Originally Posted By Witches of Morva ORWEN: I'll also never forgive them for not building a Walt Disney World in Morva! I mean, really! Do you know how much it costs to fly a broom stick all the way to Florida every time I wanna' fill up on pixie dust? Brooms aren't as cheap as they used to be--even when you make them yourself like we do!
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>i.e. They dropped the ball, and basically publicly admitted that "No, we have no desire to do things this well." <<< I think they have the desire, there's just the 4 ton object of PROFIT crushing any attempt to invest.
Originally Posted By Boardwalkbum >>5) Tapestry of Nations/Epcot Parade. I miss having a parade/show at Epcot<< Thanks for that one! I always thought it a great appetizer for Illuminations. I'm pretty much in agreement with everything everyone has posted, though me and mine haven't had the same negative dining experiences as some of you. Also, for my part, I STRONGLY agree with the unforgivable nature of "walmartizing" Main Street as well as so much of their merchandise in general. AND...Closing the Adventurer's Club...I cant even type about it.... KUNGALOOSH!!!!!!!
Originally Posted By Lee hisownself Kungaloosh! Again I renew my call for everyone involved in the closing of Adventurers Club to be fired, and left homeless and begging for food out on 192.
Originally Posted By MagentaPanther 1. I'll never forgive WDW for not being built in Missouri, as Walt originally planned. If it had, I'd be able to visit it every weekend. And then find more things to gripe about. 2. Making the parks more gift-shop oriented than ride/attraction/experience oriented. Universal has just kicked Disney's ass in that department with the Wizarding World of Harry Potter. I'm not a Potter fan per se, but I love that attraction. It's simply magical and simpy brilliant. You walk in there, and you believe you've entered a magical world and left the real world behind. Walt Disney World used to feel that way. Now it feels like a bigger Six Flags. Feh. 3. Giving Tokyo DL a great, incredible, immersive Pooh ride and giving us Yanks a cheapass cardboard cutout crap ride. Nowhere else is the beancounting, cut-rate corporate mindset that's ruining Disney right now more obvious than in that ride. 4. Desecrating the parks with non-Disney character properties like Power Rangers, Star Wars and Muppets. A disgrace, when there are Disney movies and characters (like Mary Poppins) that don't even have a show or ride based on them. 5. The malfunctioning Yeti. Expedition Everest is a laughing stock. This is what comes of mistreating Imagineers so that they leave and lend their skills instead to competitors' attractions such as...The Wizarding World of Harry Potter. 6. Disregarding Walt's intent and spirit in regards to how the parks should look and operate. I hated Eisner. To my surprise, I hate Iger even more.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 Some others (that follow from my OP in the thread a few pages back): The purposeful conditioning of newbie guests (in this case I'm using Y2K as an arbitrary date) that current WDW quality is what Disney has always provided and is the best it has ever been or could ever be. The dumbing down of attraction to levels that only young children can enjoy. Hiring consultants that get paid six and seven figure contracts to help break WDW and 'fix it' in their image. Stale management that is afraid to be visionary or creative and owes their individual positions to either Jay Rasulo or his lead minions. Attractions that talk down to their audience or assume they are stupid. Closing EPCOT at 9 p.m. almost every day of the year. Allowing leads to walk around onstage in Old Navy/Gap clothing. Destroying much Disney magic in order to hype something called "DISNEY MAGIC". Overhyping and in your face pushing of DVC/timeshare sales across property. No monorail expansion in almost 30 years. Allowing River Country to rot in plain sight. Character dining taking over. Letting WDW grow so stale that topics like this have been played out over and over and over again on the 'net for a decade plus now.
Originally Posted By WDW Imagineer tapestry of nations tooning of tomorrowland the wand on top of SSE destruction of EPCOT
Originally Posted By vbdad55 ^Could be the problem isn't how much they spend, but rather how they spend. Oh so true - didn't Mission SPace cost about the same amount as WWoHP ? Which would you rather have ?
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost I like Mission Space and have absolutely no interest in Harry Potter, so I guess I'd vote for MS. The last time that the imagineers won out over the bean counters was MS, in my opinion. All we heard for months after were complaints and whining about MS being too mean and how much everyone missed Horizons and hated the people that made the decision to get rid of it. Does anyone wonder why they are no longer willing to spend that kind of money for something that all the "purists" are going to do nothing but complain about? All kind of predictable really.
