Originally Posted By cstephens pecos bill wrote: > I expect sporadic outbreaks of violence on his behalf If there is any violence that purports to be connected with this case, it won't be on his behalf. It's just an excuse. People were using that same argument for something as stupid as the Lakers winning the world championship. People who engage in that sort of behaviour are just looking for excuses. /cs
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder "This proves that Schwarzenegger's going to church yesterday was for show only. How can you be an active Catholic and do some of the things this...creature does?" Oh man, just give it a rest, will you?
Originally Posted By jnemo I think he/she is saying we should have a governor who rules the state by their religious beliefs.
Originally Posted By Elderp Well if your the Governor your under oath to uphold the laws and one of the laws of this state is the death penalty so what it sounds like people are saying is if your Catholic you shouldn't be the Governor.
Originally Posted By StillThePassHolder cmpaley would prefer Arnold not be governor and truth be told, not draw a breath. Once cm gets his claws in someone or something, he doesn't let up and has a tendency to be somewhat over the top, as in the "creature" comment.
Originally Posted By Elderp cmpaley has a right to his opinion. I still haven't seen anyone address my question yet. I know if I were Governor I would still be opposed to the death penatly but I would excute the death penalty because if I were Governor that would be the oath I took. Then again for me it would be easier because my church is not opposed to the death penalty. If it were however I would not even run for Governor because I know that would be part of the job.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer The governor doesn't have to rely on the law in making a decision about clemency. It can be an entirely personal decision based on his faith and beliefs. He's using the law as a shield so he doesn't have be responsible a politically unpopular decision or a decision that he favors but that alienates him from his church.
Originally Posted By Elderp Now the latest is there is a guy out there who said he commited the murders and he just now decided to come forward.
Originally Posted By Elderp ^ BTW this guy is part of a anti-death penalty group that does this at every execution.
Originally Posted By Elderp “Me fearing what I’m facing, what possible good is it going to do for me? How is that going to benefit me?†Williams said in a recent interview. “If it’s my time to be executed, what’s all the ranting and raving going to do?â€
Originally Posted By cmpaley >>I think he/she is saying we should have a governor who rules the state by their religious beliefs.<< That is not what I'm saying at all. What I am saying is that one's beliefs should INFORM their decisions. It's one thing to be guided by the principles of your faith and that is legitimate. It's another to impose your faith, i.e., require that people make the sign of the cross when entering a State building.
Originally Posted By cmpaley >>cmpaley would prefer Arnold not be governor and truth be told, not draw a breath. Once cm gets his claws in someone or something, he doesn't let up and has a tendency to be somewhat over the top, as in the "creature" comment.<< Not so. I don't care that Schwarzenegger draw breath. Let him. Just remove him from the Office of Governor of California or any position of authority and let him remain the B-movie actor he's known for being.
Originally Posted By Elderp "It's another to impose your faith, i.e., require that people make the sign of the cross when entering a State building." I am not sure I understand what you are saying.
Originally Posted By cmpaley >>The governor doesn't have to rely on the law in making a decision about clemency. It can be an entirely personal decision based on his faith and beliefs.<< The authority to grant clemency and pardon offenses are delegated to the Governor in the California Consitution. He doesn't have to give a reason for either decision, granting or denying, but it's usually done for political purposes. As a side note, the last California Governor to grant clemency was...dun dun dun...Ronald Reagan. >>He's using the law as a shield so he doesn't have be responsible a politically unpopular decision or a decision that he favors but that alienates him from his church.<< This is exactly true. Schwarzenegger said how much he "dreaded" making this decision and how he thought long and hard about it. Pish-tosh! I don't believe a word of it! He made up his mind well in advance and had one of his staffers (any one of which has more widsom, knowledge and education than he ever imagine hoping to possess) write up a document that sounds like he thought things through. I'm surprised he didn't offer to be there in person to throw the switch himself so he can bolster his macho, bad-boy image.
Originally Posted By Elderp "As a side note, the last California Governor to grant clemency was...dun dun dun...Ronald Reagan." I believe that was in 1967 and it was because Regan believed the guy was mentally incompetent.
Originally Posted By cmpaley >>"It's another to impose your faith, i.e., require that people make the sign of the cross when entering a State building." I am not sure I understand what you are saying.<< As a prospective Catholic, there are things I believe in that are not religious in nature per se. They are things that are more based on philosophy than religion. The functions of the State is one of them. Philosophically, the function of the State is to promote the common good. It does not serve the common good to execute someone in today's society where a criminal can be effectively removed from society. On the other hand, there are religious things, such as the sign-of-the-cross that have nothing to with the State, so it would be an imposition of one's religion to do require that of everyone entering a state building.
Originally Posted By barboy Schwarzenegger is not catholic. He may show up to church on Sundays and ritualistically eat the flesh and drink the blood but he is not catholic. True catholics follow the ordained directives of the Pope and the the Pope along with the church hierarchy has routinely denounced abortion and state-sanctioned killing. If I were a bishop I would make sure that he would be excommunicated very fast. One can't paint "pig" on a horse and think that the animal now is a swine.
Originally Posted By cmpaley Schwarzenegger joined the Church so he could marry Maria Shriver, a Catholic. I'm sure the whole thing was just for the marriage. Being a Catholic involved much more than just having some water poured on you (if you weren't already baptized), reciting some words (profession of Catholic faith) and having some oil put on your forehead (Confirmation). That profession of the Catholic faith means that you agree to EVERYTHING the Church teaches. That includes the philosophical basis on which the Church builds its teaching (as I explained before). Honestly, I don't believe that Schwarzenegger is capable of comprehending even the most basic and simplistic of philosophies.
