Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Split your visit to Tokyo the city and TDR into two portions: stay on-site during your TDR potion and stay put (except perhaps to go one station down the Keiyo Line for food one night). Then, for your Tokyo portion, leave the resort and stay in town.<<< What about if you just stay offsite, in Tokyo, the whole trip? That sounds cheaper, to me.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***2-3 days in Osaka to get over jetlag and check out USJ, then Kyoto and Nara for a few days, 5 days Toyko, and then fishish with a relaxing 5 day finale at TDL/TDS to finish the trip (or maybe a week leaving some cusion time if we wanted to go back into Tokyo)*** You could skip all of Osaka in order to spend more time elsewhere...stay in Kyoto and daytrip to USJ if you absolutely must (I see NO reason why you should bother even with that though, if you've already been to Universal in Florida)... Take those 2 (or three) days and add them to the Tokyo end, but make sure to include side trips to Hakkone and Nikko. That would be perfect, I think.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***What about if you just stay offsite, in Tokyo, the whole trip? That sounds cheaper, to me*** SuperDry already explained in detail why he wouldn't recommend that course of action, and I think it wise to re-read what he wrote...he knows what he's talking about, for sure! Besides, staying in Tokyo is, generally speaking, MORE expensive than at the TDR (unless you're staying in Disney Hotels, then it's a lot more expensive).
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< What about if you just stay offsite, in Tokyo, the whole trip? That sounds cheaper, to me. >>> Even cheaper would be to stay in town and skip TDR altogether. Cheaper still would be to just stay home. With regard to travel, if you're not careful, you can get yourself into situations where based on a certain decision, you save 10-15% overall, and end up getting only half the value out of the entire trip. An extreme example for this in Tokyo might be that you have it in your head for some reason that you MUST stay at a Hilton, so you look it up online, and choose the Narita Hilton by the airport for your entire Japan stay because it's half the price of the other ones in the Tokyo area. That would be a "big mistake" for sure. Having said that, I do understand the issue of cost. If you have an absolute upper limit on what you can spend, then that's your limit and you make it work within that constraint. I would like to point out that there is some middle ground - it's not a choice between a $60/night off-site Good Neighbor hotel or a $700/night room at the MiraCosta. In addition to the 3 Disney hotels, there are 6 Official Hotels at the resort, all on the monorail loop. More specifically, there is a Sheraton and a Hilton, which are good choices for int'l visitors. Not only are they consistently 60% cheaper than the Disney hotels and as low as $180/night in the off season, there are several freeloading opportunities for those that are members of their loyalty programs and stay at their other properties and/or have the right credit card. I have more to say about Spirit's $60/night hotel, but it will have to wait.
Originally Posted By Blufusion05 Mister Spirit . You have finaly shown you true color. You think you are better than everyone else on here. May the next time you fly to Japan dont let he door hit you in your ass.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<If you don't mind me asking (and even if you do), what was the nightly rate when you guys went?>> <<Geez, I don't remember. Seems like it was close to $700 a night. it was a ton. But we were operating under the "we may never get here again" guise, which certainly won't end up being the case.>> Kinda what I thought. ... Maybe I'm just cheap (don't think so, though), but I just couldn't ever see myself paying that for a hotel room, even there. I've traveled the world and stayed in five star resorts and lots of mid-level places too and I admit when the price goes north of $200 a night I get a bit queasy. And I think I spend more time in my rooms on vacation than the average traveler. I'd love to stay at the MC, just not at those prices. But who knows? If the redistribution of wealth in this country ever comes my way, maybe I'll change my tune ...but doubt it.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<You forgot to end your post with "AND GET OFF MY LAWN YOU YOUNG WHIPPER SNAPPER!!! >> I'll have to Tweet that ... oh wait, I don't do that ...
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<What and where is this "Roy's" place dude?>> Roy's is a great chain and pretty common. I believe there's even one in Orlando now ...
