Originally Posted By danyoung That's something of a trick question. I've never LOVED iasw. I enjoy it, but it's never been a favorite. I enjoyed it like it was, but I plan to enjoy it like it is now.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss Does it make a difference? I enjoyed DL the way it was in 1967, but time marches on and things change. I still enjoy DL.
Originally Posted By Bellella Subtle changes, like in the Haunted Mansion, are to be expected. The Small World changes are definitly not subtle. I know they made a conscious effort to make the characters look like the original dolls, but it still doesn't work. Especially not with the various film themes woven into the soundtrack.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains I am sorry but Bellella how do you know the changes aren't subtle? How do you know the soundtrack doesn't work now? I understand you have decided that the ride is more or less ruined forever - unless they take your advise and return it to the original (not sure if you mean from 1964 or the lastest original of 2007) But you said yourself you haven't been on it since the changes.... <<52 Bellella Sat 3/14/2009 5:47p Well, maybe at the moment, we can't really do much about the changes. And I'm not exactly going into this without an open mind. I haven't physically been on the ride, but I've seen the changes on an Internet video. You can't really say I haven't given the changes a fair chance. We all know that the ride never lost any of its popularity. Maybe the changes are permanent (I really hope not) but I don't have to like them, or acknowledge them when I go on the ride. >>> So until you do, why not wait and see what you really think. BTW which parks have characters on IASW now?
Originally Posted By SoThisIsLove I used to have to practically drag DH on IASW before this latest refurbishment. He just didn't get it. But, with the new sparklies and beautiful refreshed feeling, he finally enjoyed himself on our last cruise a couple of weeks ago. True, he's a new convert and is no longer one of The Others, but it felt so good to have him truly get a feeling of childlike wonder during our latest voyage. I know I'm not a grade A, "real" Disney fan, because I actually liked the subtle new music woven in and seeing the new characters. It takes all kinds, I guess. The 3 freakiest renditions for me were Pinocchio, Jessie (#1), and Woody. Everything else was pretty neat. It was, all in all, quite lovely and enchanting and full of goodwill, in my very humble opinion.
Originally Posted By danyoung >I know I'm not a grade A, "real" Disney fan, because I actually liked the subtle new music woven in and seeing the new characters.< I know you were kidding with that, but this is one of the things that really hacks me off about this entire situation - that those who like the changes somehow don't "get it", that we're somehow lesser of the Disney fans, that if we really cared about Walt and history and art and what the founders and framers of our favorite amusement parks REALLY WANTED, then we'd be right on the front lines with the rest of the truly passionate fans who have gotten it right. Rubbish. Everyone has their opinion, and mine is no more or less valuable than yours. I defy anyone to say that they love the parks more than I do. Heck, I plan to retire and move to Orlando, just so I can work part time at WDW during retirement. Just because we like the changes, STIL, doesn't make us lesser park fans, or those that are against the changes somehow superior to us.
Originally Posted By utahjosh My wife's parents recently returned from Disneyland. They loved the additions to Small World.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt It's very interesting to me that this change has so many people engaged in debate. I think we all agree that the “plussing” of Small World by adding familiar Disney characters was mostly unwarranted. Still, what was done is hardly as horrifying to me as what they did to the poor Submarine Voyage. The dumbing down of that storyline is greater snub at Disney tradition than updates to Small World by far. Like many vintage Disney attractions, the Subs always suffered from a bit of mid-century corniness. Nevertheless, when I rode the Nemo Subs last September I felt a twinge of embarrassment by how unbelievably cheesy and childish the whole experience was. With all the anticipation, hype about the millions of dollars spent, and the advancements in technology since 1959, how on Earth could WDI turn out such an unexceptional revision of a classic Disney ride? Worse, the attraction’s plotline took a very strong film, with wonderful characters, and reduced it all to an uninspired excursion suitable for a kindergarten field trip. In comparison, the changes to Small World just don’t seem to warrant all this fuss that is being made. I just don’t get it. I suppose that it has something to do with the emotional connection that many people have with this attraction.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>It's very interesting to me that this change has so many people engaged in debate. I think we all agree that the “plussing” of Small World by adding familiar Disney characters was mostly unwarranted. Still, what was done is hardly as horrifying to me as what they did to the poor Submarine Voyage. The dumbing down of that storyline is greater snub at Disney tradition than updates to Small World by far.<<< Very true, and I was quite grumpy after waiting so long for the subs to see that thing. But I think this is the straw that broke the camel's back. WE have character everywhere, and I suppose you could say it started with Splash Mountain. On it's own, very cool! But add in Pooh, and Pirates on TSI, and Jack et al in PotC, and NBC in HM, and Tarzan in the Treehouse, the Subs, Buzz, and now IASW, it's like "OMG when is this going to stop". Add in all the tooning at WDW (not enough time to list right now), TDL and even WDSP, and the fact almost everything in DCA's $1.2bn plans are toons. Well frankly it makes me sick, as do the fans that lap this stuff up. So we are going and doing other things now. It is clear the company is a shadow of it's former self or I have become a dinosaur. Either way, it is depressing and creatively bankrupt (animation was only ever a minor interest to me and a number of other fans, now that our beloved parks have become all about the animation, well it causes a number of reactions). Hence the outpour of anger about this. And you know what, I have kept my mouth shut because there isn't a darned thing I can do about this. And it won't be long until everyone says "look there was a little ruckus in the beginning but everyone is fine now". Well nope, I am still unhappy about TSI's changes (love that they refurbed, but where is that show now?). But it is a waste of time and energy to gripe about it. Thing is, I think in the long term this will cost them. Not sure about the US, but in the UK, there are now more over 60's than under 18's. If they still had an inclusive policy for attractions, it would be far better for them in the long run.
