Originally Posted By kennect Spirit, As a rule I love reading your posts...I would never expect you to change...I am just throwing my two cents into this never ending discussion about how awful WDW is....Trust me though, Walmart does have one item I cannot find anywhere else....Even with all of my wholesale sources I cannot find anyone that makes this item...Locate a source for me and I will buy it from them...It is a fake polyester fiber fill that is like a down fill...As I said, find me a source and I will stop buying it at Walmart....
Originally Posted By kennect Sherry, I will admit that I shop at Target...Sorry if anyone is offended but I think it is one of the coolest stores that ever happened in retail...I get the idea that Target has created its own style that other retailers wish they could copy....
Originally Posted By sherrytodd Yes, my name is Sherry and I am a Target addict. To be quite honest, the only reason I don't shop at Walmart is just simply because I don't like the stores. Not for any political or ideological reason. Now what that says about me as a WDW visitor, I don't quite see the point??? What it doesn't say about me is that I would walk around WDW spitting on people and attacking police.
Originally Posted By kennect Sherry, It really doesn't mean that but the mention of Walmart around here has taken on a life of its own...Maybe I am misunderstanding the whole thing but I get the idea that if you are a Walmart shopper then you don't deserve a trip to WDW....But then again there have been discussions about what kind of car do you drive that seemed to show that if you drove a cheap car then you weren't worthy....My frustration is the idea that topics like this even happen here...It seems if you have money then you will be the perfect guest at WDW...If you visit with a lower income then you will not be the perfect guest...Like money or income has anything to do with how one acts.... BTW, Can't wait to see the Sunday paper and glance through that Target insert!!!!!
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 Thanks VBDAD and MPierce, I've really grown weary of having to explain why I hate (and yes, I do mean to use that word) the Bentonville Devil. So I have no intention of doing it yet again here ... if someone wants to know why I feel the way I do about the company let them do some research. There's plenty to keep busy on a holiday weekend ;-) And sorry, Trippy (and others) but WalMart is the worst of the worst. Lower than pond scum. Yes, it's sad that some companies would like to emulate them ... but that changes nothing. Companies like Best Buy are virtually insignificant in the retail world when compared with WalMart. And while Disney doesn't treat many of its workers well at all, especially at the lowest levels ... you'll never see me comparing Disney's treatment of CMs with WalMart's treatment of its workforce and manufacturers. I know this is a hot button topic for some. It sure is for me. But I don't respect people who do know the evils of the company, yet choose to shop there anyway to save a few bucks.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Sherry, We are only debating Walmart based on that some around here believe that if you shop at Walmart you are not worthy of a visit to WDW.>> Hypebole, and not at all true. <<..But if you do shop there and make it to WDW then you are pure trash and are expected to act as such.....What don't you understand? Some folks think they are better than others....>> Come on. Come up with a real argument or let it rest. And, some folks are better than others ... we aren't all equal (at least that's what some of my Republican friends tell me!) How many posts will this thread go for, until somone cries about it and it gets closed?
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<What if I shop at Target? Am I slightly trashy?>> Target is a wonderful store. I love shopping there. Clean stores. Quality products. And employees who don't scare me.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Sherry, It really doesn't mean that but the mention of Walmart around here has taken on a life of its own...Maybe I am misunderstanding the whole thing but I get the idea that if you are a Walmart shopper then you don't deserve a trip to WDW.>> Deserve? I dunno ... I do think you do deserve a lecture on business and economics and what WalMart has done to American (and worldwide) workers if you're going to shop there. <<...But then again there have been discussions about what kind of car do you drive that seemed to show that if you drove a cheap car then you weren't worthy.>> Ken, I think you're way off the mark here. There have been discussions about cars because a lot of us (mostly dudes) are into our wheels. I don't recall anyone saying (for example) that if you happen to be dumb enough to buy a GM product that you should be stopped at the front gates and turned back! <<...My frustration is the idea that topics like this even happen here...It seems if you have money then you will be the perfect guest at WDW...If you visit with a lower income then you will not be the perfect guest...Like money or income has anything to do with how one acts....>> Again. I don't know where you come up with this because it sure as hell isn't from anything I post. Trash comes in all colors, religions, races, AND ECONOMIC backgrounds. I see just as much trash at the Grand Floridian (perhaps, monied, but trash is trash) as I do at POP. To take it a step further there's just as much (if not more) trash that works in the WDW exec suites than there are in the $7 an hour cast population. So ... please ... whatever your angle here, don't spin this to be a 'WDW is only for the wealthy' line of mularkey. Simply not true.
