Originally Posted By leobloom >> I have a very low opinion of most young people today. What's worse is talk to anyone under 30 today and its like they know it all ... nothing like arguing about Disney history with fanbois who were kids when Beauty and the Beast came out (if they were even alive!) << To be fair, I doubt there are many under-30 fanboys who would debate Disney with you who are also well-adjusted, mature adults. In other words, I wouldn't want to take a 21 year-old fanboy and assume he (because we know it'd be a he) is the "average" for his age group.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> ^^I'd agree that kids today don't know how to rebel. If they did, I'm fairly certain we wouldn't be the mess of a society we now are. << And I'd argue the kids of the 60s didn't know how to rebel, either. What did their rebellion accomplish? The Summer of Love? Eventually the end of Vietnam? A bunch of hippies who grew up, sold out, and became part of the establishment? You're naive if you think that sort of thing has any traction in the long term. Speaking of politics, anyone see where Disney is going to trademark "SEAL Team Six." If you haven't heard, you should google the story. It'll make you feel all warm and cuddly toward the corporation.
Originally Posted By Christi22222 This thread has taken a weird turn, and I'm not sure it's productive to continue. However, I'd sure be curious how our younger set like EE, Hokie, and whoever else I don't know their age feels about what we're saying. I know lots of great younger folks. And I know lots of entitled spoiled narcissistic folks of that age. And I am not old enough to be able to gauge how much I think is a cyclical repeating pattern. It is interesting. And there have been periods in our recent past that I'd say are similar to now where spoiled celebrity reigns and intellectualism is disrespected. So who knows.
Originally Posted By SpokkerJones All other things being equal, a 50 year old is likely to be more wise than a twenty-something year old. No doubt that young people are very cynical and narcissistic today. But I have a feeling that young people who lived decades ago were just as narcissistic and cynical (their elders just as aghast at their behavior as you are today), but they weren't on Twitter or Facebook talking about how narcissistic and cynical they were. Past generations have the benefit of looking at the past through rose-colored glasses, their whiny 20-something thoughts unrecorded in a vast database of indexed shame. "This thread has taken a weird turn, and I'm not sure it's productive to continue." Nothing discussed on an Internet forum can be described as productive because nothing but hot air is produced.
Originally Posted By sjhym333 Having been in mgmt for many years, my opinion is that young folks today are more self centered than ever before. It really is a cultural thing. I am not sure if it is because of the technology like computers, iPods, video games or the fact that so many were latch key kids who are home alone for hours a day. At work they show up for interviews in shorts and t-shirts, they expect that you will give them everything they ask for did and they have no sense of the larger picture. We often have to teach them what good customer service looks like and because of the "me" factor they have no graciousness to other people. At work they take off or call in sick without regard to how it affects the business of their fellow workers, they seem to bring more drama to the workplace. They look at you like your crazy when you ask them to do something within their job description. They have selective hearing concerning corporate culture and they dont seem to care most of the time. They are also tuning out most of the time because of the iPods attached to their ear 24/7. There are still some great young people out there. When I have them working for me I do everything I can to keep them happy and working with us. They are an asset to the company and they are a credit to themselves and to their parents.
Originally Posted By SpokkerJones "They have selective hearing concerning corporate culture and they dont seem to care most of the time." Not necessarily disagreeing with the other things you said, but this point rings hollow. Corporate culture is often so dehumanizing that I'm not surprised to hear of a backlash against it in isolated cases. Being proud of the company you work for is not a given. A good strategy would be to make the company something to be proud of, rather than forcing every employee to be proud of it. It would also help to hire those who are already passionate about what the company does, but I fear most companies would rather do without those with passion for fear they may speak up someday.
Originally Posted By SpokkerJones Scott Adams is a leading authority on the negative aspects of corporate culture.
Originally Posted By sjhym333 What I meant about corporate culture is things like hair length, piercings, makeup, deadlines for requests, appropriate clothing, etc. I dont expect everyone to be proud of a company and many times there is nothing to be proud of but the norms of the work environment that are explained at length from the beginning seem to be a challenge for many of them. At Disney for instance, hair length is explained at length and it's a non-negotiable but its a constant battle. For men there is a rule about facial hair but you would be amazed after sitting thru Traditions for 8 hours how many guys show up without shaving and then they look at you like your crazy when you tell them you cant work them unless they go buy a razor and shave right now.
Originally Posted By SpokkerJones But what I am saying is that when you have a guy who refuses to shave after being told to shave for eight hours, perhaps your company is not attracting the right people. In the case of Disney, the the problem is that what was once a decent full-time job to have, one that could at least put food on the table, is now a part-time dead end job for college students and those who are desperate for extra money. And you aren't even attracting the best college students. Turnover rates have improved in the past couple of years, but that has been due mostly to the recession. Before the recession hits turnover rates in some departments were nearing 100%. In the past you were more likely to find someone whose career history at the park could be measured in years rather than months. Working at Disneyland today is only marginally better than working a McJob. They get who they deserve.
