Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt I'm one of those "old" guys and I have to agree with Manfried on this one. I also agree with this comment from Westsider, "Little Mermaid should be the animatronic Omnimover musical spectacular that DCA has been missing since day one". The thing for me I want the parks to have a variety of experiences. EPCOT had one or two too many AA type 20 minute ride thrus when it opened and DCA didn't have enough.
Originally Posted By danyoung >Do us a favor, if you don't like it, quit going to the parks so that the rest of us can enjoy it.< I don't know that anyone has said that they didn't like TSMM. I like the ride, and I like the changes, and I like the fact that the ride is structured to where changes are relatively easy to make. But I look at it as a C level change to a C attraction, and not the greatest thing ever to come out of Imagineering. >An armchair imagineer? I hate "idea" topics.< I completely agree - a total waste of mental activity that has no worthwhile outcome. But some people enjoy them, and more power to 'em.
Originally Posted By plpeters70 >Do us a favor, if you don't like it, quit going to the parks so that the rest of us can enjoy it.< Why must everything be so black and white - isn't it possible to enjoy something, yet still see that it could use some improvement? Sure, TSMM is fun, but in my opinion, it doesn't quite match up to some of WDI's best efforts from the past. If DCA had already been a park with other high-quality attractions, then I wouldn't be so harsh on TSMM. But, this isn't meant to be a "filler" attraction, but an E-ticket - and I just don't think it quite lives up to that standard. I'm sure others disagree, but that's my opinion.
Originally Posted By mousermerf TSMM wasn't "it" for a while in DCA and DHS no one would have minded. That it got a major budget and it's going to be years until something else opens when the parks have both been lacking animatronic shows - well, at that point I can't really support a glorified video game. Mermaid should have been built first at DCA. DHS? Lesser evil as the park at least has some elaborately themed attractions, but it still needs more depth. I think in 5 years TSMM is going to look very outdated, and in 10 it's going to be a joke. It's one thing to have a screen used to enhance a scene by showing photographic imagery of film or stills - it's an entirely different can of worms when it's computer generated and the technology keeps going up by leaps and bounds each year. Mission: SPACE is already criticized for looking pixelated and "old."
Originally Posted By danyoung To be fair, the Mission: Space video looked like cheap 3D when it debuted. There was already much better photo-realistic 3D animation being done, and there was no reason why this animation couldn't have been done better, other than budget.
Originally Posted By plpeters70 <<To be fair, the Mission: Space video looked like cheap 3D when it debuted.>> AMEN to that!! I remember thinking that the first time I rode as well. I know Disney spent millions on this attraction, but really, the final product just didn't look all that polished, and came off looking a little cheap. Don't ask me how that happens when you spend that kind of money on something, but that doesn't seem to be that unusual for WDI these days. I couldn't believe how little we got in the Imagination "update" for the supposed millions they were spending to "fix" it. A couple old Figment animatronics and a new soundtrack - money clearly doesn't go as far as it used too!
Originally Posted By mousermerf Being insistent on doing thing in-house when you're not the master of a trade will lead to lower quality product. Refusal to go outside WDI or its cheap interns from Carnergie and UCLA is why projects like M:S lack the polish of professional computer graphics.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "I think in 5 years TSMM is going to look very outdated, and in 10 it's going to be a joke." Maybe, but what about some of the park's classics like the Jungle and Mr. Toad? Even the Matterhorn has been outdone by ToT and Space Mountain and still remains popular These older dated attractions are far from cutting edge and yet they are staples at DL. "Hans i didnt know 29 was old?" What do you mean Tasha?
Originally Posted By plpeters70 <<Maybe, but what about some of the park's classics like the Jungle and Mr. Toad? Even the Matterhorn has been outdone>> Three attractions that could have used updates years ago. I've never understood why Disney doesn't update these older attractions more often with some of the newer technology.
Originally Posted By Manfried plpeters70, and you say things aren't black and white? The only way a business changes things is when there is no business. The Disney parks seem to be doing quite well. Rides that need to be updated or replaced are those without lines. About the only one without a line at Disneyland is Pinocchio. In Florida, it's the Energy Pavilion at EPCOT for example.
Originally Posted By tashajilek Well Hans, you said you were "old" and i dont think you are old only being 29 and all lol.
Originally Posted By plpeters70 <<Rides that need to be updated or replaced are those without lines.>> You're right, and as long as people continue to happily ride them, then I guess that Disney has not real incentive to change anything. It's only the "fan" in me that dreams that they can just keep updating things all the time. With that said, there is some incentive for Disney to not let the parks get too "tired". If the audience gets the general feel that things haven't changed much in 20 years, they might not be so quick to come rushing back. It's the constant change that makes people go "heh, I've got to go back and see that". They can, of course, do this by adding all new attractions. But, a cheaper option could be to make updates to older attractions, and make them like-new again. That wouldn't work all the time, and does nothing to add capacity to the park, but could be a way to get by in-between all new E-tickets. Of course, in Anaheim, they have that ever-present mob of AP holders who will probably come even if nothing is touched for the next 10 years, so maybe that business model doesn't apply to DL. Would probably work better at WDW.
Originally Posted By mousermerf <<<In Florida, it's the Energy Pavilion at EPCOT for example.>>> And that's a lie - it doesn't have a constant wait, no, but it loads into a preshow. And based on its actual ridership - it is leaps and bounds ahead of Imagination which you constantly defend and try to pretend like it's not an abysmal failure.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "Well Hans, you said you were "old" and i dont think you are old only being 29 and all lol." But I'm 46. Don't believe everything you read on these boards.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "You're right, and as long as people continue to happily ride them, then I guess that Disney has not real incentive to change anything." Exactly. How many times do fans of the Country Bears pop up on these boards wishing it would come back? Most of DL's most popular attractions have only had modest updates in the years that they've been operating and still draw crowds. Why would a fun character driven attraction like TSMM be any different a decade from now? "It's only the "fan" in me that dreams that they can just keep updating things all the time." Agreed.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 Sometimes they do add little unheralded "plusses" that keep things more interesting - the projections added to Alice a few years ago, or the stuff they're adding to the ROA this year. It's always nice to see; I imagine there are few among us who wouldn't like to see more of it, more often.
Originally Posted By plpeters70 <<Most of DL's most popular attractions have only had modest updates in the years that they've been operating and still draw crowds.>> What would really be interesting would be to see just how many people would still be riding if you still had to pay for each attraction individually. Obviously, we can never really know, but does anyone think that the park would have stayed so static over the years if we had been forced to buy a ticket to ride Peter Pan? Or Pirates? I think Disney would have been forced to make a lot more changes to the attractions to justify the prices they were charging in that scenario.
