Originally Posted By vbdad55 <. Disney is very popular with all types of people - singles, couples, families, Disney no longer is just about "famies together".< okay -- Cali Grill is now couples only. Have to have a family of 4 to dine at Prime Time Cafe -- only single Diners at Brown Derby.... the issue here is kids cannot complain - any of the above scenarios would cause a ruckus..... once you start excluding, where is it OK to go ? And who gets to decide - because no matter what the restriction, you will find a group of people who would like the restrictions
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> If it keeps others out totally - yes. Do you agree with the fact women can't play golf at Augusta ? Doesn't matter what they shoot, doesn't matter how much money they have -- because some people view them as a problem there. << When I was a teenager, there were things that I was not allowed to do because I was a girl. I couldn't join the AV club at school (that was middle school, I believe). I wasn't allowed to work the grill at McDonalds. Teams I couldn't be on. I wasn't allowed to try baseball, I had to play softball (that really irritated me). I was (in some ways), a bit of a tomboy, so I wouldn't be happy as far as the golf thing you just mentioned. But - if I was told that I couldn't go with my parents to a restaurant, I'd be like "fine". I was going to the parks myself at age 11 or so, I didn't need to be around them all the time. There are always going to be things that kids can't do. And vice versa.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> and until someone complains enough to the mgmt types about this - all they see are the profits - I do have a problem with that also. I also would have been fine w/o a PI - << I don't like it, and I don't think that it should be on Disney property. But Disney has let non-Disney companies come in, I don't know if Disney can say or do anything. That has been Disneys choice to expand the way they have. As I mentioned - I think a good compromise would be a 9pm timeframe. But I am also not against a restaurant or two (out of the 150 or so on property) being adult only.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 It's not about being around them all the time, it's about being told you can't do something, for a reason that may be invalid.... based on what you were not allowed to do before, can't believe you're okay with this decision.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> based on what you were not allowed to do before, can't believe you're okay with this decision. << The examples I gave were of things I couldn't do with kids my own age - because I was female and they were guys. I don't consider adults and children equal in that sense. Just like I wouldn't say that a 5 year old and a 16 year old would do the same things, or have the same privileges. At Disney, there are tours that a 5 year old can't take, that a 16 year old can. I don't have a problem excluding kids in some instances due to age.
Originally Posted By sherrytodd Is this a stedfast rule as in, they will not allow a child to dine there or is it a more of a recomendation that you not bring your younger children and won't be offering a children's menu but would not throw you out of the restaurant if you showed up with your child?
Originally Posted By Brian Noble As a parent of a 7 year old and a 9 year old.... ...I have NO PROBLEM with this, whatsoever. I've told them both---when they graduate from college, I'll book Chef's Table for them. Until then, NO SOUP.
Originally Posted By dshyates It doesn't matter to me if V&A goes childless. But I think it is unnecessary. I really like the idea of an early seating with kids 4 and up. I wouldn't hesitate for a moment to take my kids to dinner there, as I KNOW they will behave like princessess. We only had a problem with the older one once when she was about 3 and never again. I find kids behave exactly like YOU expect them to behave. In other words kids only do what they know they can get away with. And MY kids know that at WDW they have a lot to lose if they were to misbehave. Think spending the next day enjoying a "Hall of Presidents" marathon. No seriously, I think the policy should be kids early seating, Adults only late seating and no infants or toddler as a screaming infant isn't misbehaving, just loud and distracting.
Originally Posted By danyoung >Any time you start excluding people, for a reason that just doesn't hold water to me, I'm sorry but my radar goes up.< But again, you don't know the situation - none of us do unless we work there day in and day out. It could be a situation where a child ruins the event 3 or 4 times a week, and management has finally had enough. I'm sure a lot of thought went into the selection of the age of 10 - why not 8? Why not 12? I'd guess it's their experience that tells them that 10 and younger is the problem demographic. I'd have a big problem if this kind of policy were implemented at the Coral Reef or Le Cellier. But V&A's is such an upscale restaurant, so blatantly ADULT, that banning kids below a certain age just makes total sense to me. I might feel differently if I had kids as well behaved as vbdad's, but sadly kids like that are the exception, not the rule.
Originally Posted By dshyates I should say that I always found it odd that Disney went 5 star with a theme restaurant while letting California Grill idle along at 4. See, V&As is the type of place that my daughter would love to eat at. For my oldests 5th Birthday we dressed her up and we had tea with Mary Poppins and at 11 she still thinks it was the best part of the Disneland vacation. It was so cute. She trid so hard to act like a "Lady". And spoke quietly and respectfully to Ms. Poppins. I think it is important to have places like these, particularly at Disney where kids are expected, where you can take you kids and teach theme how its done. Explain that being loud is as out of place as running through the room naked screaming and waving your arms. I really do believe that your kids will behave like you expect them to behave. I am confident they would be fine at V&As. I've taken them to many 4-5 star restaurants. They know the difference between Chuck E. Cheeses and The Greenbrier. Oh, and my kids DON'T "throw a fit". Haven't in years. At least not with me. My oldest tells me that when they are with my Ex, the youngests one who is 7, thows fits and thier mother gives in. I asked her why she does it with her mother and not with me. She said that if she did it with me I would pop her on the forhead and she would get in trouble. I assume with her mother she has some how learned that is a path to getting what she wants. With me, I will throw away or break the issue item and them punish her. Not only does she lose forever what she wanted, but then has to suffer what ever insane task I can think up. Last summer I had her edge the entire yard with those scissor like grass shears we had to use in the 70s. My 11 year old started texting a bit much, and I went and dragged out my first cell phone. You know the ones that were a big as a shoebox with a 4 ft antenna? The rule, one more bill over $50 and this would be her new cell phone. She could tell her friends its so retro that it doesn't NEED texting. Isn't it sooooo Cooool? She didn't think her friends would by it. By the way, I learned all my parenting skills from the movie, ""Uncle Buck".
