Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<I had never conciously connected the decline to Disney's Magical Express>> I haven't used Magical Express my last couple of visits. It got to where all the waiting in line just wasn't worth it. Especially as cheap as rental cars have become since ME is taking away so many previous renters. They almost give them away. The money we spent on the rental was easily saved by going off-site to eat and buy wine at half the price you pay in WDW. After a very poor experience during our last dinner at the San Angel Inn we decided to try Chevy's Fresh Mex at the Crossroads Center. I know it's just a chain, but the food was better than at the San Angel at a fraction of the expense.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 WDW became too big, too fast and too pricey for the 'average' guest to think about spending days taking advantage of the amazing recreational opportunities. >>And the 400-pounders riding in their ECVs, munching on turkey legs, wearing Goofy hats or tiaras with pin lanyards on defintely aren't interested in those aspects and neither are the mindless MAGICal fanbois who just go to WDW 'to ride the rides' ... they're also the ones who ignore World Showcase and DAK too.<< <<They are the people for which its "all about the parks" Park Open to Park Close- If you spent more than 10% of vacation time not in the parks you are not a fan group... >> I think those people (unless its like a first, second or third visit and they have lots to see) are ... well, nuts. I could say 'different strokes yada, yada, yada' but why be disingenuous? I do think folks who spend all their time in the parks where they obsessively experience the same things ad nauseum are nuts. If that makes me an evil Spirit, then so be it. <<Or its people like me- Who despite living here for 5 years (!) Has never done most of the listed things. Only been once to mini golf, once to a water park etc...>> You sound like ALL my friends in O-Town. They all are bored soundly by the parks most of the time now, but stay away from the water parks, never would think ot spending a glorious spring day boating on Bay Lake, have no idea how relaxing it is to take the boat from DD to PO for a meal or drinks, go biking at FW and visit the horsies, walk around the lake and hit every EPCOT resort, stopping for a meal at one and drinks or desserts at another etc. These things that can make WDW feel like paradise simply shouldn't be ignored by locals in favor of riding Space Mountain (which left me in pain after my last ride Monday) for the 763rd time. >>I heard about said lunch. The three of us REALLY need to do one of those whenever I next descend on O-Town.<< <<I agree though this split "custody" thing is fun too >> Custody? Does that mean I'm responsible for you? I barely can be responsible for me! >> Free drinks are always good. (Thinking of starting a new Have Spirits With the Spirit program)<< <<Not sure I've ever done that Count me in...>> You had a chance at that somewhat depressing bar at the Beach Club last week. But we'll drink whenever I haunt O-Town again ...
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 >> How many folks will stay at say the BW or PO or WL and NEVER even use the pools? << <<I've never been in a pool at WDW, and I never will. I had a pool in my back yard. I filled it in after huricane Ike. I don't go to WDW to swim. Different people have diffrent ways of spending their vacation time. and relaxation time.>> I thought you didn't swim at WDW because VBDAD looked better than you in an Ariel two-piece and you got your feathers all ruffled ...
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<Horizons was NOT falling apart. There was no sinkhole. It was an excuse to try and placate the fans back in the day. I know this for sure. And if I didn't Martin has said so himself many, many times. And if Martin says it, it's good enough for me.>> Martin says it because it is true. The whole sinkhole myth is just urban/fanboi/CM legend much like Cindy's removeable 'cane turrets or spots on Swan and Dolphin marking where rooms would MAGICally be removed for monorails or ... no more.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<go biking at FW and visit the horsies>> Fort Wilderness is a GREAT place to just relax and enjoy your vacation away from the parks. I like renting a golf cart and buzzing around FW just enjoying the beauty of the place and gawking at the million dollar Prevosts. The trail between FW and the Wilderness Lodge is a very enjoyable walk. I tried the Swamp Trail once but sadly it had not been maintained at all... it was far more overgrown swamp than it was trail. I also enjoy just sitting in a rocker on the front porch of Crockett's Tavern, relaxing and enjoying the pleasant January weather in Orlando. It may seem silly, but my memories of doing that are GREAT Disney memories. I guess that is why WDW still really works for me. There are so many wonderful things you can do if you drag your butt out of the parks.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 >> Let's talk about that and not how WDW has 43 square miles of timeshares, hotels, buses and paved, traffic clogged roadways. Disney wins that battle and the pixie dust crown and the pandering to mentally unstable people who are looking for something that doesn't exist crown too! << <<Come on Spirit. WDW is much more than that. Even with it's flaws it's still a great place for newbies, and old fans alike.>> Largely (you know, like a typical guest) I agree. <<Does it have issues, certainly. I have to believe that the DVC club is making money, and there is still a huge demand for it. You can't fault Disney for striking while the iron is hot.I also believe that a lot of DVC owners have the same issues as non-owners with the worry that WDW will be overbuilt. I don't think it has, but I do have concerns with to much building around the Seven Seas Lagoon as well as the DVC resorts not having their own restaurants.>> I think WDW was overbuilt back in the 20th century. <<Yes I do understand the problems involved with having to fill all those rooms. I also think that TWDC is well aware of those problems also.It doesn't seem to be deterring them though. I'm of the opinion if we couldn't get a room on property, we all would be complaining about the lack of accomadations at WDW.>> I wouldn't. Not anymore. I rarely stay on property and even more rarely at a WDW owned and operated resort. Love the DD Hilton, though! <<Do you really think that just because people don't view Disney the same way as you do, they should be classified as mentally unstable?>> Quite possibly. But I'll review on a case by case basis. Or maybe I'll just let you handle it since I have too much on my plate. But my point, dear old minion, is that I really see Disney pandering and positioning its product toward folks who have mental issues (I just love how this is gonna sound on a discussion board). I guess a better way to say it may be Disney is exploiting a very frayed segment of our society who feel the need to retreat to a childhood that never was and never will be. ;-) All of this is at the expense of the brand ... <<I'm going to go look at my towel animal collection, chill out for a while, watch all of my WDW VHS tapes, and DVDs, and then go take Winkie for a walk.>> Have you housebroken him yet?
