Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "<I can't wait for the criminal trials around 2009, 2010. This Administration is toast.> I doubt that." Hey, you could be right. Cheney will do us all a favor and have that last heart attack.
Originally Posted By DAR Question: Bush's title is the Comander in Chief, so does Congress have the right to impede on that title?
Originally Posted By jonvn There will be no trials. Come on.... When this admin is out, we'll just all breathe a sigh of relief and try to fix everything they have messed up. But there isn't going to be any trial.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>No one promised we'd be greeted as liberators<< Okay, not promised. But Cheney believed we would, and said so. He was woefully wrong. He's been wrong about a lot and it has cost us dearly. Why you're still a fan is beyond me. >>Maybe not, but it might turn out the way some have predicted, as long as we don't listen to the modern day Copperheads.<< Copperheads again. You found a new slogan to repeat. Congratulations. But not listening to people is what neocons do best. No matter what doses of reality people try to show them, your guys stubbornly refuse to see it. It's called delusional.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>I'm not claiming that my opinions are reality.<< Well, that's good. No one else claims your opinions are reality either.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "There will be no trials. Come on...." I wouldn't be too sure. Can you name a previous Administration, that was this secretive, this arrogant, that tried to rule by executive fiat more than this one? That blew by the Constitution like so much toilet paper? Answer: Nixon's. And who went to jail? Most all of them, and the only reason Nixon didn't go on trial is Ford pardoned him. It isn't as if there's no precedent.
Originally Posted By jonvn They were actually caught engaging in criminal acts, and were investigated by Congress while in office. Once they are gone, they're going to be gone. Although they should go to jail, they'll probably live a life of ease and plenty, with the books they write and their oil stock money.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <He was woefully wrong. He's been wrong about a lot and it has cost us dearly.> That's just nonsense. <But not listening to people is what neocons do best. No matter what doses of reality people try to show them, your guys stubbornly refuse to see it.> No, not really. <No one else claims your opinions are reality either.> Unfortunately, you claim yours are. They're not.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <Although they should go to jail, they'll probably live a life of ease and plenty, with the books they write and their oil stock money.> Despite what the delusional believe, they've done nothing criminal.
Originally Posted By ecdc It's nonsense that Cheney was wrong? That's just comical. So much for "last throes" and we'll be "greeted as liberators" and "Saddam has WMDs" - all Cheney statements. But Douglas knows he's wrong and has no facts to back him up, which is why he can only retort with "that's your opinion" and that what we say is "nonsense." The truth of this war is out there in hundreds of newspaper articles, and dozens of books and documentaries for everyone to see. The only people who say otherwie are the administration and their loyalists. We can read their phoenetically spelled garbage at www.whitehouse.gov or we can read the truth everyday at www.nytimes.com or in boks like "Fiasco."
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan Post 68 is more Monty Python. Not even worth responding to it. >>But Douglas knows he's wrong and has no facts to back him up, which is why he can only retort with "that's your opinion" and that what we say is "nonsense."<< Exactly. But he's a big fan of this administration, and in for a penny, in for a pound. Nothing they could do at this point would shake his loyalty.
Originally Posted By jonvn Just wait and see how these patriots who are outraged we are criticizing the President behave when a democrat is in office. See how they turn around and start ripping into everything they do, no matter how trivial. That's what happened last time.
Originally Posted By JohnS1 "The same old garbage they promised back in 2002, back when we were told we'd be greeted as liberators, with flowers and chocolate." This is one of those statements - that we thought we'd be greeted as liberators but were not - that keeps being made, even though there were many instances where we actually were greeted as liberators. Doesn't anybody recall all the videos by American journalists showing Iraqis greeting American soldiers, hugging them, handing them flowers, and then going on to do things like tear down statues of Saddam Hussein? Granted, it was a short-lived period, after which the terrorists began to surface and do their thing, but we actually were greeting initially as liberators, if anyone cares to remember. That part of all the predictions about Iraq actually came true.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >nd then going on to do things like tear down statues of Saddam Hussein? << These things happened, but it was American forces that had to pull down that statue. Remember, too, that at first the soldier covered the statues face with an American flag. Then someone must have told him that looked like we were conquerors, not liberators, and quickly that flag was removed. Granted, it was a short-lived period<< Boy howdy. Once we started cracking down on the looting, things changed fast. The thing about the "greeted as liberators" statement is that it suggests that people would be inspired to comply with our hopes, that anyone who questioned this war was "doom and gloomers". The people of Iraq were yearning for democracy. But we weren't yearning for teh creation of another Islamic theocracy. And that's what is likely to form in Iraq.
Originally Posted By ecdc John's correct - there was a time when we were received fairly well. Then, the administration's incompetene blew it. It started with allowing the looting of Baghdad, then got much worse with the de-Baathizing, then we setup an interrim government without the say of Iraqis - guess how that looked - and then the biggie, the disbanding of the Iraqi army. I don't know about Douglas, but I think telling 500,000 armed men to go home and that they were unemployed wasn't too bright. These are the facts of what happened. One can wrap themselves in the flag and shed a tear while orating about things like "freedom," "victory," and "defeating the terrorists," all one would like. But thanks to Bush's incompetence, those things are now meaningless and undefinable in Iraq.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <It's nonsense that Cheney was wrong?> It's nonsense that he was woefully wrong. <Douglas knows he's wrong and has no facts to back him up> Douglas knows he's right, but that any evidence he presents will be rejected, so it's not worth presenting it. I've been down this road too many times in the last 4 years.
Originally Posted By DouglasDubh <Just wait and see how these patriots who are outraged we are criticizing the President behave when a democrat is in office.> It's not the criticizing that are objectionable. It's the constant misrepresentation of the facts, and the posting of opinion as if it's fact.
Originally Posted By jonvn No one but you is intentionally misrepresenting the facts. Which, again, is a shame, but you seem intent on behaving in that manner.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "<It's nonsense that Cheney was wrong?> It's nonsense that he was woefully wrong." You know, I was going to post all sorts of information to show how nonsensical this denial is, but I just didn't have the time.
