WDW Social 'Media' and Conspiracy

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<So wait is the Disney Parks Blog the official company blog?>>

<<Yes, and I would guess that starting this was one of the corner stones of the new social media initiative they have (after the moms panel - which actually gives out some useful advise).>>

That would be a very good guess!

<<I remember that I heard people on a podcast mentioning Thomas Smith and what a great guy he was and was a bit surprised that they would know him until it dawned to me that his title "Social Media Director" also means that he is the contact for those folks.>>

Not only would he be the contact. He'd be the one to 'rank them' ... and that means he might give them four nights at the Poly vs. two night at Pop ... or he might hand them an envelope with 20 vouchers for meals at places like Narcoosee's, Jiko and California Grill, while someone else gets 10 vouchers for QS meals ... or they get three of the special LE pin sets that are ONLY supposed to go to one a piece.

Funny thing, though, when you pull that crap with NBC or the WSJ (and Disney does), you don't hear or read about it. Just part of the business.

But those bloggers and podcasters cry like Jan Brady ... 'it's always Marcia, Marcia, Marcia ... Oh, I meant Lou, Lou, Lou.' ;-)

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>> No, they are not! You, Spirit, etc. are the ones who are shallow! <<

<<He's so shallow he makes Lauderdale-By- The-Sea at low tide look like the Puerto Rico Trench next to him.>>

Benihana ... and Ranch House ... and Reese's... what happy childhood memories. I forgot I told you about those! ;-)

>> Actually, Spirit of 74 NEVER has fun at WDW. And it's obvious.

He's such a chauvanist pig that needs to be banned from the parks ASAP! <<

<<He's only a chauvinist pig on his good days.>>

You flatter me. But really, I think Queen Phil would love me ... he has an obvious online bulge, after all!

<<Mickey would ban him, but he doesn't want to give up the money Spirit spends on his AP, plus all the money spent by his friends buying him meals there.>>

Um, I'll have you know that Mickey gave me a very warm (and long) hug when I visited Minnie and him at their new Main Street digs last month. The mice love me, the rats who run the company are another story ... but Mickey and Minnie are forever. Execs are just passing through.

And my friends know it is a privilege to be able to take the Spirit out for dinner ... or lunch ... or brunch ... or dessert ... or drinks ... or snacks ... funny how you're never at WDW when I am, Pierce!

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<It doesn't seem, however, that public relations or marketing is kept in check by anyone or anything. The world of marketing is fraught with ridiculous claims and on the Internet, outright fraud and deception.

Who will put marketing in its place?>>

The Spirit would love a crack at it ...

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>>A Mommy blogger from Ohio (with 43 visitors a day) gets treated like Katie Couric. <<

<<You mean they are going to fire a Mommy Blogger for poor ratings?>>

No. They're going to give her a show and cancel General Hospital.

>> And do you think Disney is paying attention to this thread ... or a thread about changes to LMA? <<

<<I don't know. It's a pretty heated discussion about Lightning McQueen replacing Herbie.>>

And those are the kind of discussions they love to see on fan forums, well until people start attacking them for synergy ... but they'll still take that over this any day.


>> Here's a question for you: do you think they want an open and frank discussion like this taking place? <<

<<What business in their right mind would?>>

A business that has thrived for 80-some years by providing products that were second to none and wants to be at that level again.

That's who.

>> ***Still waiting for Duncan or Thomas or Gary to pop on in over here ... after all, they do care about the fan community, right? ;-) <<

<<If I worked for Disney I certainly wouldn't be discussing this issue here at LP. That would strictly be an internal matter.>>

Well, since they're already here ... they might as well offer their opinions. They do only want what's best for us all, right? And what's best for Disney ... right?

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>> It's the equivalent of going into a chruch and asking the congregation if they are religious. <<

<<Members of a church have varying degrees of religious commitments. They are in church listening to sermons to reconfirm or strengthen their commitment to that particular religion. Do you think possibly that scenario might be in play with Disney also?>>

Usually, the congregation is there because they still share a strong and unifying belief/system. Even if its waning, they're still there because they can, hopefully, reignite the spark of faith (or however you wish to frame it). But, they aren't there because they've given up their faith. If you mean it's all about degrees, then I certainly agree.

