Originally Posted By dcwmjm Check out this recent article in the Chicago Tribune which gives a brief overview of Dubai with comparisons to Walt's orginal vision of EPCOT. <a href="http://www.chicagotribune.com/travel/chi-dubai_pm_rcdec09" target="_blank">http://www.chicagotribune.com/ travel/chi-dubai_pm_rcdec09</a>,0,5184330.story Also, the following link provides a brief summary of how EPCOT evolved. <a href="http://www.abcarticledirectory.com/Article/A-Brief-History-of-Disney-World-s-EPCOT-Center/119813" target="_blank">http://www.abcarticledirectory .com/Article/A-Brief-History-of-Disney-World-s-EPCOT-Center/119813</a> Just imagine the range of responses that would come forth if Disney announced it was considering constructing the "City of Tomorrow" on the Florida property! It's a vision that is unbelievable and seems almost taboo to bring up today. Yet...isn't that what being a great visionary is all about? Isn't that what WDW was all about?
Originally Posted By dcwmjm Dubia link doesn't work. If you search the web for "dubia: the new gold coast" the Chicago Tribune article will appear. FYI...Here's the title of the article with subtitle - Dubai: The new Gold Coast In Dubai, the sky is not the limit in a fantasy world far beyond Disney
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> Will Disney still be around in 50 years? I don't think there is any question about that << Anything can happen in 50 years. A depression, a global virus, a rival to the Disney company, or a change in peoples tastes. 50 years is both a long and a short time - Disneyland is just over 50, and life is so different than when it first opened. There is nothing I can look at and say "that will still be here in 50 years". That said - there are many places to vacation. It is probably good to take some time off and explore other options (even if it was Tokyo Disney, or HK, etc.). There are places out in the Tokyo area that I'd really like to see too.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip It won't be a Theme Park, but the University of Minnesota is developing a "community for tomorrow" that has goals similar to the original vision for Epcot. The goals are less grandiose, and therefore much more achievable. It should be very interesting to watch it develop. <<It is the future. It unfolds over 25 years. It is anchored in the traditions and unique strengths of the University of Minnesota. Discovery. Innovation. Opportunity. It is vibrant. Engaging. Enduring…with value, partnerships, and benefits for people and families. It is a community. The vision is a community that embodies the future of better living. It will achieve the core attributes that we all want for our homes and communities: It will be convenient, comfortable, safe and provide amenities in an attractive setting. But it will offer much more — because of the University of Minnesota. This community for tomorrow comes to life through the University’s unique imprimatur of education and discovery that brings quality of life to individuals and their families. Its three hallmarks are the integrated elements of (1) education, (2) health and (3) energy. This University-founded community offers the life-enriching benefits of work, culture, recreation, discovery, education, healthy living and renewable energy in a sustainable environment. People can live, learn, work and play in one place. What we now know as UMore Park is the place.>> Link: <a href="http://www.umorepark.umn.edu/" target="_blank">http://www.umorepark.umn.edu/</a>
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost >>>I still go back to the vision...EPCOT. Interesting how that doesn't spark further conversation. Well...some are experimenting in the concept of EPCOT.<<< The topic doesn't spark conversation because there is nothing really to discuss. Just our own separate opinions. My opinion! I don't think it would have worked in this country. It is way to Stepford wives. All of us presume our ability to deal with our own property in whatever manner (legal) we want. This city was too totally structured, regulated and, dare I say it, totalitarian to have ever worked. In a way I am glad that he did die before this was ever started. I think it would have sunk the Disney Company and we wouldn't even have the stuff we have today. I think it was doomed to failure. They tried it in a much smaller form in Celebration. Maybe not the transportation angle but the rigid governing was implemented. It didn't work even for a small community. People that paid a lot of money for a home there basically got sick of some faceless committee deciding what the could and could not do with their own property. It was a grand, idealistic plan, but, I cannot see how it would have worked in conjunction with our attitudes!
