WDW Social 'Media' and Conspiracy

Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub

That is a really great article. I hope everybody takes the time to read it...because you are taking the first step just by questioning the false power Disney is taking to create a fake happy world that ultimately is our real world because bottom line it is our money & our lives & our future and our everything.
And by the way it is not just Disney we have to be cautious of. If feels like we are all living in a fake commercial world. It is the biggest cultural divide. The younger generation is choosing to be on the digital side of the big digital divide. Their mantra is "Program or be Programmed" They do not want to be just the audience; they want to be the participants by feeling connected to one another online and with their objects of desire. They post they create and they remix. ANd of course huge corporations are going to make sure this is all to their monetary advantage.
You are brave or foolish to think this onslaught can be reversed...

 

Originally Posted By davewasbaloo

>>>Many folks, just regular people (not even talking Disney fans here) have a number closer to that last one. 1000. Now, tell me, can you possibly name 1000 people (if so, would it take you many, many hours to do so)? Not friends ... just people ... historical figures, celebrities, family, and, well, anybody you can think of.<<<

Yes, but I am a well travelled nerd who kind of likes people ;-) I have 402 on my page, only about 10 I haven't known for real or in cyber space for several years, and those 10 are family or close friends of my real friends that loved what I was saying to people in their network.

Add in 300 people in my professional contacts, many of which were either colleagues, business partners or former clients.

So that is 702 people, then real off folks from schools and University, ex girlfriends, and ex colleagues not on facebook, I could probably get you to that 1000 mark. Don't forget I am a history geek, so we could probably double it if we allow musicians and actors in the list. ;-)

But I get what you mean, I just wanted to poke a stick at that part of your hypothesis. But I do comprehend what you are inferring.

 

Originally Posted By davewasbaloo

Ok, I want to take this at a tangent, simply because of the themes in your long post my friend. I will come back to Disney in a moment, but actually I want to offer a counterpoint of social media.

I think in the main Social Media is a good thing, with many unfortunate side efffects (people being rude on FB on their phone when you are talking to them; a number of LPers who don't like to hear smack about WDW nor my open opinions going and setting up their own exclusive FB group; tea baggers who go and claim they are right because so and so supports their views (ok, us lefties suffer from that too sometimes - though I try to get my news from a plethera of sources) but those things are not new, people said the same thing about books and TV with teenagers tooning out; churches, societies and other groups pushing an agenda to their communities etc.

But to me, Social Media also offers up many wonderful things. I have reconnected with family members I lost contact with when I left the US 25 years ago. I am able to share my photos with friends and family around the globe, and have one set that I link my wife of their friends to.

I have been the recipiant of information regarding weddings, birthday parties and funerals, making it easier for the arrangers who are already very busy with other things.

It has reminded me of the birthdays of friends, family and colleagues.

It has kept me up to date with news stories of interest - whether that be the completion of the Olympic stadium in London, the impact of E3 in LA (years ago I would have bought a magazine a month after the event), the fact there is a Leonardo Da Vinci exhibit, the likes the world has never seen coming to London, and FB told me about it so I was comfortably able to get tickets around my birthday, it has been great for fund raising, creating cyber committees for school and charitable events, we derailed the Simon Cowell machine by ensuring the X factor singer did not get to number one in the charts, with Rage Against the Machine getting that slot instead. While many of these things may seem insignificant, what is significant is FB has been used to track criminals, it has been used to gain understanding on political issues and campaigning, and it has allowed me to keep in touch for free with people around the globe in their times of need.

And everything on my FB page is honest. As a point of integrity, I try to use it as an outlet for my thoughts, good and bad; generate debate; and we have even used for research for the kids' projects.

There are also lots of toys!

So ya, I bought into Zuckerburg's vision. I know there is a lot of BS on there too, but I ignore it. Although, a lot of my friends that post (90%) post like we were talking together or how I remember when we were closer. Sure, it might be BS, but it might be when face to face too.

I went to school, having our home taken away when I was a boy, not a soul knew at school. How is that different?

 

Originally Posted By Bolna

<This is relevant and amusing if you think of a certain Disney executive as the devil...but the article is a commentary by Cathleen Falsani concerning a new book>>

Mickeymouseclub, thanks for entertaining read. I already put that book on my wish list thanks to your post.