And if you take it over to the Disney fan community, one might agree that since the product and the BRAND are not what they once were, that Disney is using those sites to reinforce the flock. How sad is that?

But I'd again point out (for like the 89th time in this thread) that no one is being converted. It's still preaching to choirmembers ... even if some have lost a bit of their pixie dust. They aren't trading in their week at OKW or BW for a week in Vegas or Maui or Montreal.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>> I, obviously, agree. These tour guides would be at the top of the list of people that should be put out of business. The problem, as I am sure you probably know very well, is that Disney is allowing these tours to go on in Orlando (why? that's a question I've been trying to get to the bottom of? are people at WDW Social Media and/or Guest Relations getting kickbacks? is it a coincidence that one of these tour guides has another job working at said Guest Relations? is it all just looked away from because of the positive publicity they shill through their sites?) ... it all feels very sleazy ... like a drug deal in some alley that's about to go bad, only it's Main Street USA. <<

<<Once again I'll ask you. What got this burr under your saddle?>>

I work in media, which is no secret to most people here (and anyone in the consequence in TWDC) and I don't like seeing the debasing ... the Walmarting ... of one of the world's great BRANDS and one of my favorite companies.

To see this being done in the most crudest and obvious of fashions, the exploitation of those who built a company with such a history of creativity and real MAGIC, just plain bothers me.

Oh, and, as a branding expert in media, they're getting it all wrong. And if you don't believe me, talk to people in advertising ... or some of their former consultants. I have.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>> Again, how are they attracting new audiences? No one planning their first MAGICal vacation does so based on watching a fanboi podcast ... or looking at a site with 654 pictures of construction walls ... or visiting another that talks about taking an 18-month old to the MK ... or another that simply talks about dining at WDW restaurants etc. Those are sites for people Disney already OWNS!

They aren't attracting more business. They aren't growing the value of the BRAND. <<

<<I strongly disagree here. They are maintaining the brand with these folks. In turn these folks will tell others of the wonders of Disney, aka word of mouth.>>

If the goal is to maintain and not grow, which it is NOT, then they have a huge problem to start with. Burbank wants, and Wall Street demands, growth.

As to these folks, they'll spread the same word of mouth whether Disney spends $8,000 on them in a week with a free cruise, airfare, hotel, food, booze, swag or whether Disney sends them an email linking them to press releases and photos. Disney Social Media has not been able to show that by paying off these people that they increase their reach at ALL.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>> The Spirit is still obviously a big fat baby! <<

<<Actually he's rather fit, and trim, but he does have hairy arms.>>

He was waiting to see if David could set him up with a free spa day at the GF and include a waxing ... but he may have to pay for it himself!

The only question: how much hair removal is enough?

 

Originally Posted By DlandDug

>>First, Doug, you kinda ignored my response to you, which I guess is cool.<<
I didn't ignore your response. I feel I made my point, you made your point, and that's cool.

>>The entertainment industry has always been incredibly competitive and cutthroat. It really is no more so today.<<
But on this I totally disagree. It's not a matter of more of the same thing. It's the proliferation of entertainment outlets. The fact that more and more disposable income is being spent on an increasingly fragmented market. Saying "I don't know and I don't care" can't paper over this. For good or ill, Disney's current strategy directly addresses this. You don't like it-- I understand. (And for the most part, I agree with you. I just don't find it all that mystifying.)

 

Originally Posted By andyll

<<As to these fans sites, I can make a very good argument (listening again, Trish? ... or is Tom reading himself today? ;-)) as to why Disney Legal should shut down all the ones that are blatantly stealing IPs/copyrighted material and leave the others alone, but not invite them to a single thing unless they are local and simply put them on a press release and photo list >>

Are you advocating laughingplace.com be shut down?

Or just the ones you do not like?

All the Disney fan sites, including this one, uses Disney IP to make money.

I've asked this question several times and it's conveniently been ignored.