Originally Posted By nbodyhome Looking at the Dubai article, I would have to agree with Goofyernmost. There is nothing in the Dubai article that would entice me to live there. Personally, I don't want to live in an overly manufactured setting. It's bad enough having to deal with homeowners associations. I wouldn't live in Celebration, though it's fun to occasionally visit.
Originally Posted By jonvn If you do too much of anything, eventually you get tired of it, get bored, get jaded, and you no longer derive pleasure from it. I was just at WDW. I didn't notice ANY cleanliness problems, or maintenance problems. The service was fine, the food was good, mostly. You can't keep doing these things. These parks were not meant to be visited so very often, and not meant to be gone over with a fine toothed comb. I love hot fudge sundaes, but if I ate them every single meal, I'd grow quickly tired of them. You need to do other things, go other places, immerse yourself in other activities. This is a big world. There are lots of places to go. Stop going to Disney parks if they are not enjoyable for you, or go far less often. It will make the times you do go far more enjoyable.
Originally Posted By Bob Paris "I wouldn't live in Celebration, though it's fun to occasionally visit." Or drive through, as we did. We got lost and went around the block once or twice. The stuck up Stepford snobs were so paranoid about someone driving through their streets, people came out onto their porches to watch us and make sure we didn't make off with one of their regulation lawn gnomes. YUCK!
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>You can't keep doing these things. These parks were not meant to be visited so very often, and not meant to be gone over with a fine toothed comb<<< I agree, however I wouldn't call going to WDW every 6 years, and DL every 6 years very often, would you? >>>You need to do other things, go other places, immerse yourself in other activities. This is a big world. There are lots of places to go. <<< Well I have, in the same timeframe between those trips we have toured France, Spain, Mallorca, Belgium, parts of the UK (plus I travel extensively in the UK for work). I have driven tanks, gone to the theatre, and engaged in international projects. Our upcoming California trip, only 29% is Disney orientated. So I do diversify my attention. jonvn, it may be that WDW has cleaned up their act in the cleanliness and maintenance stakes based upon your and Mr X's recent experiences, or maybe we caught them during an off time in 2006. But I stand by my disgust of the MK running upchare parties throughout the Spring including Saturdays to the detriment of day guests.
Originally Posted By jonvn "I agree, however I wouldn't call going to WDW every 6 years, and DL every 6 years very often, would you?" Not really, no. But if it's too much even at that rate...it's still too much. "But I stand by my disgust of the MK running upchare parties throughout the Spring including Saturdays to the detriment of day guests." If people are dumb enough to give them money for this...I don't see why they do, though. I mean, what do you get? A parade and fireworks? We were able on our last visit to do absolutely everything in MK we wanted to do. We did miss the steamship and the carousel and the island, by choice. But every other ride we went on, and still had time left. We saw parades and fireworks, too. I just don't see the reasoning. But Disney would not be selling this if people were not buying it. There has also been a long history of Disney selling to private parties and closing their parks early. It's nothing new. What is new is that the private party is now open to the public. That's pretty much all it is.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo What is new is they are doing this on a busy Saturday!!! That is new. It makes the MK busier and the other parks more crowded in the evening too.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> What is new is they are doing this on a busy Saturday!!! That is new. It makes the MK busier and the other parks more crowded in the evening too. >> I agree with you, Dave. Imagine if that happened in Disneyland, the park shut down at 7pm for a $50 private party on a weekend. Somehow I doubt the words "You can go to California Adventure" would make anyone happy. On a Tuesday, Thurs, etc., I wouldn't really care. Those evenings tend to close earlier and aren't frequented as much by locals. But I don't like that it is happening on weekends.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> You can't keep doing these things. These parks were not meant to be visited so very often << I think Disney figures they are (why else would they build DVC?) Denise
Originally Posted By jonvn I'm not sure. In olden days, even on the weekends in the off season, the park only was open to 6pm or so. Then they had private parties in the evenings. "I think Disney figures they are" Disney sees people are doing it, and are taking the opportunity to make some cash. You can't blame them. I would not buy into DVC on a bet. Any timeshare, really, but this is particularly a bad one because you don't even own the thing, it's only a lease. You pay these guys money for the right to stay at their hotel so you can pay them more money when you go to the park. I don't think so.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I love my Marriott Timeshare. It is like having a holiday home, only much cheaper - no mortgage, management fees, cleaner fees etc. And then you can travel around the globe. It is like having a luxury 2bdrm suite for a week at a cost of one night comparitor. It is not for everyone, but I am totally satisfied and wish I did it sooner. In fact, it's experiencing Marriott quality for a lesser cost than Disney that has added to my concerns around Disney's direction of travel.
