Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "I'm never for taking a pistol, rifle, or shotgun away from the average american." The average American doesn't need one of these things. Shoot anyone lately, Josh?
Originally Posted By TomSawyer Joe the Plumber just said, "your dead kids don’t trump my Constitutional rights." What a classy guy, and an example of exactly why the public health problem of unrestricted gun ownership is such a problem. More people are going to die from guns than from any other non-medical cause in the very near future, and people like Joe the Plumber and other NRA fanboys don't care.
Originally Posted By utahjosh <Shoot anyone lately, Josh?> Why would you ask if I've shot anyone? That's not why most people own guns around here. They are for hunting, sport, and home security. They are highly dangerous, and I think we can do better as a society to educate and license gun owners.
Originally Posted By ecdc <a target="blank" rel="nofollow" href="http://www.theonion.com/articles/no-way-to-prevent-this-says-only-nation-where-this,36131/">http://www.theonion.com/articl...s,36131/</a>
Originally Posted By Tikiduck Since the issue is so often deflected by the NRA as one of insanity, could not an argument be made regarding the utter madness of this nation's current gun laws? It is a mathematical certainty that reasonable and moderate gun legislation would save hundreds, and eventually thousands of people from a terrible death. Yet all we do is shake our heads and say "ain't it a shame." What a drag, it is getting old.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip One huge problem is that the majority of gun deaths are suicides, and many people feel that since it was their choice it is sad but tolerable. The majority of gun homicides are committed by gang bangers against other gang bangers, and people by and large just don't care much about that either. As long as it doesn't happen in THEIR neighborhood, they view it as Darwinism at work.
Originally Posted By oc_dean >>It's easy to whine about how nothing can ever possibly get fixed in America, it's hard to come up with plausible solutions.<< I give you exhibit A: My new home of the past 5 years now - Australia. We have strict measures on guns. Our last mass shooting was 1996 in Tasmania. After that .. the government implemented tough gun laws. To this day ... there has not been a mass shooting since. Or is America too dense to look outside it's own territory to see what the rest of the civilized world is doing to deal with out of control gun rights??
Originally Posted By wahooskipper Gun advocates would argue that the cat is already out of the bag in the US. There are already SO many guns in the US that if we stopped selling them tomorrow there would still be a steady supply for the bad guys for decades to come. Sadly, they are probably right. The problem with the gun issue is that everyone argues it from the extremes. There is a middle ground to be had but the talking heads won't event let us go there because it is easier to vehemently disagree than to find common ground. If the argument boils down to: "Nobody needs guns" or "Don't take my guns" then we are never going to get anywhere.
Originally Posted By Witches of Morva ORDDU: Very well put, wahooskipper, duckling. You sound like a voice of reason worth listening to.
Originally Posted By ecdc Except no one from a policy standpoint has ever said no one needs guns. The policy changes that have actually been brought to Congress have been incredibly moderate. But they still didn't pass. This is not an issue of two unreasonable sides. It's an issue of a Congress so afraid of the gun lobby they won't even pass bills that upwards of 80% of Americans support. At the simplest level, there is one problem with any attempt to do anything about the epidemic of gun violence: the NRA.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>I have never seen a poll of Americans wanting an gun ban.<< I'm not sure what you mean - either that a poll has never been taken or that polls show Americans don't want guns banned. Either way, that's exactly the point. NRA lackey's like Donny frame the issue as "banning guns" when no one has said any such thing. In fact, Democrats trip over themselves to cravenly appeal to gun owners almost as much as Republicans. Obama can't start a speech on gun control without saying, "Now I love the second amendment and we all know it's every American's right to own a gun...." The proposals have been moderate - far too moderate, IMO, and they *still* can't get passed. So let's call out this repeated B.S. that somehow it's because both sides are too extreme. That's just not the case.
Originally Posted By Witches of Morva ORDDU: Ah, but it IS the case. Some just don't want to acknowledge it.
Originally Posted By Witches of Morva ORDDU: I'd like to add that it is very irresponsible for anyone to ask utahjosh if he's shot anyone lately. Talk about trying to pick a fight with someone by implying something as insulting as that proves how extreme some people are willing to go to make a point that isn't even legitimate.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>Ah, but it IS the case. Some just don't want to acknowledge it.<< Really? Then surely you have links to all the Congressional bills that have been proposed that repeal the 2nd amendment. Surely you have links to all the statements by President Obama that call for the banning of guns. Surely you have evidence of a strong movement within the United States to curtail the sale of firearms. I mean, if it's so obvious that this is what's going on, it shouldn't be difficult at all for you to provide the links.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "ORDDU: I'd like to add that it is very irresponsible for anyone to ask utahjosh if he's shot anyone lately. Talk about trying to pick a fight with someone by implying something as insulting as that proves how extreme some people are willing to go to make a point that isn't even legitimate." Coming from some guy who pretends to be a witch on a Disney boards that means so much.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer "Or is America too dense to look outside it's own territory to see what the rest of the civilized world is doing to deal with out of control gun rights??" Too dense, and too insecure, frightened and timid.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer The NRA has its supporters so brainwashed that any talk of sensible background check or registration is immediately translated in their three brain cells as "them librals is tryin to take muh guns!"
