Originally Posted By hopemax I'm not sure unions are the answer. DH got a degree in Aeronautical & Astronautical engineering, and then got hired with Boeing. When Boeing went through its rough period after they merged with McDonnell Douglas and the dot.com bubble burst, Boeing needed to layoff a bunch of engineers. DH was one of them. It was entirely senority based because of the union contract. Everyone had a "retention number" and you could get a bump up 1 level based on performance(and DH did), but the biggest part of your retention number was years of service. The cuts were so deep that because DH was only there 18 months and so that one level bump didn't matter. Everyone in his age range was laid off (although he did have a nice union mandated severance package). Then there was a second round of cuts after 9/11. And now the company is running into a problem; the people the union contract protected are reaching retirement age, and there is a serious brain drain with very few people still around to replace them. DH had to change fields to find another job, because at the other aerospace companies it was the same story.
Originally Posted By johnno52 >Take a look at Toyota. They make better, more reliable, more fuel efficient cars than US manufacturers< This was the case however the US automakers have caught up in as far as costs and quality. I work for a GM plant manufacturing transmissions and at least 5 years ago we beat Toyota in both of these areas. Many North Americans still have that "all Japanese and Euro cars are better" mentality. There are so many quality control systems in the manufacturing process that any negligence by workers is caught before the part or total auto is released.
Originally Posted By fkurucz <<Computer programmers who think they are the smartest thing since god invented brains, don't like unions. Instead, they'll work long hours with no pay to make someone else rich.>> Oh so true!
Originally Posted By jonvn "It might work for service workers (such as retail or restaurant) where there's no option to outsource, but for manufacturing, it will just make the problem worse." It will work for walmart, too. "the people the union contract protected are reaching retirement age" Then perhaps they should hire your husband back. What the union did was the appropriate thing in Boeing's case. People want to decry unions, but they are the absolutely only thing the average person has to protect them.
Originally Posted By jonvn "Many North Americans still have that "all Japanese and Euro cars are better" mentality. " Mainly because they are. You have to be an idiot to buy an American car.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< "It might work for service workers (such as retail or restaurant) where there's no option to outsource, but for manufacturing, it will just make the problem worse." It will work for walmart, too. >>> Wal*Mart would generally be considered part of retail.
Originally Posted By johnno52 Like I said, even when a US plant outscores a foreign company in quality and costs the the low mentality of the US buyer still cannot accept the truth! case in point (42)
Originally Posted By jonvn Go read a consumer reports magazine. That tells the entire story. America cars are not reliable, do not hold their value, do not perform well, are not economical and do not even look good. When that turns around, I'll buy another American car. The last one, with three transmissions and going on the fourth when I finally got rid of it a couple years ago, was my last.
Originally Posted By johnno52 A friends Pontiac Vibe which has a Toyota transmission in it completely seized at 80,000 miles! He checked the web and found many other Toyota Matrix (sister model) had many of the same complaints. So you are saying this only happens to US autos? The GM plant I work for periodically buy back Taxi transmissions many with 300,000Km for parts inspections.
Originally Posted By johnno52 If we all keep thinking of our own selfish needs and not the whole picture we will all be working for foreign companies or non at all. The US economy is going into a tailspin and with the value of your dollar even these overseas luxuries will be too expensive for you. The way the multi national corporations are going and investing in India and China any loss of revenue in the US will be made up ten fold in the new emerging markets there. Over 2 billion potential buyers in exchange for 200 million US buyers. Priceless!
Originally Posted By jonvn "A friends Pontiac Vibe which has a Toyota transmission in it completely seized at 80,000 miles! " Wow. I would have liked 80,000 miles. "So you are saying this only happens to US autos?" No.
Originally Posted By jonvn "If we all keep thinking of our own selfish needs" Yes, how awful of me to want a car that I spend tens of thousands of dollars on to be reliable and economical. I must be crazy.
Originally Posted By johnno52 The autoworkers get laid off The retailer clerks where they spend their money are laid off The teachers where their children went to school are laid off The City services are cut down as the properties are vacant Is this similar to the poem you posted? The city of Flint Michigan is an example to things to come for many US manufacturing cites. Enjoy your well manufactured foreign products. By the way Wallmart is a mega US success story for China
Originally Posted By johnno52 The autoworkers get laid off The retailer clerks where they spend their money are laid off The teachers where their children went to school are laid off The City services are cut down as the properties are vacant Is this similar to the poem you posted? The city of Flint Michigan is an example to things to come for many US manufacturing cites. Enjoy your well manufactured foreign products. By the way Wallmart is a mega US success story for China
Originally Posted By jonvn I don't shop at Walmart. I see no reason to. When your company stops making crap, I'll consider buying something from them. Since they can't seem to do that, then they deserve to go out of business.