Originally Posted By kennect Spirit, You just said it with your comment that some of us are better than others....Should I say more?
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 Spirit, what did you mean by your original comment? <<Just the typical WalMart family having a magical WDW vacation. I don't know what all the fuss is about. When you cater to a certain demogrpahic, you really shouldn't be all that surprised when they act according to form.>>
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Spirit, You just said it with your comment that some of us are better than others....Should I say more? >> I dunno ... should you? Seriously, I'm not looking for yet another bandwith (and more importantly life draining) online dogfight. But, yeah. I do believe we aren't all equal and that some folks are better than others. Or do you think the folks who caused this ugly incident at the MK are just as good as you? I don't look at trash and think we're all the same. Sorry if that offends.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Spirit, what did you mean by your original comment?>> Simple, I-57. WDW reaps what is has sowed. For well over a decade WDW has cultivated an atmosphere where guests can get away with all sorts of horrendous behavior (stuff from the unsafe to the illegal to the just plain boorish and disgusting). They'd sooner fire a hard-working front-line CM than throw out a family spending $15,000 on a WDW magical vacation, even if that family abuses the CM (or other guests). Do you have any idea how obnoxious many guests are? And how much WDW does to NOT address the core issues by making a printed code of conduct.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<And sorry, Trippy (and others) but WalMart is the worst of the worst. Lower than pond scum. Yes, it's sad that some companies would like to emulate them ... but that changes nothing.>> OK... even IF I accept that Wal-Mart is the "worst of the worst", which I will do for the sake of argument if nothing else. How do you define the Wal-Marting of WDW? WDW is certainly not selling anything cheaper than anyone else is, so that definition goes out the window. As far as I know they also do not engage in any of the "predatory" pricing practices that Wal-Mart engages in. So, where the heck does the "Wal-Marting of WDW" come from? Is it because you believe that people who shop at Wal-Mart are "lower" than those who don't? I would certainly hope that you are not that shallow. Besides, you would be wrong. The prior suburb I lived in, Eden Prairie, is one of the wealthiest suburbs in the United States. And the Wal-Mart parking lot there was absolutely filled with Beemers, Mercedes, Hummers, and Lexus. It really helps a person afford their McMansion and the lease on the Beemer if they can get everything else they buy at rock-bottom prices. The suburb I live in now, though considerably less "up-scale" than Eden Prairie, has NO Wal-Mart within city limits. This is probably partly because Roseville is a liberal city, and liberals tend to dislike Wal-Mart. I think it may also be significant that Roseville was the site of the ORIGINAL Target, and because of that residents like to keep the city "pure". But whatever, the Wal-Mart shoppers of Eden Prairie are for the most part considerably more up-scale than the Target shoppers of Roseville. So how does that fit into your putdowns of the "Wal-Mart demographic"? You may be right about Wal-Mart, but are wrong about attributing poor behavior at WDW to folks who shop at Wal-Mart.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<How do you define the Wal-Marting of WDW? WDW is certainly not selling anything cheaper than anyone else is, so that definition goes out the window. As far as I know they also do not engage in any of the "predatory" pricing practices that Wal-Mart engages in. So, where the heck does the "Wal-Marting of WDW" come from?>> Simple. When I refer to the WalMarting of WDW, I am referring to a switch in the Disney culture, a dumbing down to the lowest common denominator. People here have pointed out again and again that not only poor white trash shops at WalMart (unlike the good old days ;-) ) ... well, that's because WalMart has sold itself as the place for value for everyone. WDW is now sold as the place for the concept of 'generic magic' for everyone. WDW used to regularly create magical guest vacations and experiences without hitting you over the head with magic marketing. Now, it's all about marketing 'Disney magic' rather than making real Disney magic. When WDW cuts out entertainment with real, unionized performers in favor of teens in foamheads, that's WalMarting the product. When WDW decides it doesn't need to power clean the pavement and walkways at night or vaccuum hotel carpeting, that's WalMarting the product. When WDW takes and closes attractions and leaves nothing (or McDonald's playgrounds) in their place, that's WalMarting the product. When WDW slashes a menu down from 15 entrees to 5, that's WalMarting the product. When WDW makes guests pay $50 extra for what always was included in regular admission (yes, I a talkiing about MVMCP here) while convincing bumpkin guests that they're getting something special, that's WalMarting the product. When every shop becomes a place to buy plush, princess, pirates or pin merchandise, that's WalMarting the product. Do I need to go on? Seriously. The analogy is very simple: WalMarting is dumbing down your product into a bland homogenized mess that the masses gobble up like a 450-pounder at Chef Mickey's. <<Is it because you believe that people who shop at Wal-Mart are "lower" than those who don't? I would certainly hope that you are not that shallow. Besides, you would be wrong.>> I think I've covered the deal with people who shop at WalMart enough. I do think those who shop at WalMart after understanding why they are an evil company ARE -- at the very least -- more shallow (to use your term) than those who don't.