Originally Posted By sjhym333 The company I currently work for pays substantionally better than Disney and offers great benefits and is always rated one of the best places to work in the US and we have the same problems.
Originally Posted By MPierce >> Oh ... go (expletive deleted) yourself with a pixe dust pipe! ;-) << Will that make me fly like Tink?
Originally Posted By MPierce >> Note the date and time. I agree with Pierce on something! << Does this mean I get an offical WDW Potty Pin with matching Lanyard?
Originally Posted By MPierce >> ^^What's the saying about a broken clock being right twice a day? ;-) << At least that's better than a broke clock with it's hands removed.
Originally Posted By MPierce >> This thread has taken a weird turn, and I'm not sure it's productive to continue. << I think it should at least continue until it degenerates into a name calling contest or Spirit blames the problem on fat people.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> Does this mean I get an offical WDW Potty Pin with matching Lanyard? << It's a limited edition of 1000, too. You can sell it on ebay, if you need gas money.
Originally Posted By MPierce >> It's a limited edition of 1000, too. You can sell it on ebay, if you need gas money. << If I could get a certificate of authenticity with your signature, I would put it in one of my safety deposit boxes, and pass it along as a cherished Heirloom.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper I haven't read through the whole thread, but there are definitely two breeds of Imagineer, and grouping them all into the snobbish variety isn't the truth. While working at Spaceship Earth when it was coing back up in early 2008, one of the WDI guys took his time to talk to me a t great lengths about the division, and has even helped to try and get me a job a few times. Then again, there were also the ones who thought they were royalty. I remember one time I asked one of them outside how long they had been with WDI, and you would have thought I had just exposed his superhero alter ego or something. He flipped out and said I shouldn't have called him an Imagineer in public, as if the masses were going to mob him for autographs.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 >> I have a very low opinion of most young people today. What's worse is talk to anyone under 30 today and its like they know it all ... nothing like arguing about Disney history with fanbois who were kids when Beauty and the Beast came out (if they were even alive!) << <<To be fair, I doubt there are many under-30 fanboys who would debate Disney with you who are also well-adjusted, mature adults. In other words, I wouldn't want to take a 21 year-old fanboy and assume he (because we know it'd be a he) is the "average" for his age group.>> I don't believe most WDW fans, or Disney fans in general, are well-adjusted mature adults ... I think I stated as much in another thread (or two!) The more fans I see or come across in the parks , or discover online, the more of a disconnect I have from what might once have been called the fan community. There's a big difference from being a fan (or fanatic) and being mentally unbalanced and taking a love for a company's content to a level of unhealthy obsession. I could write a book on the difference in the average WDW guest of 1981 or 1991 and of today. People didn't 'live' in the parks in '81 or '91. They didn't tweet endlessly about whether Tiki Room's return is a good thing (it isn't in any real sense) or whether Star Tours decade-late rehab is quality (as I expected and wrote about 3-4 years ago, it seems to be). They didn't scheme online about how to avoid paying for parking. There wasn't a cottage industry of people whoring off of Disney instead of getting real meaningful skilled jobs ... or just flipping burgers at McD's! People expected the best from Disney and usually got it. When they didn't, Disney made sure to try and fix what was wrong. People didn't feel they were being nickel and dimed to such an extent that they turned around and regularly committed acts that one might find criminal to justify the cost of a trip. When CMs told you to have a MAGICal day or night, you could be reasonably sure they only meant it in one way as CMs took pride in their jobs, no matter the level. And, yes, it just mirrors our crumbling society in many ways. But LP.com is supposed to be about Disney, so I tend to focus of the microcosm here. I really don't want to come off like it's all the under-30 crowd, because it isn't that either. They just tend to stand out more.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 <<And I'd argue the kids of the 60s didn't know how to rebel, either. What did their rebellion accomplish? The Summer of Love? Eventually the end of Vietnam? A bunch of hippies who grew up, sold out, and became part of the establishment? You're naive if you think that sort of thing has any traction in the long term.>> I dunno. They did accomplish a lot of social change. Without the civil rights movement, would we have a half black President today? Without the women's movement, would women have been able to become such a large part of the workforce and in important jobs? I think the social change is still being felt today in everything from the voting booth to the ability of gay couples to have some rights (depending on where they are). <<Speaking of politics, anyone see where Disney is going to trademark "SEAL Team Six." If you haven't heard, you should google the story. It'll make you feel all warm and cuddly toward the corporation.>> Yes. And I am a bit sickened by it. I actually didn't think they could do so, but apparently I was mistaken.
