Originally Posted By leemac <<How's the Mansion approval coming along?>> There is no capital expenditure projects in the works for HKDL. The Company continue to negotiate with their local partner. That is all you need to know. There is nothing to report.
Originally Posted By leemac <<The fact remains Disney needs China far more than China needs Disney.>> We will have to agree to disagree on that one. I firmly believe that China needs external support in order to reach the next stage of development. There is no doubt that the locals are capable of generating some internally-derived content but there is a big appetite for foreign culture. It may not be the same as the Japanese but it is significant. They aren't going to be able to create movies like Spiderman, POTC and Batman. The Chinese just don't have the availability of media product that they need - and should be entitled to choose what they want to see and when. That type of revenue whether it be TV or theatrical could be a significant measure of how China continues to develop a society with discretionary spend. At the moment that discretionary spend is on the likes of LV and Gucci handbags. It isn't sustainable. Man I could go on for hours about this.
Originally Posted By leemac In relation to your point about Shanghai - Jay will be going on the record this month in an interview in Tales. The section about Shanghai is below: LJM: It seems like every week there is a Shanghai government official claiming that Disney and the city have reached an agreement for a Shanghai Disneyland. JR: We should take it as a great compliment that people are so interested in being the first to announce a Disneyland on the mainland. Mostly we believe that it is land speculators that would like to believe that to be the case. Our position on an official level is that we have no deal and nothing to announce. There is always rumor and speculation but we have an open and multi-faceted dialogue with both the central and Shanghai governments about many of our businesses. We have our corporate offices in Shanghai working on different initiatives to bring the Disney magic to the Chinese in different ways like theatrical movie releases and terrestrial television. Part of that dialogue is when is the right time and what is the right way to introduce the theme park business to a Chinese audience which is geographically distinct as an audience to those close to Hong Kong. I do believe that someday we will develop a theme park on the mainland. However we are still some way from it but we have a long term vision for an expanded Disney presence for all of our lines of business in China.
Originally Posted By jkayjs Spirit my lad. I enjoyed your impressions of HKDL and your "spirited" exchange with leemac. Sometimes it's hard for me to follow along since I don't have the insider knowledge you both have. That being said I sure learn a lot. Hey I haven't been on my email much I'll shot you a line soon. BTW let me know if you still plan a fall trip.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<I'd dispute that too. Personally I think you are consumer-savvy - you understand buzzwords and how they work. So when you create names for Meg or believe that there is WalMart'ing then it works to convey your message. And it is effective. Very effective.>> Sure. I'm consumer-savvy. I am a consumer ... and a big spender on all things Disney. The reason why Disney's 'brand' has diminished is because they have stopped respecting their guests and their cast (yes that's a very broad statement, but one I feel is true largely enough to state it). As to Inoverherheadmeg, I can't fully take credit for her pet name. That name came from someone at TDO in a kinda, sorta way when I asked how she was faring early in her tenure ... the spirit said 'she's in over her head' and I just kind of started using it. The fact others inside Disney use the nickname validate its accuracy to me. I'll repeat that I have never met the woman, even in passing. And considering how many people at Disney I have met, that's really saying something. She was totally off the radar when she was given the figurehead position. As to WalMarting, well I'll take full and proud credit for that one. And I don't just use it for Disney, but for our nation and its people at this point. It reflects a desire to dumb down to the absolute lowest common denomenator. I do feel that has been the direction of Disney and WDW (DAK being the lone bright spot) in particular over the past decade. You never discuss things like park upkeep (or lack thereof) or things that lower guest expectations and experiences, which is understandable due to your personal situation. I do respect that, but I don't suffer any need to act similarly. I truly wish Disney would realize what made its parks so great for four decades and go back to that business model because the current one provides a lesser experience. WalMarting isn't good for anyone except Wall Street and as the current financial disaster should show anyone with a modicum of intelligence, what's best for Wall Street is in no way, shape or form what's best for consumers. <<However I do think that you are quick to blame the VPs at the parks for every "misstep" in your eyes.