Andy

 

Originally Posted By davewasbaloo

>>>>> it's a dogfight every day - you better be prepared with your A game <<

You're not going to believe how relaxing life can be when you retire.<<<<

Or when you set up your own firm. So many of my colleagues do not understand why I left corporate life so young.

 

Originally Posted By vbdad55

^^ I do-- I waited too long..wish I'd have gone earlier..

 

Originally Posted By Lee hisownself

How I know I've been talking to Spirit too much...

I read Lance's glowing review of Mernaid on Screamscape. My first thought was "Yeah, but he got a free trip out there, so how can I trust him."

 

Originally Posted By davewasbaloo

Lol, it is funny, because it is true. I poked fun of Kevin for his review of the Disney cruise, but chances are he would have been more glowing if it were free.

In Paris, there is a website where the webmasters started to get a little more critical as they matured. Disney then invited them in for some free stuff, and lo and behold, they are supportive of the company again. Interesting.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

>> As to these fans sites, I can make a very good argument (listening again, Trish? ... or is Tom reading himself today? ;-)) as to why Disney Legal should shut down all the ones that are blatantly stealing IPs/copyrighted material and leave the others alone, but not invite them to a single thing unless they are local and simply put them on a press release and photo list (again, think of all those saved dollars ... would you rather be spending millions on propping up a Social Media Department so it can spend millions more on freebies for fan sites ... or would you rather see that money invested in the parks ... in the infrastructure .... for entertainers ... for front-line cast to be able to eat better and live better)? <<

Offering free advice? You are upset with this whole social media thing.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

>> Here's a question for you: do you think they want an open and frank discussion like this taking place? <<

<<What business in their right mind would?>>

>> A business that has thrived for 80-some years by providing products that were second to none and wants to be at that level again.

That's who. <<

I am afraid integrity would become to large of an issue for some to play by that rule.


>> ***Still waiting for Duncan or Thomas or Gary to pop on in over here ... after all, they do care about the fan community, right? ;-) <<

The more the merrier. I think you could safely say this is a fan site.

<<If I worked for Disney I certainly wouldn't be discussing this issue here at LP. That would strictly be an internal matter.>>

>> Well, since they're already here ... they might as well offer their opinions. They do only want what's best for us all, right? And what's best for Disney ... right? <<

I know I would certainly want to address my base if I felt they had an issue with something. I'm sure no one has anything to hide, and would really like to clear up any misunderstanding about this particular issue.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

>> If the goal is to maintain and not grow, which it is NOT, then they have a huge problem to start with. Burbank wants, and Wall Street demands, growth.

As to these folks, they'll spread the same word of mouth whether Disney spends $8,000 on them in a week with a free cruise, airfare, hotel, food, booze, swag or whether Disney sends them an email linking them to press releases and photos. Disney Social Media has not been able to show that by paying off these people that they increase their reach at ALL. <<

Personally I think it is very wise to constantly prop up your base. I'm sure those at the top of TWDC would really like to do this in both a cost effective, and ethical way. Possibly they are not completely aware of everything that is playing out with their social media campaign.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

>> You flatter me. But really, I think Queen Phil would love me ... he has an obvious online bulge, after all! <<

I sure wish I were popular like you are.

>> And my friends know it is a privilege to be able to take the Spirit out for dinner ... or lunch ... or brunch ... or dessert ... or drinks ... or snacks ... funny how you're never at WDW when I am, Pierce! <<

I've told you I am having problems with the musical arrangements for the Harpist at Victoria and Albert's. You wouldn't want your wine flight to be marred by an inappropriate musical serenade would you.

>> He was waiting to see if David could set him up with a free spa day at the GF and include a waxing ... but he may have to pay for it himself!

The only question: how much hair removal is enough? <<

I think it's best that I not comment on this.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>>First, Doug, you kinda ignored my response to you, which I guess is cool.<<

<<I didn't ignore your response. I feel I made my point, you made your point, and that's cool.>>

Fine. I just thought you might have more perspective having been at the recent DLR event. But let's move on ...

