Originally Posted By DouglasDubh How do we get out of Iraq? We keep doing what we've been successfully doing for the last few years - helping the Iraqis set up their own government, building up their internal security, and tightening the noose around the neck of the terrorists. <a href="http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/09/04/MNG1OKUSRN1.DTL" target="_blank">http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/ article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/09/04/MNG1OKUSRN1.DTL</a> <"The al Qaeda organization in Iraq has been seriously weakened and is now suffering from a leadership vacuum," Iraq's national security adviser, Mowaffak al-Rubaie, said at a news conference. Twenty senior al Qaeda in Iraq fighters have been captured or killed based on information from al-Saeedi since his arrest within the past few weeks, officials said.>
Originally Posted By gadzuux >> We keep doing what we've been successfully doing for the last few years << Sounds like "stay the course" to me. If the last few years have been so "successful" why is the situation deteriorating so rapidly? >> Twenty senior al Qaeda in Iraq fighters have been captured or killed based on information << Are you still subscribing to the "kill `em all" philosophy? For every one that falls, there's two more right behind him.
Originally Posted By DAR <<Are you still subscribing to the "kill `em all" philosophy? For every one that falls, there's two more right behind him.>> I'm starting to think promotions in Al-Qaeda aren't too hard to come by. Heck I have to wait until people retire at my job.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <If the last few years have been so "successful" why is the situation deteriorating so rapidly?> It's not. <Are you still subscribing to the "kill `em all" philosophy? For every one that falls, there's two more right behind him.> That's not what al Zarquawi said, right before he was killed. He sent a memo complaining he couldn't recruit enough men.
Originally Posted By gadzuux >> It's not. << The pentagon would disagree with your rosy assessment. Probably because of their liberal bias. <a href="http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/09/01/national/w115252D54.DTL&hw=iraq+assessment+pentagon&sn=004&sc=454" target="_blank">http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/ article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/09/01/national/w115252D54.DTL&hw=iraq+assessment+pentagon&sn=004&sc=454</a> By ROBERT BURNS AP Military Writer Friday, September 1, 2006 (09-01) 21:00 PDT WASHINGTON, (AP) -- Sectarian violence is spreading in Iraq and the security problems have become more complex than at any time since the U.S. invasion in 2003, a Pentagon report said Friday. In a notably gloomy report to Congress, the Pentagon reported that illegal militias have become more entrenched, especially in Baghdad neighborhoods where they are seen as providers of both security and basic social services. The report described a rising tide of sectarian violence, fed in part by interference from neighboring Iran and Syria and driven by a "vocal minority" of religious extremists who oppose the idea of a democratic Iraq. Death squads targeting mainly Iraqi civilians are a growing problem, heightening the risk of civil war, the report said.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <The pentagon would disagree with your rosy assessment.> My assessment isn't "rosy"; it's just not gloomy like yours is. The Pentagon's report had some negative things to say, and some positive things to say. Some people, however, tend to only look at the negative.
Originally Posted By jonvn "it's just not gloomy like yours is." Or the Pentagon's, apparently, which is what he quoted.
Originally Posted By jonvn True, which discussed what the Pentagon had to say. So, what did the Pentagon report have to say that you are trying to latch onto here? I've just looked it up online, and it says things like Iraq is on the brink of (Brink? It's already in a) civil war, and that violence is escalating. Nothing good is coming from our invasion there, in that we went in trying to be world cop again. Even the rhetoric from the White House is now changing its tune, from "once iraq is democratic and free all will be wonderful" to one of "if we fail in Iraq, things will be bad." That's a change from an optimistic viewpoint to a pessimistic one.
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA I say, let's get President Bush on to another aircraft carrier, dressed in a pilot's costume, fill the decks with armed forces personnel, and create an all new banner that reads: 'MISSION REALLY ACCOMPLISHED: LIKE, FOR REAL THIS TIME'
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <So, what did the Pentagon report have to say that you are trying to latch onto here?> All the positive stuff. <I've just looked it up online, and it says things like Iraq is on the brink of (Brink? It's already in a) civil war, and that violence is escalating.> Can you post a link?
Originally Posted By YourPalEd The fact that the known traitor, george bush, is using nea, insider information, to hurt the american people is evident in this case. The traitors know before hand exactly what a respected institution, the pentagon, is going to say about bush, cheney, rumsfeld, and the war being led disastorously, on purpose, for war profiteering. They release there version in a blatant attempt to discredit the pentagon's views, with the sole reason to protect themselves from prosecution. America's defenses are lowered yet another notch with traitors like rove running loose.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 at least I figured out where the 'Doom and gloom" comments are coming from now-- Tony Snow must have repeated that 5 times this morning during an interview-- so obviously someone has drawn this up as the mantra to repeat for the press to characterize anyone who disagrees...
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh It's being used because it's accurate. Some people only want to look at the negatives.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 and some people stick their heads up their backsides and pretend none of the negatives are there...because they are told to or because they don't gives a rats petuite someone has to pay attention to the things that are going into the crapper...being told 'all is OK' doesn't work for many of us as we are not sheep.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh I don't see anyone saying, "All is okay". I've seen plenty of statements acknowledging that what we are trying to do is hard and will take some time. And yes, some mistakes have been made along the way, and some will undoubtedly be made in the future. But it's not like anyone in the opposition came up with a better plan, or is coming up with one now.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 ^^^ have ONLY seen those statements regarding the war...nothing else. Show me where that has been said for anything other than the war on terror . let's not try and confuse the 2 -- they are separate issues. and see the only comment that can ever be made is the competetion - it's all Dem vs Rep and screw the people right now. The competition for the US is not a Dem - GOP issue....people need to turn off the freakin TV for a while and think for themselves. The competition is cheap labor in Brazil / India / Thailand and Kuala Lampur - removing jobs by the millions that will NEVER return. The competiton are other countries school systems that are systematically cleaing our clocks inproducing workers for the 21st century The competition are countries that will gladly do our work for us for pennies on the dollar, but tax the living daylights out of anything we try and market there so that we are not competitive there - The competition is not Red and Blue -- however that's how some people choose to see it with their kool aid in hand. The GOP beating the Dems or vice versa the next few years means squat to this stuff....
Originally Posted By Moderation Fairly well put vbdad, are you joining me in the middle for a nonpartisan breather to actually solve a few of these issues? Getting back on topic, I started a new thread about what the Kurds are doing. Partition may not yet be 'liekly', but it moved up a few slots in the odds book this week.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <Fairly well put vbdad, are you joining me in the middle for a nonpartisan breather to actually solve a few of these issues?< I am so there....yes. ( may have to change my handle to ModVBdad55
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA <But it's not like anyone in the opposition came up with a better plan, or is coming up with one now.> So, it's a 'good' plan....by default?
