Originally Posted By cmpaley Wow...for someone who lives over 1,000 miles from our fair state, you sure got us pegged. :-\ Fact is, the people of California repudiated a plan that would have taken California in the wrong direction (which isn't to say that we are moving in the right direction--he was steering us into a sandbar while trying to avoid some shoals). Every single one of Schwarzenegger's funky four could have been hammered out in the legislature or were unnecessary to meet the goal or reform. Only 76 and 77 were about the reform of California's government. The problem was that they were the wrong solutions that would have only benefited the few at the expense of most Californians. I'll give credit for at least identifying the problems/ Now, time to move forward with some REAL reforms that will actually accomplish the goals without consolidating power to fewer and fewer individuals. 74 and 75 were based in a petty attempt to get back at the public employee unions who joined in dogging Schwarzenegger at all his public appearances after he stuck his foot in his mouth. You remember when he talk about how nurses are special interests who butts he was always kicking? Well, that kinda rubbed working people in California the wrong way. He picked a fight and we finished it. Of course, if you are engaged in "all-or-nothing" thinking, you're bound to think that California is irreparable. Schwarzenegger and his corporate special interest donors didn't get everything they wanted, so Californians obviously want a communist workers' paradise. How childish. I don't think anyone who is a public employee will deny the importance of the private sector. After all, no private sector, no need for us to work, duh! The question isn't whether or not the private sector is important. Anyone with a brain knows that it is. The question is really about who runs the state. Does big business or do the people? The rabid right will say that business MUST have first and primary voice at making all decisions. I don't know what the far left would say. I say that the people should have the first and primary voice in our state.
Originally Posted By ElKay "What was in this for HIM?" What's in this for him was POWER, pure and simple. He's a classical egomanical persona. He acts as if he believes he was all of those super hero characters in the movies. The reality is being an actor doesn't gaurantee that he has the skills or temperment to lead the largest State in the country. "It's you people in California that lost. You are going to have to pay higher taxes and your state is going to stay broke for a long time as buninesses flee for states that are not run by extreme left socialists." California if it were its own country would be the 7th or 8th largest economy in the world. Compare that to Oregon, where they mostly live off Californians buying boats and cars to avoid CA sales tax. Oregon's relationship to California is like Mexico's to the US. Beau, you outta get out of your parent's basement now and again, because Oregon is more of a Blue State than California is. "Arnold is govenor to HELP you, not to SCREW you." Fine, YOU take him and see how you like him, we'll gladly give him to you.--pathetic
Originally Posted By ElKay What I think is soooo very humorous coming from Beau and planodisney is their alarm about the condition of California. I'm sure their State's economy would contract avian flu if California gets the sniffles. Arnie's "special election" was a crass powerplay trying to have lightning strike twice. There really wasn't any emergency that couldn't wait until until the next scheduled election. Prop 76, which was supposed to magically solve all of our fiscal problems was a trojan horse intending to subvert the will of the majority of Californian's choosen legislators by empowering the minority GOP members to block any budget on the threat that if Dems didn't knuckle under that Arnie would just make draconian cuts to Dem's programs if there was a deficit in any yearly quarter. It would also have stripped a guranteed percentage of the State's budget earmarked for education, with a nebulous promise of POSSIBLE more funding under this failed proposal. The really funny thing is that Colorado's voters suspended their own, more draconian, Prop 76 called TABOR, because the spending restrictions hamstrung CO, so badly, that they couldn't keep up with the rise in population growth. Those voters were wise enough to see the damage TABOR was doing to their quality of life, despite the fact that they got refund checks under TABOR. Also that Prop. 77 was a crass, "hail mary" powerplay intending to replicate what Tom DeLay and the Texas GOP occupied legislature. What the media didn't really explain was that had Prop. 77 passed, the panel of retired judges (possibly all appointees could be GOP affiliated, because most state judges have been appointed by GOP govenors and Jerry Browns appointees might be to old to serve, while Davis' judges are still on the bench) would have to be selected in Dec '05 and their work had to be completed before the Spring of '06, in order for ANOTHER special election (costing upwards of ANOTHER $50 million) to be held so the plans could be approved for the June '06 primary election. So Californians would be on the hook for over $100 million just to feed Arnie's vanity? A GOP dominated redistricting plan would have a better than even chance of passing since GOP voters tend to vote more regularly than Indys or Dems. So what was the provision of voters rejected the redistricting plan? Nobody knows. Still another plan and another special election? The complications involved in all of Arnie's props would have made it soooo very easy for mischief to occur. If Arnie was sincere in his desire to "save" us Californians he could very easy have worked with the legislature, utilizing his supposed mandate (yeah, the trouncing of Gary Coleman) and his formerly high popularity to leverage the Dems in the legislature. Instead Arnie, called Dems "girly men" and boasted to fellow GOP big wigs that he "kicked the butts of nurses". How does he expect co-operation from others by name calling before or especially after his huge loss at the polls??????????? Arnie's big mistake was that early on he caved in to GOP group think and prevented the automatic return of the full vehicle registration fees (no, not a tax. This was a law that temporarily reduced fees during the boom years of the '90s). Sure it would have made those Hummer owners mad to have to pay the full fee, but on the otherhand, the restored fees would have generated $4 BILLION in revenues (not taxes) about HALF of the State's deficit. Arnie then had to "steal" from the schools $2 billion by shortchanging funding and BORROW billions of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ through passing bonds that will have to be paid by the next generation of Californians. Had Arnie been expedient in his budgeting, there wouldn't have been such a huge crisis and no need what-so-ever to create a false crisis and throwing away $50 million in a special election that didn't need to occure.