Originally Posted By dshyates I like Mission Space also. Probably my second favorite ride at Epcot behind Soarin'. And I am always surprised when people refer to it as too extreme since I don't think it is extreme at all. I have to admit that I was a bit sad to see Horizons go, but I think it is a pretty good trade. I would have like to see a more fleshed out pavilion to go with the mission space attraction. That said I REALLY like the Harry Potter attraction. But what's not to like about a state of the art dark ride in a thickly themed environment. I don't think there would have been no complaints about Mission Space if Disney had taken to the level Universal took Potter. But because if Disney' s corporate structure it would have cost them a billion $$$$
Originally Posted By Witches of Morva ORWEN: Well, the thing that ticks me off the most is what they did to our dear, sweet Merlin!! Doing away with the Sword in the Stone ceremony the way they did--tossing out a poor old man who gave them the best years of his life! How cruel can they be? Now I hear he's become homeless and has to rub shoulders with drug addicts and 'ladies of the evening' by pushing a bloody shopping cart up and down the mean streets of Orange Blossom Trail in a crime ridden town like Orlando!!!
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Does anyone wonder why they are no longer willing to spend that kind of money for something that all the "purists" are going to do nothing but complain about? All kind of predictable really.<<< I disagree with this, sorry. They made a mistake in the first place with closing Horizons. It's just something that shouldn't have been done.... It's the equivalent of shuttering POTC for a new coaster. These rides were the heart of EPCOT. They are what made EPCOT Center so great. They were the rides that made EPCOT what EPCOT was- a inspiring, optimistic, dynamic place. Now, if they were to build a new attraction, on new land, that ADDED to the theme, and quality of the park, and the land it's in, I believe we would applaud it. The thing is, we've only see them do this once in the past 10 years- EE. And it was very well accepted. (the only problem, now, is that it's broken, and in deplorable condition..) I think the "purists" aren't as nutty as you expect us to be. ;-) We just expect quality.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper <<Does anyone wonder why they are no longer willing to spend that kind of money for something that all the "purists" are going to do nothing but complain about? All kind of predictable really.>> I'm a "purist"(whatever the hell that means), and I freaking love M:S. That being said, if you give me a choice between an uber themed, progressive dark ride(Forbidden Journey) and M:S, well, I'm taking FJ, no matter what the theme.
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost OK...I obviously got a reaction with the use of the work "purists". Perhaps that isn't the word I was looking for. What I really meant was that the bad press that MS got due to the unlucky deaths associated with it, coupled with the constant whining about the loss of Horizons must have been just the fodder that accounting needed to gain back control of the spending. No longer would they spend huge amounts of money on any unproven product. I liked Horizons to some degree myself. I loved the orange smell but I always thought that the over hyped ending was lame and confusing. Never did like it. Epcot had some positive changes, like Ellen and some things that would have made good additions (not replacements) like TT. Or the loss of Imagination only to be replaced by a show that could only be described as awful. When you think about it though, Imagination, SE, Horizon and WoM were actually the same ride with different animatronics. Horizons is the only one that used the excuse that the building was a problem, but no one was riding it anyway.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper <<What I really meant was that the bad press that MS got due to the unlucky deaths associated with it, coupled with the constant whining about the loss of Horizons must have been just the fodder that accounting needed to gain back control of the spending.>> Not really the case, from what I understand. The deaths were a problem, but the biggest thing M:S failed to do was boost Epcot's attendance like TT did. While it is a popular attraction, it dodn't bring more people into Epcot, which TT and then Soarin' did.
Originally Posted By Boardwalkbum I loved Horizons and WoM. They were attractions (especially Horizons)that I eagerly looked forward to every trip to WDW. I wish they were still there.... I have to say, however, that I was waiting to ride MS since the announcement and it didn't disappoint. Love it every time. Also worth mentioning,imho, Cranium Command was always fun and a pretty original format i was sorry to see go. I suppose i understand as I NEVER (especially towards the end) saw the attraction with more than a smattering of guests whenever i was there. Then again, its a wonder they didn't tear down the WoL pavilion. It does, after all, make a nice place to get a glass of Proseco during the F&W festival
Originally Posted By Goofyernmost >>>The deaths were a problem, but the biggest thing M:S failed to do was boost Epcot's attendance like TT did. While it is a popular attraction, it dodn't bring more people into Epcot, which TT and then Soarin' did.<<< Well, I'll bet that if a couple of folks would have bought the farm on TT or Soarin' they wouldn't have brought people in either. Without the deaths, I think MS had an excellent chance of being a powerful draw. It is an awesome ride and offers what very few others do.