>> I know enough about the Disney power structure to understand how much effect a VP has on his/her park(s). Now, I do realize there are thing beyond their control ... for instance I wouldn't blame the park VPs when food prices are increased across WDW because we know they don't decide that. But they do have more input into the day to day operation of their parks than anyone else ... so when I see something wrong at a certain park, the first person to look at would be the VP. <<You know I'll disagree with you about MK - to me it is the cash cow of WDW and I'm happy to see it milked if the rest of the parks see development.>> I can't share the sentiment. The MK may not exist in a vacuum, but it also shouldn't exist to sell plush that enables DAK to get expansion funds. <<I have never had any fondness for MK so I'm happy to let it slide. That said - there are some very ambitious plans for MK if WDW has the stomach to add the capacity (and that is the genius point - MK now needs new attractions from a capacity POV). The Golden Goose will only continue to lay the valuable eggs if she is well-tended to. >> That is just my point ... the MK has been milked to the point the udders are bleeding. It is stale. There is nothing new there. There is nothing to wow unless you're a first-time visitor. The last significant attraction opened five long years ago and it was a 3D movie stolen from Hong Kong. The last major addition was Splash Mountain ... that came when another Bush was in the White House. At some point Jay's marketing campaigns aren't going to be enough ...there need to be new attractions, new shows, new dining experiences, even new shopping ... not just more of the same ... and when the Contemporary timeshares sell out then what? Oh yeah, that's when Disney's Grand Flordian Beach Villas go public.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Man I could go on for hours about this. >> I'm listening ... go right ahead. I find this kind of discussion fascinating in a way those 'Riverside or Coronado Springs' threads just will never be. I had to take leave from the LP for a bit to be in LA for Emmy season (and yes, it does appear the Academy is actively trying to destroy the event totally ... you might even say they're Walmarting it!) with a bit of time on the backlot at Uni (no theme park visit), time at the wonderful DLR as well as Knott's ... oh ... and I had a run in with a bear and her cub in Sequoia (seriously!) But I am back now and raring for some high quality Disney talk ... so what character breakfast at WDW is your favorite? ;-)
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<However we are still some way from it but we have a long term vision for an expanded Disney presence for all of our lines of business in China.>> Jay, buddy, vision is very important. Unfortunately, sometimes it gets clouded by things like ego, power and lack of communication. It really would be a shame if that continued to plague Disney in China ... no one is immune ... even Viacom (the government's favorite US media company) is learning that. Let's see some substance, Jay. All we've heard from Burbank is bluster and posturing. Saying Disney wants to expand its presence in Mainland China is sort of akin to saying McDonald's has a passing interest in beef. It IS the largest single market in the world and all evidence indicates the all-important government officials are heavily disinclined to extend anything close to what Disney is looking for much less the cowtowing Mickey seems to seek. As evidence of this, your recent NYC media 'buffet' to kick off Magical Celebrations included invitations to some of the webmasters of fan sites ... webmasters who were quick to slip out the news of the project planned for Shanghai and other details about the market in an effort to pressure Beijing officials. It was reported in USA Today last week that by 2015 China will surpass the USA in tourism, one wonders if Disney will still be on the outside looking in ... although I can tell you one thing, you won't be planting another story with Reuters again after that July 29th foray that made Beijing very unhappy and even caused some difficulties for the reporter. Oh, and maybe by 2015 HKDL will have more than a dozen legit attractions?
