Originally Posted By FerretAfros Just to twist things up, how would you compare the Fantasyland expansion to one of the World Showcase pavilions at Epcot? Both are heavy on the theming details, but light on attractions. I know that they're in different parks and serve different purposes, but they seem to be on a somewhat comparable scale (granted, I haven't been to the FL expansion yet).
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt FLE seems much larger than a World Showcase pavilion to me. Factor in the meet & greets, new Dumbos, and other storytelling details and what you have is more of a small land (ala Critter Country) than anything found in World Showcase. The EPCOT WS pavilions are nice, but they seem far too abbreviated to qualify as full fledged traditional Disney "lands".
Originally Posted By Doobie I can't think of any Epcot pavilion that even comes close to the feeling here except for, perhaps, parts of the Canada Pavilion. But Fantasyland tops that as well.
Originally Posted By Dlmusic <<Just to twist things up, how would you compare the Fantasyland expansion to one of the World Showcase pavilions at Epcot? Both are heavy on the theming details, but light on attractions. I know that they're in different parks and serve different purposes, but they seem to be on a somewhat comparable scale (granted, I haven't been to the FL expansion yet).>> In my opinion, while details are abound I did not feel it was quite on the World Showcase level. Morocco for example is far more immersive to me than anywhere inside the Fantasyland expansion. I love how many of the World Showcase pavilions have little tucked away corners or multiple paths to get to places making them feel like an actual location. New Fantasyland by comparison has only one path connecting everything and Belle's Village is too small to really get lost in. I think ultimately it won't be possible to completely know how immersive the area is without the 7 Dwarfs Coaster finished.
Originally Posted By Dlmusic I should also add that World Showcase is full of live entertainment that goes a long way. I'm assuming the same will be the same for Fantasyland and will probably help as well. One thing I know for sure, there is no possible way that New Fantasyland even with 7 Dwarfs will be able to compete with Africa and Asia at Disney's Animal Kingdom for immersion for me. Not even remotely close.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt ^^ I agree, mostly because there's only so much fairytale stuff I can take.
Originally Posted By Dlmusic It's funny you say that, because Beauty and the Beast is my favorite Disney movie. So it's not like I'm biased against it. In fact, the area should be my favorite (or among them) at Walt Disney World. For me, it's just too sporadic to have an impact. Maurice's cottage is nice, but you don't really get a good look at it within the land with how it is landscaped. The village is nice, but it's only two tiny buildings and not big enough to really get lost in. Just a complete block would have been enough to make a huge difference. Or more facades in the back to give the illusion of more of a town. There are other things to, like the choice to put the Gaston fountain in the square instead of the one in the movie. That just looks wrong to me and takes me out of the environment. While a cute photo op, I would have much preferred to have the opportunity to do a photo op with the one from the movie (and I would have taken a picture there with a book in hand). There are so many things I would have loved to have seen or taken pictures with: Maurice's Invention A Maison De Lunes wagon Gaston's Chair (I think this is coming though) Townspeople Baker's shop Bookshop (with ladder to swing on like the film) The sign from the fork in the road (Valencia/Anaheim in the film) Phillipe Would love to have seen windows ala Wizarding World or Toontown with moving props (Man getting mustache cut, woman with lots of kids, ala the opening number) Comparing it to Mickey's Toontown at Disneyland Park, I am not a huge fan of Roger Rabbit but yet I find that area captivating. There are so many little details, jokes, gags to uncover. I wanted to feel that way here, and instead while I felt it was pretty, I don't feel any need to return to catch up on details I missed the first time around. Except for Be Our Guest, that place is phenomenal. They hit it totally out of the park.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "Comparing it to Mickey's Toontown at Disneyland Park, I am not a huge fan of Roger Rabbit but yet I find that area captivating." OK, I see what you mean. Still, as detailed as they may be, you don't see those kinds of clever interactive components in the WS pavilions.
Originally Posted By DlandDug I think the original thesis of this discussion is flawed. Belle's Village is not, nor is it being promoted as, a separate area. The entire expansion is an extension of the existing FL. There are two attractions, an interactive Meet 'n Greet, restaurants, and a shop. This is a pretty reasonable mix for an addition to an existing land. Obviously, we all would prefer to see another MAJOR attraction in that mix. No argument there. But I do not agree that the area devoted to Belle is somehow lacking for that reason alone. (And as to the absence of the Dwarf Coaster, isn't there an "official" opening scheduled after it is finished? Isn't this a "soft open" to offer a "sneak peek" of an area "under construction?")
Originally Posted By Doobie <<< (And as to the absence of the Dwarf Coaster, isn't there an "official" opening scheduled after it is finished? Isn't this a "soft open" to offer a "sneak peek" of an area "under construction?") >>> I don't believe this part is true. It's in soft opening right now but there is a grand opening on December 6th and I don't see anything to indicate that's not a real grand opening (with one major attraction unfinished). I expect that attraction will have its own grand opening in 2014.