Originally Posted By danyoung >I think we all agree that the “plussing” of Small World by adding familiar Disney characters was mostly unwarranted.< I know I'm gonna get called a Pollyanna for this, but I don't think it was unwarranted at all. It was a pretty good idea, actually - plussing an existing attraction with characters that fit in to the original design and give people something to look for, or look forward to seeing. Whether they succeeded in their dream is open to debate. >Still, what was done is hardly as horrifying to me as what they did to the poor Submarine Voyage. The dumbing down of that storyline is greater snub at Disney tradition than updates to Small World by far.< For me there's a similarity to iasw, in that I can see the arguments and appreciate them, but bottom line I just don't care. I'm thrilled to see the subs in operation again. I enjoyed my trips on it so far, and think they did a wonderful job with the underwater animation. And you can't tell me that the subs had any kind of theme in the past - they were just a ride, a simple illusion of a trip under the polar ice cap. Now there's something much more interesting to look at through the portholes, and I couldn't be happier. Sometimes you just have to let the idea of strict interpretation of land theme go. OK, let the Pollyanna catcalls begin!!!
Originally Posted By Yookeroo "I'd be willing to compromise on the America scene. I'd love for them to remove that, but that would be asking for too much." Before you can make compromises, you have to, you know, be in some sort of negotiation. "Subtle changes, like in the Haunted Mansion, are to be expected. The Small World changes are definitly not subtle." The IASW changes were more subtle than the Haunted Mansion changes.
Originally Posted By Bellella davewasbaloo, I'm glad that you somewhat agree with me that the Disneyland park is promoting the characters too much. I haven't even been on the new "improved" Submarine Voyage (it looks very tacky now), but I can definitly empathize with you about your feelings about that ride. I didn't have to wait so long for Small World to reopen, but I was really looking forward to going on it again, and now they do this? Can you blame me for being mad that they wrecked it? I've been somewhat mad at them for other things. They wrecked the Submarine Voyage, they took out the Swiss Family Treehouse and the Country Bear Jamboree to promote their characters even more, and now they do this. I'm afraid I can't put into words how mad I am at them for being over-commercialized and willing to ruin a classic Disneyland attraction.
Originally Posted By Bellella Yookeroo, when I talk about "subtle" changes, I'm talking about changes of things on the rides that were already there. On the Haunted Mansion, Madame Leota was always there, and they made her float. The entryway portraits were always there, and now they morph differently. There have been some slight changes to the attic scene, the most noticeable is the talking bride. The Disney Small World characters were never there in the beginning, and therefore, they are not a subtle change. They do look a lot like the original dolls, but themes from their movies were added in, making them even more noticeable. The question of whether the new characters are subtle additions or not is beside the point. Small World has changed from a promotion of world peace to a promotion of Disney characters, and it's gone the route of many other Disneyland rides.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<Small World has changed from a promotion of world peace to a promotion of Disney characters>> Those of us on the other side don't see it that way, at least I don't. IaSW still has a message of togetherness, but it just happens to be delivered with characters in the mix.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains When IASW first opened Disney was only in Ca - and it was built for the world's fair... Now Disney is in other countries too why not put the characters in the country of their orgin. I find it funny that so many people (many who have only seen it on an internet video) talk about how wrecked it is! I didn't go to the parks much when my oldest two were little so we didn't really notice the "ruining" of the treehouse - I do know it's very popular now - don't know before. HM - are you kidding they completely change the whole ride from mid sept - mid jan (including shut down for overlay) Many people hate the NBC overlay and have complained for years about how that was ruined too (I like that too). Country Bears - I wish that was still there, we loved it - but the attedance was usually low (just like the muppets and HISTA) so they added a Pooh ride - When this was happening many CM's explained that they had lots of complaints about the long wait for Splash and nothing for the littler kids to do - so being that pooh was quite popular at the time and fit in the area they went with it. Could it have been done better... of course! Maybe they could put the Country Bears out on the Island where the Pirate Show was... ;p
Originally Posted By Bellella I don't know. I guess if nobody else wants them out, I could just go on the ride like always, and just somehow train my ears and eyes to ignore the changes. Like that's even possible.
