Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Although I am not at all happy with the direction this park has gone in recent years, I find this statement unsupportable. Does this mean that the Haunted Mansion or Splash Mountain or it's a small world at the MK are not fantasies?<<< Agreed. And there is still a lot of charm and good theme, especially on MK's West side. The east might fall flat, but Frontierland, Adventureland, and above all, Liberty Square all interact and create a fantastic illusion.
Originally Posted By Bolna <<And yes, that's how DLP works, but WDW is much more serious. It's hyper realism and environment. It's lived in. Everything there, save for the Tiki Room is rooted in what real people do. >> Hmm, not really sure about that, where do people fly around in carpets (and just to avoid any debate about those: yes, I hate them too and would like them to disappear because they don't fit, but they are there)? Where can you go on a cruise where you pass African scenery as well as an Asian temple? Isn't the Swiss Family Robinson fiction? Does Pirates in the Caribbean really show historic scenes? I would say that the bazar entrance area of DLP Adventureland is much more realistic (very much like the Morocco pavilion in Epcot) than most of WDW's Adventureland. And the area around the indy coaster looks in part like a real archeological camp. There are different elements of fantasy (or magic?) used in both lands. But I agree with what Doug said about the appropriate magic, and that fairies aren't appropriate for any Adventureland, neither at WDW nor at DLP.
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub ...I will admit it is a tough call to experience WDW's old fireworks show to my "local DLer family" last week...I was excited to "treat" them to the Top of the World at BLT to watch the fireworks but felt very embarrassed at how boring the show really was to them. I laughed and said now you realize how spoiled you are with DL's Magic. But the early morning presentation at the MK with Mickey and the Gang arriving by steamtrain with the Good Morning song and the Mayor and "townfolk' was New Magic for them;even tho it is old. Honestly I think WDW has always operated with the attitude that their audience is visiting once a year not once a week! I just think they are cost cutting themselves into poor show. Seriously just maintain and keep it looking good if you are going to keep the same old magic. I had heard the fireworks had been shortened. Do you really think we would not notice the quickest finale ever had replaced a Big bang ending?
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Hmm, not really sure about that, where do people fly around in carpets (and just to avoid any debate about those: yes, I hate them too and would like them to disappear because they don't fit, but they are there)? Where can you go on a cruise where you pass African scenery as well as an Asian temple? Isn't the Swiss Family Robinson fiction? Does Pirates in the Caribbean really show historic scenes? I would say that the bazar entrance area of DLP Adventureland is much more realistic (very much like the Morocco pavilion in Epcot) than most of WDW's Adventureland. And the area around the indy coaster looks in part like a real archeological camp. There are different elements of fantasy (or magic?) used in both lands. But I agree with what Doug said about the approprite<<< The only aberration is the Carpets, like you mentioned. Those don't fit at all, and need to be taken out. But the rest certainly do have a level of realism in them that makes them textured, believable and gritty. The fact that you visit several continents on the same river and see zombie pirates isn't an issue because of it's aesthetic. It fits that rich, cultured, theme. The overreaching story of the land allows for lots of fantasy, and "magic", like the Tiki Room, but it's in a very different tone and vibe, than, Fantasyland. The carpets, and things like Tinkerbell, are more in the vein of FL. Meanwhile, things with historic and detailed references, like Pirates, fits Adventureland, in the same way a space fantasy, like Space Mountain, fits Tomorrowland because of the aesthetic and tone. It's a fine thematic line, but a line nonetheless.
Originally Posted By Bolna <<It's a fine thematic line, but a line nonetheless. >> Oh, I absolutely agree with that. I just think your assessment of DLP's Adventureland as being more fantasy than WDW's was what got me to argue about it. Having the pirate ship there might make it sound toony, but it is not, it is a very real ship (well, at least I hope it will be once again when the refurbishment is done). Knowing that a similar setting was once included in DL's Fantasyland might make it sound less adventurous, but it does feel very textured and like a real vessel. I guess I will have to ask you once you have been to DLP whether you still think that it is more about fantasy and less about reality than WDW's. And, you know, elements of Fantasyland (and I am thinking here more about DL than WDW, but with Village Haus it is there as well) look very much like a real place, too: the villages around here where I live...
Originally Posted By HMButler79 The fact that you guys are going mental gymnastics to justify PIXIE FAIRIES in a land designed to showcase the tropics, jungles and rivers of the world, indigenous cultures, historical pirating, is the height of Disney aplogizing. You have all forgotten the basic tenants of the land themes and intent and so have WDI. TG for DL
Originally Posted By Bolna HMButler, nobody in this thread said that having the fairies in Adventureland is a good idea.