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<There are loads of folks where this is a case at disneyland Paris too. They may have been to DLP a dozen times but have never been to Paris. Mind you there are folks who have been to Orlando numerous times and have never been to KSC or IOA.>> Yes. But that's the old chocolate ice cream argument (that's what it is called in my realm as a friend never likes to try anything new). I have had chocolate ice cream. I like chocolate ice cream. Why should I try any other flavor? Or sorbet or gelato? Or (cringing) pastries, pies or cakes? <<But if going to TDL, you can be sure we will go to Disney for at least 4 days. I do not do commando visits, and I like to linger over meals too. so i am not going to kill myself over it.>> Well, see that is one of the few major 'issues' I had with TDR. They kind of force you to go commando -- at least on a first visit unless you want to pay more and buy one day tix all the time. I bought four day passes and in order to do so, you have to go four straight days. You also have to decide in advance what parks you'll be going to on days one and two. I loved my visit. I feel I saw a great majority of the parks. But it wasn't relaxing (except maybe my last day at TDS when I made the conscious effort to 'see whatever I see') and I didn't have young kids in tow. And other than one very nice meal at TDS, I didn't take a lot of time to 'dine and linger' (faves of mine). I often go to WDW four days in a row, but it's a completely different dynamic with an AP and a 'been there, done that' feeling ... so getting to EPCOT to start my day at 5 p.m. isn't unusual at all. <<I am just going to make sure I allow plenty of time for our visit to take in both elements (though I suspect the Tokyo experince will be very different with kids in tow). >> For sure. But your angels are world travelers already, so I suspect they'll still be much better to get around with than most kids. <<But I need at least 2 if not 3 days at TDS I think.>> I did two days. But I do think three for that park is the right amount for a first visit. <<and although I always thought TDL looked like it sucked,>> It DOES NOT!!! Shame on you ... <<I do need to do Dreamlights, Monsters Inc, Winnie the Pooh, the Polynesian Show, maybe the Golden Horseshoe Revue, as well as the other entertainment options.>> All of those things are great and well worth seeing for anyone. The Diamond Horsehoe though is tricky. I wanted to do it badly, but didn't find out until just before hitting Japan that you can only reserve it online in advance and that you can only do so in Japanese, no exceptions. ... I wound up not doing it (and since it is a dinner show deal, OLC lost my $$$, although I am sure locals made up for it). Next time, I'll have a 'local' reserve it for me. <<I want to try the Jungle Cruise, Haunted Mansion, and PotC to see how it differs (and the cultural reactions), as well as Splash Mountain (still a rare attraction for us, I have ridden it twice in Florida and once in California). the kids won't let us get away with skipping Bug Thunder. And I want to see if there are any special nuances in the park.>> Those attractions are ALL worth doing and then some. There are differences on all of them ('specially Splash and PoC). I didn't regret any attraction I did in TDL with the possible exception of Tiki Room (Hawaiian version with Stitch that isn't that good). As to nuances, this park still has plenty of 'places' to check out and oodles of detail. <<Also we need to take time to explore the three official hotels and to see Zed. so in an ideal world, I would love a week at TDL (at least 5 days).>> I never really thought seriously about Zed. I've done plenty of Cirque shows (one that I just saw in Vegas was pretty disappointing) and saw no need. <<Although I understand, except for TDS, the detailing is not present in the way we see it in anaheim or Paris? Our last trip to California was 5 dyas and we still did not do everything we wanted to. I am assuming Tokyo Disney would be similar?>> Plenty of detailing at TDL. I hope my comments on the strange layout and buildout of the park haven't given wrong impressions there. But I can't stress enough that you really shouldn't go in with the 'tude of 'seeing it all' ... you can't do that anywhere, except maybe HKDL if you spent two days (for the hotels too). You have to expect to not see and do everything. It just sets you up for disappointment. I saw most of what I wanted. The vast majority ... but there's plenty left for a future visit and that's a good thing. <<As for Tokyo, I was picturing another 5 days in the city, and then a 3 day side trip to Kyoto. We did think of doing the following: 2-3 days in Osaka to get over jetlag and check out USJ, then Kyoto and Nara for a few days, 5 days Toyko, and then fishish with a relaxing 5 day finale at TDL/TDS to finish the trip (or maybe a week leaving some cusion time if we wanted to go back into Tokyo). >> I did 11 days (more like 10 when you factor travel) there and four were spent at TDR (plus another night for dinner at Hotel and monorail ride and Ikspiari)... but the five days in Tokyo (and GREAT area near my hotel) weren't nearly enough ... just like five days wouldn't be enough in NYC or London or Rome or Hong Kong.