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Spirit my lad. I enjoyed your impressions of HKDL and your "spirited" exchange with leemac.>> Thanks a lot. It means much coming from someone such as yourself I do intend to continue the report (if folks are still interested?) in the next few weeks. I haven't even gotten to the amazing spectacle that is a late-night buffet at Chef Mickey's ... or the weird abandoned ferry dock that looks like it will never see use ... or the odd placement of a couple of softball/baseball diamonds in between Disney's two resorts ... so, yeah, I do have lots of ground left to cover. <<Sometimes it's hard for me to follow along since I don't have the insider knowledge you both have. That being said I sure learn a lot.>> You know what they say about learning every day you breathe! <<Hey I haven't been on my email much I'll shot you a line soon. BTW let me know if you still plan a fall trip.>> Already emailed and will email more this weekend.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>I truly wish Disney would realize what made its parks so great for four decades and go back to that business model because the current one provides a lesser experience<< Amen to that. The current model feels so wrong. I remember a time when people in the UK would make their first trip and want to book a return visit before they got home. Now I hear more and more about how Disney is trying to make a buck at every turn and they may or may not return. My word, I was on a professional course the other week and my fellow delegates commented on some of my subtle Disney clothes and asked me about my interest. I relayed some of the reasons I likes Disney. Now almost everyone there had been to a resort, but none were mega fans. But man, they realy ragged on bibidi bobidi boutiue, princesses in all the stores, and pin trading! One had said they have a timeshare and used to go every year. The last few years, they have stopped bothering because the MK was getting worse and worse in the cleanliness, maintenance, and service departments. It mad me so sad an mad to hear it (because I know its true and I can't do anything about it). And these were casual observers. What does that tell the DoMs blinded by the pixie dust?
Originally Posted By Bob Paris Oh but Dave - How can DoMs exist when there IS no mediocrity? It's all in the imaginations of us critically minded fans.......dincha know? Oh and the US economy is going great guns too!
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Oh I forgot, thanks for the reminder! Sorry for the typos, my handheld was obviously not picking up on the keys. Oh well, I suppose the little things don't matter.
Originally Posted By Bob Paris I did find it very telling that even non-Disney theme park geeks(I call them "mundanes")are starting to notice the really awful offerings like the JonBenet Boutique and the general nickel and diming at WDW. Sad that the "flagship" resort has come to epitomize the very same carnival type huckstering mindset that Walt wanted to get away from.
Originally Posted By Bob Paris DO SOMETHING ABOUT THAT THEN, TDLFAN!!!! (Or I'll come over there and smash all your Donna Summer vinyl!!!) ; )
Originally Posted By WorldDisney Woah, even TDLFAN is back, welcome back to the non Donna Summer threads buddy lol.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 Been meaning to return and finish the thread with some observations about the hotels, general area and cultural differences ... but one thing I'd like to ask before I forget is does anyone have a clue why there are two softball/baseball fields stuck right in the middle of the two Disney hotels? Clearly, they aren't for use by guests. So, either they are horribly placed by management for CMs/locals ... or they were places there for some temporary event and left ... or they were put there by the government for some unknown reason ... so anyone know? Also, what's the deal with the abandoned and never used ferry terminal? Will it ever be used? Is this an issue with Disney or the HK SAR or both? Seeing it just sit there with a few fisherman using it as a base of operations was a bit ... weird. Just two strange observations.
Originally Posted By TDR_Fan I think that land between the two Disney hotels was intended for a third hotel. They apparently failed to negotiate a deal to get ferries to visit Hong Kong Disneyland due to its location.
Originally Posted By leemac <<Also, what's the deal with the abandoned and never used ferry terminal? Will it ever be used? Is this an issue with Disney or the HK SAR or both?>> HK SAR - the dock is owned and operated by the government. They attempted to get operators like Star to get guests to Lantau but were unsuccessful.
Originally Posted By Malin I don't think demand is high enough for the dock to be used at present. Besides with the MTR being so quick and reliable anyway, why would you need to use a Ferry to get to the park.
Originally Posted By WorldDisney Yeah, thats what I heard too. The guest demand is simply too low and they couldnt get any company to go out there, especially when you think the distance, taking people out there, but then so very few back on the turnaround until probably near park closing. Just not enough capitol for something like that I guess. Maybe when HKDL reach TDR attendance levels, there will be ferries every 15 minutes lol.