Originally Posted By MPierce I love WDW as much as the next person, however they have encouraged rude behavior in their parks by their actions or lack there of. Remember those chanting little herds of teens you encountered in the parks, and on the bus ride there. Remember that tour group of 50 people that thought it was OK to cut in front of you after you had been waiting in line for 30 minutes. How about that person walking around smoking in designated non-smoking areas. How about that loud-mouth rude person that thinks it's socially acceptable to use vulgar language in public. Remember that person who might have had one or two to many adult beverages, and decides to relieve themselves in the bushes. I could go on, and on with examples. These are all things that Disney allows to happen all of the time. Very seldom will you see a CM stop this kind of action. I don't think they can reply about it on a forum, but the main reason is they will not get backing from their supervisors. They have guest who curse them like dogs. We all know what happens to the guest, nothing. As long as attendance figures grow, and this kind of behavior is tolerated the problems can only get worse. Enforce all the family values that Disney try's to present to the public. Let me ask everyone something. When you pack people on buses like cattle, when you have women with babies, and small children standing, a very dangerous situation, where is the Magic? It's not about a certain class of people it's about behavior of people. Even I knew Spirit was a fan of Targets, and he eats at McDonald's also, I don't really think he's looking down his nose at anyone. By the way Spirit I still love my G.M. cars. It's not about the have's against the have not's. It's about guest paying a lot of money going to a Magical Place, and expecting just that. Expecting superior treatment in a clean friendly enviroment, when you are paying a pretty hefty price for a vacation or just leisure time should never be misconstrued as being a snob. Beleive me I am anything but a liberal. I hate WalMart for what it is, and it's that kind of business that I beleive is slowlying eroding this Country's values. When the face of America is changing in a way I think hurts this great Country I certainly feel oblidged to speak out.
Originally Posted By demderedoseguys Bottomline- Punks are everywhere, no matter where they shop. What concerns me is that now the punks are frequenting WDW and this is where Spirit's remarks are right on cue. Disney cares less and less about quality of it's product and and more and more on pushing people through the turnstiles, to the detriment of it's own reputation. I hope no one takes offense to this and I don't want to come across as snobby, since I have worked my way up to a decent standard of living ( I worked at a sewer plant when I got of of college), but Disney has made itself affordable to a different class of people,which,in iself is a noble idea because I like the notion that everyone should be able to afford to go,rich or poor, but in the long wrong may ( emphasis on may) attract the wrong crowd.By this, I am referring to the people who would never consider Disney as a vacation destination and do not have the respect for it that many of us long time patrons of the parks have.They view Disney as just another place to go. I remember the days when I would have to pinch pennies for two years to be able to afford to go and I considered it a PRIVILEDGE to be able to vacation at WDW,not a birthright. I don't think Disney demands that people respect it's reputation anymore, in the name of keeping the turnstiles moving. At the risk of this posting coming across the wrong way I am hesitating before I hit the SUBMIT button. Well, here goes......
Originally Posted By bobbelee9 With the prices Disney charges, how can poor people afford to go? Just because someone may have a lot of money, doesn't mean they aren't low class.
Originally Posted By Elderp Rich people on average tend to use more resources than poor people. I don't see it as a rich/poor thing. I just see it as a class/low brow thing.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 Great post 75. I am in total agreement with you. Well, except for the GM part. I owned some of their vehicles in the 1990s ... and all I can say is never again (although the teen in me misses my Formula with Vette V-8!!!) But I'll stick with cars made to last.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 < Beleive me I am anything but a liberal. I hate WalMart for what it is, and it's that kind of business that I beleive is slowlying eroding this Country's values.< Count me in on this statement - this is absolutely accurate IMHO <I am in total agreement with you. Well, except for the GM part. < and I grew up a GM guy - a number of Trans Ams' Z 28's ( including my 69 302 DZ ) - and 2 vette's - but after the 80's and part of the 90's where my GM cars lost value and appeal faster than a stale cheeseburger under a heat lamp and reliability was lousy - I also moved on - unlikely to return. I loved the Camaro convertible at the auto show, but someone will have to prove to me first that it will be worth the $.