Originally Posted By Beaumandy There is no way to work with the radical leftist legislature that put California 30 Billion in debt. Arnold knows this. The thing Arnold forgot was that the people of California are very easily swayed by garbage politics. Throw in the crazed liberals who would vote to ban hand guns and military recruiters, then you have an impossible task unless you were to outspent the unions who fleeced their members to defeat these measures. California IS France: broke, with a corrupt & impacted political class, a place where everyone is fed up with immigration but no politician has the guts to talk about it... and this goes for Arnold also in a lot of cases. He has balls, but still isn't willing to go all the way and tell people what needs to happen to save a great state.
Originally Posted By FaMulan You avoided my earlier question in my election topic Beaumandy? Explain how I, a moderate who habitually turns off political advertising and carefully reads the State published Voter Information guide am easily swayed by that garbage? I voted for the current Governor, a vote for someone I thought would be able to work with the legislature until he was running around Sacramento screaming and tearing his hair out (which I never saw, or heard of) before WASTING MONEY THE STATE DOESN'T HAVE AVAILABLE TO WASTE ON A SPECIAL ELECTION!!! All I saw was him becoming was a Republican Bully feeding off the entitled atmosphere of that party and make a play to destroy the balance of powers in the state. The other day he even admitted that he should have listened to his WIFE, who told him this was an unecessary WASTE OF THE STATE'S MONEY. I'm with 2oony, he needs to pay back the State, not just the money from the election, but the money he took from the education budget. CA put him in office because we wanted a change from politics as usual. Well, we got that, but not in the way we wanted.
Originally Posted By planodisney cmpaley, I grew up in California, and have lived there for more than 18 years. I grew up in Redding, during that time, I also lived in Huntington Beach and Westminster. I lived in san Jose my last 4 years out there, and I realy consider california my home, even more than Texas. I love California, still have all of my dads side of the family out there and visit every chance i get.
Originally Posted By cmpaley Okay. So you lived here and like to visit. That doesn't refute anything I've said, does it?
Originally Posted By DlandDug >>He never made a serious attempt to work with the legislature - it was his intent all along to run this to the public through initiatives.<< On the contrary, the legislature made it clear that they would not work with him. There would have been no need for theis special election if the Democratic leadership in Sacramento had had any intention of working with Schwarzenegger. Now, hopefully, everyone will play together nicely and we'll get some reform in place before the next tax and spender gets elected.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>but still isn't willing to go all the way and tell people what needs to happen to save a great state<< What's stopping him? Honestly, here's a former movie star and current governor. He has everything from the Wall Street Journal to Access Hollywood hanging on his every word and action. If he is more than an empty suit, why is he suddenly shy to share his bold vision and great ideas? Here's one theory: He is in waaay over his head, and his lack of political experience and fondness for cute one-liners instead of substance play welll only to the remaining few total partisan supporters, who would be equally as thrilled if Bonzo the Chimp were running the show as long as there were an (R) after his name.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>Arnold is govenor to HELP you<< Yeah, he sure helped us out of carrying around that extra $50-$80 million that was weighing us down with his silly special election. Is he sitting down and writing that check yet?
Originally Posted By Beaumandy 50 to 80 million would be nothing if he was allowed to curtail spending in your state.
Originally Posted By cmpaley He already can. It's called the line-item veto. First thing to veto: Special Interest Election Solution: Write check and reimburse the People of Claifornia.
Originally Posted By ElKay "50 to 80 million would be nothing if he was allowed to curtail spending in your state." Oh that's just soooo rich coming from someone who doesn't have to pay for it. Isn't this the same guy who still isn't in the Nat'l. Guard fighting for the freedom of the Iraqi people? I don't understand all of the concern for a State that he can't stand to live in. Oregon afterall is a much Bluer state than California.
Originally Posted By Beaumandy Good point Elkay, I live in Oregon but can't seem to stop looking at the trainwreck that is California politics. I guess it's because California is my favorite state and I hate to see it suffer.