Originally Posted By Witches of Morva ORGOCH: I think jonvn's onta somethin', myself. Anything ya git too much of a belly full starts ta ache after a spell. Heck!! Goin' home from work ev'ry dang night ta the same ol' house ain't no picnic, neither!! ORDDU: Some would even say going home to the same spouse every night could get boring and unappealing. ORWEN: But that doesn't mean a home, a spouse--or a theme park--shouldn't STILL do their best to try and always be attractive! ORGOCH: From the lips 'n hips of the Miss Krispy Kreme Poster gal, herself!!
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> I would not buy into DVC on a bet. Any timeshare, really, but this is particularly a bad one because you don't even own the thing, it's only a lease << I wouldn't, #1 because Disney could end up being less popular in the future, and that timeshare then would be hard to sell. And #2 - there is no flexibility. I don't want all my vacation money tied up with Disney. If I take a vacation, I may want to stay at a Bed and Breakfast, or a small family run hotel (which I tend to do overseas). I looked into DVC when it first started, and I couldn't make it work financially (looking at the points vs. how much it would cost to stay onsite). I do like the kitchen facilities, and that can save a lot of money if you have a family (I do cook on vacation, if I have an apartment).
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<I wouldn't, #1 because Disney could end up being less popular in the future, and that timeshare then would be hard to sell.>> So far that has not been a problem. People have always been able to resell for at least what they paid. Of course that will change as the points get close to their expiration date. But I would never purchase with a thought that I would resell the points later. When you buy DVC, in my opinion, you buy in for the long term. I love DVC but will be the first to admit it is not an investment. It is a pre-paid vacation plan which provides you with a substantial discount over the life of the contract. On that basis it provides considerable value. <<And #2 - there is no flexibility. I don't want all my vacation money tied up with Disney. If I take a vacation, I may want to stay at a Bed and Breakfast, or a small family run hotel (which I tend to do overseas).>> Well, actually there is. There are hotels and resorts in the 'Concierge Collection' throughout the U.S. that are directly accessible just like making reservations for a DVC unit. Locations included are San Francisco, San Diego, Chicago, Washington DC, New York City, and Maui. These locations give you complete flexibility as to length of stay. You also can exchange full weeks with literally 100's of other resorts through Interval International. There are many top notch properties available, including more Marriott Resorts than you can shake a stick at. <<I looked into DVC when it first started, and I couldn't make it work financially (looking at the points vs. how much it would cost to stay onsite). I do like the kitchen facilities, and that can save a lot of money if you have a family (I do cook on vacation, if I have an apartment).>> You can calculate this a thousand different ways and make it come out good or bad depending upon the assumptions and biases used in your calculations. I generally figure that if you are going to visit WDW anyway at least every other year and like the idea of being able to stay in Deluxe resorts at Moderate prices, then DVC is a good value for you. If you expect anything other than that it may not be. None of the strong DVC supporters on these boards, vbdad, DVC_dad and myself, make the claim that DVC is good for everyone. But it is also not bad for everyone like some of its detractors claim. Like so many other large purchases in life, whether it makes sense or not depends upon your particular situation.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Totally agree with Roadtrip's assessment, and it applies to MVCI as well. If DVC were available at all Disney resorts including Paris, then we may well have bought DVC instead (I know this is now changing). Personally I don't like B&Bs, so timeshare offer some great benefits. With the trends of Disney lately, I prefer the MVCI options (plus there are places to stay at DLP, Orlando, Newport Beach and can swap to New Otani in Tokyo).