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 >>>Split your visit to Tokyo the city and TDR into two portions: stay on-site during your TDR potion and stay put (except perhaps to go one station down the Keiyo Line for food one night). Then, for your Tokyo portion, leave the resort and stay in town.<<< <<What about if you just stay offsite, in Tokyo, the whole trip? That sounds cheaper, to me. >> It is. You don't have a simple either/or situation. ... You don't have to opt for either being 'on site' or staying say in the heart of Tokyo in one of the priciest hotels. There are many options that can get you into both Tokyo and TDR in less time than some WDW internal bus routes and can wind up cutting thousands of dollars off the cost.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>just like five days wouldn't be enough in NYC or London or Rome or Hong Kong.<<< ah yes, but I get city weary. I really am not a fan of cities for periods of time. I prefer country sides. I like cities in bite size chunks. And I think I would go crazy if I spent 5 days in London or Paris. No thanks. Rather do a day in a city or two and a few days in the countryside, even if we return to the city. I don't really like people, well masses of them anyway. I need to get away from the noise and hustle and bustle. The grumpiest/most depressed I have been in my life is working in London every day. Not cool
Originally Posted By Mr X ^---side trips from Tokyo to Nikko (monkeys and shrines and beautiful countryside), and Hakkone (a favorite weekend getaway for Tokyo-ites, lots of hot springs baths and resorty kinda stuff, plus mountain train trips and the like), which can be done in a day but an overnight is best in both cases (let me warn you about Japanese Inns though, they can be murder on your back if you can't do loads of floor-sitting, better to opt for a B&B that still has hot springs baths but regular bedrooms rather than tatami floor life!)... Those two options will give you great, easy breaks from the city and you'll see plenty of Japanese country life and nature along the way.
Originally Posted By Mr X Thinking it over, my best advice considering what you've said is to skip Osaka entirely, spend two full days in Kyoto and then travel to Tokyo in the morning of your third full day (this becomes Tokyo, day 1). If you have one hotel in Tokyo you'll be "in and out" of, inquire as to whether or not you can leave the bulk of your things there on the nights you're out on your excursions. It only takes a couple of hours, so you should be in Tokyo by lunchtime. Check into your hotel if possible, or at least drop off your stuff, and enjoy the city for the day, and spend all of day two there. On day three, make your way towards Nikko, checking out Yokohama and/or Kamakura along the way if desired. Arrive in Nikko in the evening, and spend all of day four and part of day five there. Return to Tokyo in the afternoon of day five, enjoy Tokyo for the evening and one more day (day six), then in the morning of day seven, go to Hakkone for some relaxation (only takes 90 minutes or so to get there), stay overnight, and enjoy a leisurely day 8 in the countryside in Hakkone. On the evening of day 8, proceed directly to the Tokyo Disney Resort for the rest of your vacation.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo As long as there is sufficient time to spend with Mr, Mrs and Little X.
Originally Posted By Mr X That might be a tad more difficult these days, we're moving further away from Tokyo soon...however, we'll still be within shouting distance of TDR so we can definitely hang out there (depending on what you guys have/haven't sampled, we can round out your cuisine experiences easily in Urayasu or Ikspiari if you can pull yourselves away from the parks for an hour or two lol). I can probably meet you more easily in Tokyo as well (as I still have business in the city most weeks), but unfortunately I'd be alone.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 Been meaning to return to this thread, but it seems to be dying so I'm really not sure how much time/energy I want to spend on it. That said, I need to at least start some serious loving on TDS. It is the most amazing thing WDI has likely ever created, although EPCOT Center (OK, WED, but same thing) and DLP can actually be uttered in the same sentence. This thing ... thie theme park ... was so painstaking and lovingly created that it is hard to place in words just how spectacular a job was done. A Spirit I greatly admire (not myself, thanks) says of TDS, ''The other Disney parks are like stepping onto a movie set, while TDS is like stepping into a movie.'' That would also be my opinion 100%. While Disney has done this a bit in places (DLP and DAK with detailing come to mind), nowhere does it compare with the scale ... the magnitude that TDS hits you with it. And no, sorry fanbois, but pictures don't do this justice. Like a beautiful woman (or man) or dinner or landscape, you simply must experience it on a human basis by being there. Our resident Disney gadfly who is cruising on a Dream always seemed to have a problem with this. Hyperrealism. Closed narratives. He said it all made him feel cold versus the 'you create the magic yourself' openings that a park built on the cheap like DCA had. I'd argue, but until I experienced it for myself ... well, it's so much easier now. Because I do agree with Leemac's criticisms, only I view them quite