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub Sometimes it is good to be so busy that catching up on 166 posts is a great bedtime story. I wonder who will portray Spirit and Pierce and Davewasbaloo in the movie version? Of course EM gets to be the major star!
Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub Let's Put the Walt Back in Disney Chapter one: Once upon a time...
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Lol. Dan Ackroyd in his younger days would have been suitable. Perhaps they could do a Jeff Bridges like in TRON Legacy. Lol.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <<But since no one (except a few of us who realize sitting at the Territory Lounge for a few rounds>> --------- I think as a lot of it's core guests age-- ( the Boomers like me) - these other things are used more andmore often. I do much more of that now than say even 10-15 years ago-- at least one round of golf now - we usually hit 1 miniature golf - spend more time at pool- and renting boats..friends i know did catch-release fishing last trip etc... For first time visitors though- I am sure it is all about how many rides they can get in
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>I did an Internet search last night on Horizons falling apart. I know it's the Internet and anyone can say anything, but I found many references to Horizons being over a sinkhole and that was creating structural damage. That the only way to rectify the problem was to remove the structure and take care of it before rebuilding. True or not? I obviously have no way of knowing for sure.<<<< It's all false. The building was fine, GE pulled as it's sponsor, the money dried up, and Compaq (not HP... that's later) wants a Space Pavilion. Horizons could have been used for the Space Pav, but Compaq just spends the money to tear down the old building. Eisner is happy with this, and M:S is born. If Horizons really had a sinkhole... Why did it close in 1994, reopen in 1996, 97, and 99?
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>What we do know: the water area between Innoventions and the Odyssey Restaurant is a sink hole. That's why the restaurant was built where it is and not it's planned location at the end of the Communicore building.<<< Exactly right. If you want a Sinkhole, look no further than the lake by the Odyssey. Also, look under UoE.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>These things that can make WDW feel like paradise simply shouldn't be ignored by locals in favor of riding Space Mountain (which left me in pain after my last ride Monday) for the 763rd time.<<<< It always leaves me in pain. Hate Space Mountain...
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper I love Space Mountain. Although I shouldn't seeing as it seems like it wants to stop me from reproducing.
Originally Posted By MPierce >> I thought you didn't swim at WDW because VBDAD looked better than you in an Ariel two-piece and you got your feathers all ruffled ... << Well that did have a lot to do with it. That VBDAD sure is buff.
Originally Posted By MPierce >> But my point, dear old minion, is that I really see Disney pandering and positioning its product toward folks who have mental issues (I just love how this is gonna sound on a discussion board). I guess a better way to say it may be Disney is exploiting a very frayed segment of our society who feel the need to retreat to a childhood that never was and never will be. ;-) << If someone doesn't want a week of escapism these days they do have mental issues. I see nothing wrong in trying to escape back to the fond memories of your childhood with Disney. Even if they don't exist quite the way you remember them. With the number of guest Disney is bringing in, I would suggest that a lot of folks feel that way also.
Originally Posted By MPierce >> Sometimes it is good to be so busy that catching up on 166 posts is a great bedtime story. I wonder who will portray Spirit and Pierce and Davewasbaloo in the movie version? Of course EM gets to be the major star! << I think Charlie Sheen would play a perfect Spirit.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>I think Charlie Sheen would play a perfect Spirit.<<<< I think Spirit will take that as a insult... LOL