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo "I think it is important to have places like these, particularly at Disney where kids are expected, where you can take you kids and teach theme how its done. " Absolutely - mine have dined at the California Grill at DLP which is like a cross between V&A's and Ca Grill at WDW. It is a good training ground. Becuase people tend to be more tolerant of kids at Disney, we can take them in and have a nice meal (where we would not be allowed in in London or San Francisco let's say), and the kids are then prepared for how to behave in nice places. If they misbehave in nice restaurants, then we take them out. My kids hate burgers and chicken strippers - but they love filet mignon and lobster. Personally, as someone who honeymooned at WDW, I think an age cut off would be perfect (same at Napa Rose) open at 5 or 6 for all, and then no under (insert age) after 8pm. That sounds wonderful for all then.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> I'd have a big problem if this kind of policy were implemented at the Coral Reef or Le Cellier. << I consider both family restaurants - not fancy at all, so I'm sure that would never happen. Even the best kids can act up. I mentioned my niece and nephew - SUCH good kids, travelled the world, etc. My stepbrother was in the military, and expects them to eat properly at the table. They absolutely do better than most kids. But they are both still kids, and I could see them getting very antsy into the meal. If one was more of a family setting, maybe that would be easier - having other kids/families around. 1st, not 2nd seating. I haven't eaten at the California Grill in maybe - wow, 10 years (I'm local - why pay a lot for food when I can cook?). But I do think that a "curfew" on that for kids would be appropriate. Not sure on Narcoosees or Yachtsman, Artist Point, etc. I don't put them on the same level as the CA Grill or V&A.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> My kids hate burgers and chicken strippers - but they love filet mignon and lobster. << Wow - you've already trained them to have expensive tastes! It is nice to see kids who like a variety of foods. Part of my family was from India, and the kids (my nephews/nieces) start with Thai, Indian, Moroccan, any sort of food - at a very early age. My immediate family didn't - it was burgers, roast and chicken primarily. We never even ordered out a pizza until I was in middle school. I don't know if I would do well at V&A - since there are some animals I didn't grow up eating, and I don't really consider them food. (like duck).
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo "but restricting them altogether at WDW I think is just wrong... this is the family vacation center, not a night at the Ritz " Well my kids have eaten at the Ritz, and the Waldorf, with no problems. It's how you train them. I was the same, I use to be allowed into restaurants in San Francisco, Tahoe and Vegas that were considered fine dining. My family taught me how to behave - what was acceptable behaviour. My kids love nice meals (ok, in Europe a 2 or 3 hour meal out is not uncommon), they like museums, (and as a child I loved the ballet and theatre) and my 4 year old loves his suit and tie, and he would rather be in a button up shirt than a tee shirt. Not all kids are animals.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo "There are hundreds of places in WDW and around Orlando for families to eat french fries and chicken McNuggets. Why is it assumed kids must be included in EVERY bloody thing?" Maybe because some of our kids don't want that rubbish and actually want to eat something decent.
Originally Posted By nbodyhome >> My kids love nice meals (ok, in Europe a 2 or 3 hour meal out is not uncommon) << Maybe that helps kids from overseas with patience. I would bet most meals in the US are fast food, or even if home cooked - done in 15 minutes or so. If I'm in Europe, I can't do a 3 hour meal. I have a favorite little Italian restaurant in Paris - I ate there 5 times this past trip (a good size single cheese pizza or spagetti was only 7 Euros), and I'm out within the hour. No extra charge for ouside seating, either (it's not in central Paris).
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo "done in 15 minutes or so" Couldn't see that with my brood - dinner is ofter 30 - 60 mins, even at McDs for us. We hate most of the counter services at WDW (Epcot and DAK excluded of course)
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Now the thing is, if they hadn't dumbed down the rest of the restaurants, then I wouldn't mind so much. But the reality was, we had to really negotiate to get the kids smaller portions of the adult menus when we were at WDW. Even World Showcase was shocking with how rank the kids choices were. Not all families give their kids rubbish. On our trip to Spain, mine really tucked in to the fruit and nuts (more than candy), paella, squid and yes, they drank watered down wine. Is WDW a microcosm for the rest of modern America?
Originally Posted By wahooskipper Yes, America eats crap. I tried getting my kid a healthy drink (milk, apple juice) at a hockey game a couple of weeks ago. (He is 5.) The guy at the counter was stunned that my son didn't drink coca-cola.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I am also annoyed that if I want fries or a coke as a side for a kids meal, we should be able to do that too.