differently. Everything that has been picked apart about this amazing second gate on Tokyo Bay is what combines to make it a masterpiece. The detailing is such that you could visit every day for a month and only get a sample of what is there. A striking difference with say HKDL, a park I kind of feel like a local in now, but also one in which I feel I've seen it all or most. Awe. That was my feeling when I first entered TDS with the Aquasphere in front of me. I haven't felt that sense in a Disney park since October 1982 really. That sense that something special was created. That boundaries were pushed. And that no penny was spared (except perhaps with restrooms!) And I felt that way before passing under the Mira Costa (sorry, Paris ... sorry, Anaheim ... this is the first Disney hotel that truly feels like it is part of the park, part of the story) and seeing a lagoon (albeit one with a crane for Fantasmic construction -- why does it have to be TOONS??!?! -- in the middle) with an active volcano above it. Now, let's be blunt, if this were WDW, the volcano would have rumbled maybe once or twice for commercials, maybe spewed fire for a media party and then gone into Disco Volcano (sounds like a girlie drink at some tacky chain place, right?) mode forever more. OK, let's be blunter, if this were WDW they never would have spent the money to even construct such an amazing facility. The Tree of Life may be impressive and Cindy's Fibgerglass Love Shack may make fanbois blather in tears, but neither comes close to what Mount Prometheus delivers. Anything bad about TDS, oh Spirit? Let's get that out of the way quickly. Merchandise. It sucks. Bad. Now, it is different than WDW crap. But it's just another variety. The shops are so ornate and themed that it is sad to see them chock full of Duffy plush, cookie tins and CUTE (not what I'd call it, but what they feel it is) Disney hats, cellphone danglers, mittens, socks etc. I had a lot of friends request merchandise from this park. And I had set aside a lot of my own discretionary income to buy stuff for myself. I came home with almost nothing. Walking into shops that once featured models of the Nautilus or 1920s and 30s Mickey merchandise or fine Italian housewares to see lots of crap was sad ... does it sell? Sure. Just like at WDW or DL. But does more of it sell by having it practically everywhere (some exceptions ... for instance a shop in Lost River Delta across from Indy had themed merchandise for both the attraction and from South and Central America)? My answer is no. Attractions at TDS will be my next installment. But suffice to say, they ALL impressed me. I either enjoyed them, liked them a lot, loved them or was giddy as a fanboi at an Imagineering party over them. Almost everything at TDS is an original. Only Indy, ToT and Turtle Talk (which I did not experience) have versions elsewhere, although Raging Spirits is close enough to the Indy coaster at DLP to count. ToT feels like an entirely new attraction and Indy doesn't seem like a clone either ... but more on that later. Oh, did I gush enough about TDS? (I think so because I didn't even hate on WDW much.)
Originally Posted By Mr X ***Merchandise. It sucks. Bad*** Sadly, this is a recent phenomenon. The goods used to be much more unique and cool.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***Awe. That was my feeling when I first entered TDS with the Aquasphere in front of me. I haven't felt that sense in a Disney park since October 1982 really. That sense that something special was created. That boundaries were pushed. And that no penny was spared (except perhaps with restrooms!) And I felt that way before passing under the Mira Costa (sorry, Paris ... sorry, Anaheim ... this is the first Disney hotel that truly feels like it is part of the park, part of the story) and seeing a lagoon (albeit one with a crane for Fantasmic construction -- why does it have to be TOONS??!?! -- in the middle) with an active volcano above it*** Yup. The entrance already makes you feel like you're in the coolest place ever, until they take it to a whole other level just a few (hidden) steps later. I absolutely LOVE the way DisneySea unfolds.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 ***Merchandise. It sucks. Bad*** <<Sadly, this is a recent phenomenon. The goods used to be much more unique and cool. >> That's what I've been told, X ... and it's really sad they are going the WDW model (actually, when you look, shopping is better at DAK and EPCOT by far than it is at TDS). I have no problem with crap. Just not in EVERY location. The only thing that ruined my Mysterious Island illusion (remember: I missed a 6.9 quake because I thought it was a Disney special effect!) was walking into the gift shop overlooking the Nautilus and seeing CUTE Disney crap from end to end.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Yup. The entrance already makes you feel like you're in the coolest place ever, until they take it to a whole other level just a few (hidden) steps later. I absolutely LOVE the way DisneySea unfolds.>> Unfolds is the perfect word. ... It is a slow, gentle process ... and the way the park is tiered (levels ... something that could never work in WDW, land of the morbidly obese and the ECVs that carry them) just adds in so much mystery and makes a large park feel huge. The design was just ingenious really.
