >>I don't know why I bother, but no one was saying that there wasn't a White Middle Class in the 50s, just that it wasn't at all like what was depicted on all those old tv shows<< Well first of all it was a TV show not a documentary, but it was a simpler time, a more innocent time. Was life in the 50’s just like the TV shows no probably not, but it was a reflection of the times just like shows like Two and a half men are a reflection of the times we live in today. Many people look at the shows of the 50’s and they know that there just TV shows but they know they rather live in a country that put on those shows then the one that puts on the garbage they see now.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 You're missing the point (again). The 50's actually were a very good time in America economically - the US was virtually alone in not having its industrial capacity severely damaged by the war, union membership was at an all-time high, the GI bill meant more people than ever could afford decent housing and an education, and the progressive policies put in place by FDR paid big dividends in the post-war years. However - the 50's weren't unalloyed good times for everyone. Yes, the economy was good, but if you were black you didn't have access to the best jobs, you effectively couldn't even vote in the south, and you had daily assaults to your dignity in the form of Jim Crow. If you were a woman, you likewise did not have access to innumerable jobs that you could do perfectly well, if you did work you made a fraction of what a man doing the same job made (still the case, but not nearly so severe), in many states if you were married you could not even own your own business in your own name, etc. If you were gay you almost certainly had to be closeted, either had to live a lie in a bad marriage or not marry at all, and faced daily indignities and fear that your secret could come out and you'd lose your job, your standing in the community, and just about everything else. It really depends who you were if you think of the 50's as idyllic. Talk to, say, a black person who lived through Jim Crow. They may have liked the TV shows too. But they know those shows didn't tell the whole story.
Originally Posted By mele I don't think people were really anymore "innocent" back in the 1950's. Innocent about what? Sure, maybe the white middle-class was naive about the living conditions of people other than themselves but that doesn't mean there wasn't a lot of crime, poverty, drug addiction, rape, homosexuality, etc going on as there is now. It's incredibly naive to think so.
Originally Posted By mele Oops, meant to separate the crime stuff from the sex stuff...forgot to add in more of the sex stuff, too. LOL. I think back to when there were secret gay bars when police would occasionally raid them and beat/arrest all of the people inside. This was extremely common. There are still stakes with laws making homosexual acts illgal. Oh yeah, let's go back to that wonderful, innocent time. Hell, a bar raid just happened in Texas last year. Yay! It's the 1950s all over again!
Originally Posted By snappyfun >>However - the 50's weren't unalloyed good times for everyone.<< There never was and never will be good times for everyone.
Originally Posted By Labuda ^^^ Especially not as long as you have one of the largest religions in the world covering up child rape on a regular basis.
Originally Posted By Lady Starlight People were just quiet( hush hush) about what went on in the 50's vs today. Thats all..Same stuff different time.
