Originally Posted By ecdc Yeah, I'm with Dave. I'm not all that passionate about my opinion on sports - I'm not going to make a federal case out of it or anything. And I don't really know enough about individual athletes (football or any other sport) to take issue specifically with them. But really, our obsession with sports just tells me we're not a very serious culture or serious society. In our culture, entertainers are paid outlandish sums of money. And sports is just entertainment. You pay for what you value, and apparently, we value sports more than education or helping the poor, etc. How many of the people who shelled out money in one way or another on football this year gave money to help New Orleans get back on its feet? If you want to know what a culture values, follow the money. That's all I'm saying.
Originally Posted By NikkiLOVESMickey <<But really, our obsession with sports just tells me we're not a very serious culture or serious society.>> Goodness knows we need to be more serious. We aren't serious enough with the recession, the earthquakes, and the war. Let's not allow people any escape from reality so they can all have heart attacks and commit suicide from the stress. Professional sports and the entertainment industry are a RELEASE. They allow people to forget about the pain and stress of everyday life and enjoy themselves. Professional athletes and entertainers are paid a lot of money because they bring in a lot of money. And, as far as professional sports goes, a portion of the money they bring in goes back into the community: the Saints and the Hornets (our NBA team) have programs that assist with education, literacy, and other important and charitable causes in our area. Sports teams also positively impact a city's economy: New Orleans hotels were SOLD OUT this past weekend, and the Super Bowl wasn't even HERE! The French Quarter was more packed on Sunday than it is on Mardi Gras day, bringing $$$ to our struggling economy and helping the mom and pop shops in the French Quarter stay afloat.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>Goodness knows we need to be more serious. We aren't serious enough with the recession, the earthquakes, and the war. Let's not allow people any escape from reality so they can all have heart attacks and commit suicide from the stress.<< Yowsah! Dramatic, much? First, no one said anything about taking away an escape, or leisure, or anything else. I understand the value of giving people a release and I understand the value of entertainment. I am chatting on a Disneyland message board, after all. It's a matter of degree, nothing more. It's great that these things do charities. Imagine how much more they could do if the athletes were paid $80,000 a year, tickets were $20 for a seat, and people put their money towards other causes instead of their favorite sports team. If an athlete that makes 20 million a year dropped his salary to 1 million a year (the horror!) we could pay 100 teachers an additional 19,000 a year. Maybe that way it would be easier on them to buy their own school supplies, since many of them do it anyway. Again, I'm all for having sports, movies, etc. I just wish we as a culture had better priorities so that more important endeavors were paid more, and these things were paid less.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip The people at the top of ANY profession are way overpaid, whether they are athletes, actors, CEO's, whatever. I'd be willing to bet there are far fewer overpaid athletes in this country than overpaid CEO's. At least the athletes give me some enjoyment. That is more than I can say for the CEO of United Health. Athletes get ripped on because they are being rewarded for a physical skill rather than a mental skill. That is more than a little prejudicial in my opinion.
Originally Posted By ecdc >>Athletes get ripped on because they are being rewarded for a physical skill rather than a mental skill. That is more than a little prejudicial in my opinion.<< No, athletes are paid that much because of the simple laws of supply and demand. If people didn't shell out thousands of dollars for tickets, hundreds a month for cable TV, money for jerseys, hats, balls, flags - you name it, they got it - then the athletes wouldn't get that much. Advertisers wouldn't be willing to pay as much, either. And it's not like CEO's haven't taken heat for their salaries the last year or two, either. Their earnings are outrageous, too. No one can "earn" 20 million a year. Look, I'm really not interested in belaboring the point. I just thought I'd make the observation, that's all. I'm sure I'm coming off as far more invested in the whole thing than I am. It's not going to change and I get that. I just don't think saying that we should spend more for education and social programs to help people and less on sports and entertainment is all that outlandish a claim. And it's not like these things are mutually exclusive. It just goes to show what we value, that's all.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip Yes, you are correct. It is all about supply and demand. That is why CEO's are paid so much. There are supposedly relatively few people who can successfully fill those positions. On the other hand, there are a relatively large number of people who are qualified to be teachers or social workers compared to the demand for those positions. Why is that? Because most of those positions are in the public sector and the demand is strictly limited by the budget available. Taxpayers go ape when they see someone on the government payroll making more than they do. Having been a public university employee for 30 years I know that is the case. Who is the highest paid employee at almost any major public university? Either the football or basketball coach. Why is that? Their salaries are paid primarily from the revenue their programs generate rather than from tax dollars. Is it fair? Heck no. But then life is never fair.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost >>>Also, I am one of the few people who thinks the Superbowl is one of the biggest wastes of time and energy on the planet, and find it a little sad people look forward to watching it for the commercials? A little scary.<<< Let me join the ranks of the "don't care if I'm cool" folks. I have never watched the super bowl, ever. As far as I can tell it's just a bunch of grown men knocking each other down. But to each his own...I have never watched "Lost" either. I'm kind of glad that the Saints won and I do agree that the nation was kind of cheering them on, but, (and no disrespect intended here) Katrina was 5 years ago. New Orleans has basically rebuilt, at least what was worth rebuilding, and the city is as alive as ever. Let's face it...if you live in a large bowl that fills with water every time there is a drizzle, a place where the water table is so high that you have to bury your dead above ground, a city that requires levies because it is below water level, then flooding isn't all that uncommon. Right now the earthquakes in Haiti trumps the heck out of Katrina, New Orleans or any other natural disaster in recent times. That said...party on New Orleans. Seriously, I know it feels good to be back on top.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost Sorry, I just re-visited my last post and it didn't exactly come across as I intended. I surely didn't mean to imply that New Orleans wasn't and isn't still devastated by Katrina. It certainly was, and my intent was not to belittle that. I love New Orleans but I don't think I can swim well enough to enjoy living there. My daughter graduated from Tulane so I have spent some time there and I find the place to be one of the most, if not the most, unique place on the face of the earth. Any school that would send a letter home to parents saying that if "your son or daughter is arrest during Mardi Gras, we will pay their bale and it will be included on the following months statement" can't be all bad. If I came across sounding a little heartless, I apologize...that wasn't my intent.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper I would say a majority of professional athletes are down to earth, appreciative of their fans, and are humble about their talent and compensation. The ones who are not those qualities are the ones we always hear about in the news. I've had the opportunit to work during many events here in South Florida and by and large the celebrities have been very cordial.