Originally Posted By TDLFAN >>>BORING! You're like a broken record-go eat so sushi and shut up.<<< I will gladly eat my sushi at Tokyo Disney resort...it's lean and lavish fun that is less expensive than WDW. So you go ahead and enjoy your fatty burgers at WDW... lots of FAT and not enough meat..yup, that's WDW for you. Just a note for you: I will shut up when the moderators feel like asking me to shut up. I don't know who you are or whether you work for Disney (which I am sure willing to bet on) but please be respectful of other posters' opinions so we can respect yours. OK? Now go on and play with your toys.
Originally Posted By 3disneylocations I don't know who you are or whether you work for Disney (which I am sure willing to bet on) <<< That's a bet you would lose... I've been to TDL early on in the mid 80's (they were just starting to build Big Thunder (or Splash Mountian-we were on the train and everything was in Nippon), Casey's Corner was serving FATTY hotdogs, other places were serving burgers and nacho's just like the MK @ WDW. In fact, the entire TDL looked an awful lot like the "stale" MK except for the over large bright green theme busting exit signs in their dark ride attractions. If I'm not mistaken, the Japanese requested a MK like FL to be built on their reclaimed land, just like that "stale" MK in Fl. Gonna go get me a California Roll in Japan @ Epcot (maybe a Kirren to wash it down).
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper Except that now, TDL far exceeds anything WDW can even dream of in service, cleanliness, food, etc.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Oh, I absolutely agree with that. I just think your assessment of DLP's Adventureland as being more fantasy than WDW's was what got me to argue about it. Having the pirate ship there might make it sound toony, but it is not, it is a very real ship (well, at least I hope it will be once again when the refurbishment is done). Knowing that a similar setting was once included in DL's Fantasyland might make it sound less adventurous, but it does feel very textured and like a real vessel. I guess I will have to ask you once you have been to DLP whether you still think that it is more about fantasy and less about reality than WDW's. <<< Well, I don't disagree about DLP. That's a totally different animal, all together. As is WDW's which is more serious, and thus not right for the Faeries. IMO. ;-) If we had a area, like DLP, it might work better.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>The fact that you guys are going mental gymnastics to justify PIXIE FAIRIES in a land designed to showcase the tropics, jungles and rivers of the world, indigenous cultures, historical pirating, is the height of Disney aplogizing. You have all forgotten the basic tenants of the land themes and intent and so have WDI. TG for DL<<< Did you even read my posts? I said the same exact thing you did. Sheesh.
Originally Posted By Bolna <<If we had a area, like DLP, it might work better.>> That's not what I have been trying to say, I don't think they would even work in DLP's Adventureland. You can't have Tinker Bell meet and greets on Captain Hook's ship in my opinion - different aspects of the same story... That's why the ride at DLP is in Fantasyland as well, it is just the transition. And the fairies belong even further into Fantasyland... Sorry for making this even more difficult... I guess I should just have agreed with your first post on this subject, but then this thing here is called a discussion board...
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub It's not just TDL people that are smug & superior acting. I get tired of the people that have not been to any Disney theme park in over a year or two having attitudes too!
Originally Posted By dshyates "God, I am so tired of the smug superiority of some TDL fans." TDL Fans are the antithesis of WDW fans at this point. TDR seems to be doing most things right. WDW, not so much.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper <<God, I am so tired of the smug superiority of some TDL fans. >> Some can be a bit much to handle, I agree. (I feel the same about Disneylanders as well sometimes) But that doesn't change the fact that the resort is run head and shoulders(like Godzilla sized head and shoulders) above WDW.
Originally Posted By GOB Or rather, those of us that haven't been to parks outside of the US don't know what we're missing. I've only visited DL and WDW thus far, and everything I've read about Tokyo points to one thing- it is operated much better than the stateside parks. Because I cannot, at this point in time, afford to travel to Asia, I will take TDL fans' words for it. Much like how I haven't been to Universal Studios (and don't plan on doing so anytime soon), I'll believe that Forbidden Journey is better than anything Disney has come up with over the past decade or so. I still visit WDW (and love it) despite knowing that it isn't anywhere near as operated as it could be, but whether or not you enjoy it (or that it's 'magical') depends solely on personal preference.
Originally Posted By HMButler79 ""God, I am so tired of the smug superiority of some TDL fans."" because they have a reason to be THATS WHY. Meanwhile, i hope you continue to get a tickle down your leg over 1/3rd of MK being taken over by Ent., NO Mono service an hour after the park closes, aging/stressed busses, rides that with maintence issues that make them look like Asian knockoffs, characters up the wazoo in EVRERY land, ANOTHER original dark ride closing for Meet n Gropes, sophisticated, adult attractions like HM turned into kiddy funhhouse daycare centers, Epcot still taken over by the Convention Dept., MGM and DAK on dialysis, and.....The Magicalness of empty building with new grass on PI! Now go clutch your Duffy plush and let the adults extol the virtues of WED, Eisner, Walker, Nunis, Green, Ouimet, Mendenhall, et al.
