Originally Posted By EighthDwarf <<I understand and appreciate how powerful love is, I just dont believe it is exclusive to our species. We give ourselves far too much credit in regard to that particular emotion.>> I think that's true with emotions in general. However, logic is a different story. I do think we are the only species that possesses logic, though we don't always choose to use it.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***I've also seen God in the eyes of my brother who went blind 4-5 years ago, because he abused his body and the gifts he was given as a human being.*** So, what about the person who took good care of himself and went blind anyway? Or, conversely, the person who abuses himself and others all his life who ends up winning the lottery and landing some beautiful wife or two (who he also abuses)? Again, what does any of that have to do with some god, and in particular some god that people claim is constantly intervening and "helping" them, often with so-called "miracles"?
Originally Posted By Mr X RT, yes I see where you're coming from better after post 96. It is certainly a powerful argument.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "So, what about the person who took good care of himself and went blind anyway? Or, conversely, the person who abuses himself and others all his life who ends up winning the lottery and landing some beautiful wife or two (who he also abuses)? Again, what does any of that have to do with some god, and in particular some god that people claim is constantly intervening and "helping" them, often with so-called "miracles"?" None of your questions have anything to do with the God I sre, only yours.
Originally Posted By Mr X That doesn't make sense. And anyway, I don't see *any* god, I think the whole idea is ridiculous.
Originally Posted By pecos bill In fact, the belief in Gods is on the decline, even in the United States. Roughly 11 percent of the population admits to a total disbelief in Gods, and 45 percent still believe, but have doubts. These numbers are rising anually thanks to the information age. As I have said before, knowledge is the greatest enemy of religion. Worth noting is the fact that some of the more prosperous and progressive nations in the world, such as Sweden, Norway and Denmark, have the highest rates of atheism, some as much as 40 percent. In fact, in Europe proper, the younger generations are distancing themselves from religion in huge numbers. Eventually the current crop of Gods will go the way of Odin, Isis, Amon-Re, Osiris, Nebo, Shalem, Sokk-mimi, Dea-Dia, Saturn, Tammuz, Athena, Ubilulu, Pluto, Vesta, U-ki, Persephone, Istar, Apollo, Mami, Kaawanu, and hundreds of others too numerous to name, in the extinct Gods category. According to H.L. Mencken, "They were gods of the highest standing and dignity-gods of civilized peoples-worshipped and believed in by millions. All were theoretically omnipotent, omniscient, and immortal. And all are dead."
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "That doesn't make sense. And anyway, I don't see *any* god, I think the whole idea is ridiculous." Yeah, we know. By "seeing". I mean envision, or what your idea of God is all about. You have these notions as to what God should be, otherwise you wouldn't be asking all these questions. The God I see allows for suffering, etc. It's part of the free will idea. He gives guidance, and it's up to the person do follow or not.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>The God I see allows for suffering, etc. It's part of the free will idea. He gives guidance, and it's up to the person do follow or not. <<< Like Zeus or Odin did?
Originally Posted By Mr X ***You have these notions as to what God should be*** I don't think so. Actually I DO have notions of what "god" might be, but I've never expressed them on LP. That's very personal. What I talk about here is the way god comes across when portrayed by religious folk.
Originally Posted By Mr X I think I'll start worshipping Sokk-mimi. What a cool name! And not even a wiki article to be found. Tres mysterious. What was that god all about, pecos bill?
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I would be really enlightened to hear your views Mr X, afterall everyone else tends to share. FWIW I think there is likely to be a higher being, but I cannot sign up to conventional organised religion.
Originally Posted By Mr X It's nothing earthshattering, Dave. Read "the power of now", and check out anything on youtube involving Eckhart Tolle. If there were a place I'd call a "beginning" for spirituality, it's him. I consider the power of now to be a bible of sorts. Interestingly, he really digs the bible, and speaks kindly about religions (he refers to religion as sometimes being an open door to enlightenment, but sometimes a closed door. Closed as soon as you get dogmatic and saying "this is the right way. all other ways must be wrong"). So, like I said I have personal views and they're not something I feel that comfortable discussing even if I did think I could put it into words properly, but I think it starts with knowing that things are way, WAY too vast to even begin comprehending, and yet somehow we're all connected to it (even passholder ).
Originally Posted By Mr X Yeah, do that. Unfortunately, he seems to be really upsetting the fundementalist christians these days. I've read all kinds of crazy accusations, like he's "leading millions to hell", and "quieting peoples' minds so demons can enter" and all that. Don't be surprised when you get to the "comments" sections on YouTube. Predictably hysterical is about the best way to describe it. I hear Oprah is a big fan though.
Originally Posted By mele Yeah, I've been reading A New Earth and some of the threads people are writing on Oprah's message board are outright crazy. I think his book is interesting...I feel the same as he does in many ways, yet I am really not in love with his writing style. Or the fact that he worships the Devil. ;-) However, X, I find it interesting that you would say your own views of God are so personal and you're keeping them private but don't seem to have a problem telling other people that their views of God are lacking.
Originally Posted By Mr X <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg9lY7_hCGA&feature=related" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...=related</a> <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDeLYSu8RPE&feature=related" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...=related</a> A couple examples of Eckhart Tolle. I browsed through the comments section and didn't see any bad language or anything, but do avoid if you don't want to get caught up in hearing about how this guy is trying to ruin christianity or whatever.
Originally Posted By EighthDwarf Thanks for the receommendation X man, I will go check out that book as well. And I know what you mean about your own views - I don't like to express much of what I believe because they are things that I have come to know through my personal experience and studies - and other people have different experiences so they won't necessarily understand. But it makes me happy to know that I am not the only one who thinks about the deeper meanings to things outside of traditional religion. There are so many out there that take in only what is spoon-fed to them.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***However, X, I find it interesting that you would say your own views of God are so personal and you're keeping them private but don't seem to have a problem telling other people that their views of God are lacking.*** You're right, I misspoke. I have some views on spirituality, not "god" as it were. And usually the reason I get steamed about people expressing their take on god here it's when they are bashing you over the head with it, trying to tell everyone else that they should believe the same thing, telling you they pity or feel sorry for you because you don't "understand", or otherwise play those centuries old games of religious oneupmanship.
Originally Posted By mele Yes, I do think that you have made that clearer in the past few days/weeks than maybe before. (At least, I do realize those are more your feelings now than I did in earlier threads.) As to how Tolle would feel about how we flex our egos in WE, I would be afraid to hear. ;-)