Originally Posted By NikkiLOVESMickey I have a much bigger problem with bankers on Wall Street getting million dollar bonuses when they received bailout money from the government.
Originally Posted By NikkiLOVESMickey <<I love New Orleans but I don't think I can swim well enough to enjoy living there.>> We've had one devastating flood in modern history. You make it sound like we pull out the pirogues and hip boots every time it sprinkles. Also, Katrina didn't flood the city, per se. The city flooded because the levees failed.
Originally Posted By SFH FWIW, there were a couple of news articles a few months back that went into details about how the average NFL career is something like 3 years and within a few years of leaving the NFL, something like 75% of the players are in financial trouble. We all hear about Favre, who has played forever and the highest paid starts, but there are MANY people on each team, some who get little time actually playing in a game. Football is hard on the body. And Lord help you if you suffer a few concussions. Anyway, since I hit puberty I wasn't much for spending three hours of my weekend watching professional sports. But now that I'm married, have kids, and have a career, have a mortgage, and have honey-dos,... a game can be a nice diversion (and usually a family-friendly one). Actually, my wife was more of a football watcher when we married because it gave her something to bond over with her brother. And so that dragged me back into it... and as far as the NFL, since LA/OC doesn't have a team, I can pick any time to route for. I appreciate the Superbowl, just like I appreciate the NBA Finals and the World Series, because we are watching THE best in the world do their thing. The world of athletics has existed for thousands of years and it isn't going to go away.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>FWIW, there were a couple of news articles a few months back that went into details about how the average NFL career is something like 3 years and within a few years of leaving the NFL, something like 75% of the players are in financial trouble.<<< This is my prob with sports. Waste of time, push parents wanting their kids to be pro rather than concentrating on a worth while set of endeavours; all the focus on something that really is not important at all; cheap good manufactured that end up as land fill; the carbon footprint impact of these events; with very little cultural or intellectual value for these meatheads pounding each other. Like I say, waste of a lot of energy and money.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***Waste of time, push parents wanting their kids to be pro rather than concentrating on a worth while set of endeavours; all the focus on something that really is not important at all; cheap good manufactured that end up as land fill; the carbon footprint impact of these events; with very little cultural or intellectual value for these meatheads pounding each other*** I think you go way too far, even if some of your underlying points are fair ones. First of all, athletics is a waste of time? From a purely physical fitness standpoint, they are worthwhile...and considering the deteriorating levels of health and fitness in the world today, I'd say we need more, not less. Now, parents encouraging (or expecting) kids to go pro? Different story. However, you can't argue with the fact that a reasonably talented athlete from a modest background probably stands a much better chance to further their education through athletic scholarships than an equivalent kid that doesn't pursue something along those lines (not ONLY athletics, obviously...I couldn't have funded my University days without my music scholarships for example). You go on to say "not worthwhile" and "not important", but those are extremely relativistic as you well know. Getting back to my fitness example (and throw in dedication, teamwork, self-esteem), I'd say it's far more worthwhile for kids to get involved in SOMETHING they enjoy, sports or whathaveyou, than for them to sit around all day watching T.V. and smoking crack...
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>However, you can't argue with the fact that a reasonably talented athlete from a modest background probably stands a much better chance to further their education through athletic scholarships than an equivalent kid that doesn't pursue something along those lines (not ONLY athletics, obviously...I couldn't have funded my University days without my music scholarships for example).<< And this is wrong too. It shouldn't have to be like that. This is what perpetuates the unhealthy focus on sports.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo An education should be available to all, especially those who have the potential to really achieve scholastically. I will admit, my disabilities and issues with participating in sport do skew my views. But I HATE the focus on sports people make. How to some, it is more important than family relationships, politics or theology. Then there is the whole jock thing in the schools. I hate how western society puts more focus on stupid neanderthal athletic abilities than intellectual prowess. What is more likely to further society? It is stupid. It is a waste of money, and I hate it. It has an impact on the economy and the environment. I really wish more people valued knowledge, learning and wisdom. These are the same issues that are leading to the dumbing down of Disney parks. For so many, ignorance is bliss.