Originally Posted By Dlmusic I also disagree with the premise in that Belle's Village misses a major attraction because I feel that Be Our Guest is enough of a major statement since it is such a cool restaurant. There are things I might have like in the area that aren't there, but an E-Ticket wouldn't change what I would have liked atmospherically in the area.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> In my opinion, while details are abound I did not feel it was quite on the World Showcase level. Morocco for example is far more immersive to me than anywhere inside the Fantasyland expansion. I love how many of the World Showcase pavilions have little tucked away corners or multiple paths to get to places making them feel like an actual location. New Fantasyland by comparison has only one path connecting everything and Belle's Village is too small to really get lost in. << Funny you say that. I was surprised from the videos I saw that the "forest" didn't feel more intimate. That sidewalk going through the area looks massive, which looks like it undermines any feeling of a quaint stroll. Maybe it'll feeling different in two years when the mine coaster opens.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros I was also surprised to find out that the gift shop in Belle's village was just selling 'gifts' rather than books. It seemed like such an obvious choice, given Belle's love for books and the picturesque shop in the film, but I guess the merchandise folks had their say in the matter. There are plenty of books already being sold in WDW's parks to fill a small shop (or a section of a bigger one), so it seems strange that this store was given a more broad merchandise selection
Originally Posted By Dlmusic << That sidewalk going through the area looks massive, which looks like it undermines any feeling of a quaint stroll.>> You are right. I understand the need for wide walkways, but the walkways here are so wide that it feels a bit like a freeway going through the countryside. Not quaint at all.
Originally Posted By Dlmusic Just to clarify in case it sounds like I am really negative, I think that the detail in New Fantasyland is fantastic and it is very beautiful. The issues that I've brought up relate only to the immersion factor. And perhaps a wish that the area was a bit more lively or fun for lack of a better word. No doubt it though it's quite pretty and Be Our Guest and the exterior of Under the Sea are among the best examples of theme park architecture I've ever seen.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt Ferret you're surprised that the shop doesn't sell books? I'm surprised that your surprised.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<You are right. I understand the need for wide walkways, but the walkways here are so wide that it feels a bit like a freeway going through the countryside. Not quaint at all.> GOOD!! Maybe during busy times they won't have to put up ropes in the middle of the walkways and try to funnel people through an impossibly narrow area like they have in the past through the heart of Fantasyland! P.S. I know they were going for atmosphere at Animal Kingdom also, but during busy periods the walkways in that park are impossibly narrow... a TRUE NIGHTMARE!
Originally Posted By dshyates Yeah, the FLE is Practically Perfect in every way. It's just that there is nothing there that holds any interest for me or anyone in our family. Be Our Guest will be quite popular. As will Storytime with Belle. All in all, the FLE will be a HUGE hit with the DisneyDemo of obsessive planners and those that stake out their spot for Wishes right after the rope drop.
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub Maybe just maybe it is officially time to stop comparing DL to WDW. I hate to tell you but the guests (target audience) have a different mindset or appetite. I have alternated trips to both destinations repeatedly over the last 5-6 years. The tourist that arrives in WDW really wants to stand in line, long lines for a character meetngreet. And that is exactly what they are building because those long lines were blocking the entry to the gift shops. Heaven forbid. I also think WDW just accepts all of the other Florida tourist attractions as part of the big package. I don't think WDW is worried about HP or Legoland cause they are all bringing tourists into town together. ( Although it is funny Disney wanted the Butterbeer money flow so desperately that they opened Gaston's tavern and are trying to get the alcohol money flow tapped in the parks now. ). That is why they are so aggressive with the next generation technology intro to WDW property. It is all about the money and figuring out how to get it with the least expense. Ultimately the money has a different feel in California versus Floriida and manipulating the future money flow is the motivation. I do indeed worry more about management decisions for the future of Disneyland with the changes being made. I fear they are going to Floridify Disneyland...
Originally Posted By leemac Ultimately FLE hits the MK mission statement on every pledge - it is designed for families with young kids. That is the target audience for MK these days and so the whole thing works. The really odd thing for me is that this entire project was driven by undercapacity at the park. One of the key performance indicators for any Disney theme park is the number of attractions that the average guest can experience in one day - as attendance starts to creep up then that number dwindles as guests spend longer in standby lines (incredibly FastPass had no discernible impact on this number). The only reason this expansion was greenlighted in the first place was to increase capacity at the park - but they have removed one ride and only added one high capacity ride (TLM). The coaster will be a mid-capacity attraction. I would have thought that for the money it was important to get more guests to spend time in this section - whether it was by little touches like interactive experiences or by attractions and shows. The Meet 'n' Greets and Storytime are such low capacity that they won't move the needle. Ultimately it is a massive improvement over the tournament tent design of the rest of FL but I'm not sure MK got bang for their buck with this one.