>>The entertainment industry has always been incredibly competitive and cutthroat. It really is no more so today.<<

<<But on this I totally disagree. It's not a matter of more of the same thing. It's the proliferation of entertainment outlets. The fact that more and more disposable income is being spent on an increasingly fragmented market. Saying "I don't know and I don't care" can't paper over this.>>

I'm sorry, but I seem to be missing something here then.

Because I don't believe you are possibly suggesting that people are opting to buy a new gaming system instead of taking a MAGICal WDW vacation or go see a film in Imax vs spending a day at DLR or buying iPads for the whole family instead of taking a DCL voyage.

That isn't what you are saying, right?

<<For good or ill, Disney's current strategy directly addresses this.>>

How? Again, been asking that question for a long time.

How does Disney's current Social Media strategy (and not talking D23 or The Disney Parks Blog here) of basically paying 'independent' bloggers for coverage increase their customer base ... and how does it grow their BRAND?

<<You don't like it-- I understand. (And for the most part, I agree with you. I just don't find it all that mystifying.)>>

It's not whether I like something or not. There are plenty of things that I don't like, but I see the value in them to others.

I don't see any real tangible value in what Disney is undertaking in Social Media ... and I see a lot of destructive underpinings to it.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

Just another point and something I wanted to mention about 100 posts ago and got off-track, but it speaks to how Disney used to use the media for REAL legit feeback on what it was doing right and not so right and how it was connecting with its audience to its current strategy of basically paying online folks to spin PR drivel.

But I recall back in 1988 when I first read some negative coverage of WDW. It was a first for me. I had expected some reporters to harshly criticize WDW for opening Mickey's Birthdayland, which looked so cheap, tacky and temporary compared to the rest of the amazing MK.

But they didn't.

Most reporters loved it, thought it was a great idea to celebrate Mickey's B-Day and have a set place where the Big Cheese was every day. Of course, they also thought it was going to be a temporary addition, so they were only going with what they had.

They also loved Illuminations. I don't think I read a single negative comment. And I remember reading things like 'No one but Disney could do something like this' ... and 'An amazing nighttime symphony of music, fireworks and light that takes you around the world' etc.

BUT ... if you remember 1988, the big debut in WDW (resorts aside) was the Norway pavilion with the Maelstrom attraction as its centerpiece. Well, that's where the surprise kicked in.

While I didn't think it was great, I enjoyed it. But reporters from some major publications (I think Miami Herald and USA Today were two) and TV/radio were not so enamored. The reception was lukewarm in general at best and not at all what Disney had expected.

Michael Eisner, who until then had been gold with everything he did in FLA, was none too happy. He actually seethed a bit when reading coverage.

Well, 1989 brought the biggest expansion in WDW history with Disney-MGM, Typhoon Lagoon and Pleasure Island all opening in the spring (WoL came later to EPCOT).

Now, Eisner could have reacted badly and insisted Disney not invite the individuals that ripped Maelstrom (in hindsight, they really were right as the attraction hasn't aged well and is the subject of a lot of 'what ifs?' right now), but instead he wanted them all back and he made sure WDW Press and Publicity put out the red carpet for them. He even made sure to invite ADDITIONAL people from those organizations as well. (BTW, I know this story from being told by ME himself and was confirmed by others who worked at the resort at the time).

He wanted ... DISNEY wanted ... to show these people ... these truly independent voices what it was capable of doing. And he hoped ... believed ... that even if Disney got some bad reviews they could use that information to better gauge the product they were selling. To learn what worked and what didn't and why.

Eisner didn't want to hear an echo chamber, unless it was a natural one.

He wanted unadulterated commentary. He wanted to see how others viewed the product, so Disney could make it good as it possibly could be.

So when Disney-MGM opened and some critics said there wasn't enough to do and that it wasn't worth the same price as a day at the MK or EC, he immediately greenlit plans to double the size/offerings of the park.

It was all research and it was priceless.

Good. Bad. And Ugly.

Now, how much value is there in having 486 bloggers drooling about Star Tours because you gave them a free vacation and let them talk to Anthony Daniels for two minutes with a handler close by?