 

Originally Posted By Bolna

Spirit, posts 638-640 are a great read and they really sum up the whole thread very well. Nearly so good that one doesn't dare to add anything...

The whole discussion about social media is much more than just about Disney. But just as you say, Disney is trying to play with the new possibilities and unfortunately isn't doing a very good job at it.

The micro-targetting you mentioned might even have its next step in the much talked about Next Gen initiative. Isn't that supposed to create an experience that is tailored to your own preferences? It seems like there might be the vision in the future that through technology they will be able to offer a diversity of experiences. But wouldn't it be much simpler to just put the diversity out there in the real world and let people pick and chose. They might end up experiencing something that they don't know about yet and find out that they really like it. From a business perspective wouldn't that make more sense? Wouldn't most customers be more likely to come back if they found something new to experience than for the same stuff over and over again?

 

Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub

Yeah I think it will be a good book to read also and was thinking it was slightly pertinent to the topic...

I think Spirit is correct for his alarm. The tracking mechanism for social behavior online is frightening and does have the power to control our thoughts and our actions. It has destroyed fair and balanced journalism. This power influences our attempts to make educated decisions about personal and political choice. It is already very efficient at causing price increases rapidly online for hotel& airfares. And as Dave points out it does create friendly social benefits but also evil and criminal access. I personally feel extremely powerless over social control that becomes so one sided and probably target those feelings towards Disney and Southwest Airlines because they are the two corporations that get most of my money.

 

Originally Posted By Mickeymouseclub

and the professional bloggers that Disney sanctions are about as interesting as those fake high school cheerleaders with the rah rah Disney!!!(referring to the real high school in the real world not the Disney fake movie hi-school cheering squad. Although it is all one and the same) Ugh

 

Originally Posted By DlandDug

I don't think that there is a monolithic Social Media out there. There are monoliths that operate within the existing social media (FaceBook being the premiere example at the moment). But social media is simply an extension of what humans have always done-- find ways to connect. And in the connections there have always been groups: Dear Friends, cliques, family members, people-you-barely-know, the Tolerated, professional colleagues, FOAFs (friend of a friend), romantic partners, and so on. Some of the relationships are as false as can be; others are as binding as anything on earth.

American corporations have always attempted to create connections with consumers. "You're in Good Hands." "When you care enough to send the very best." "You deserve a break today!" These should be the comments of friends, not an insurance company, greeting card maker, and a fast food vendor. Social media is simply a new, and particularly pernicious, method to do what corporations have been trying to do for some time.

 

Originally Posted By DlandDug

>>What is the ROI that TWDC receives by spending massive amounts of capital on 'special' fan bloggers/podcasters/webmasters with giveaways and by allowing some to steal/appropriate Disney content on their sites and by selling products.<<

If this is the question that sticks in your craw, then it's unlikely you will ever get a satisfying answer. For starters, there's too many mutual exclusives within it. It is also the case that some of this is proprietary, something we will never know, as in: "...not one person has appeared here to show how WDW Co.'s Social Media machine has monetized this in any way. Nor that they even can or ever will." Yup. Although never can or never will is more like it.

It is also unreasonable to demand that anybody from the Walt Disney Company come here and engage us in this conversation. Aside from anything else, it seems most likely that they are not allowed to do this. Consider the ramifications, particularly in this litigious age.

This has been a fascinating topic, I have heard a lot of different opinions and gleaned some new facts (some disturbing, it is true). But I really do not expect that hard answers will result from what has proven to be a most interesting conversation.

 

Originally Posted By DDMAN26

After reading this topic I do after wonder how the whole social media thing would affect the Disney guest who saves up for a few years to take his family down to WDW? Someone who wouldn't know a Mongello or the Moms Panel.

 

Originally Posted By vbdad55

spirit based on your # of facebook friend analyis - or how many people we could name/know--

I only have like 200 on facebook- but I could easily name 1000 because I am involved 1/ at work and work globally 2/ involved in local politics 3/ involved in local school book 4/ run a blog 5/ involved in my childrens sport for years at various levels 6/ active alumni of 2 colleges -- etc.. ( now you understand why I have time for nothg- LOL ! ) --

BUT -- let's say I could name 1500 today ( I think easily) - that I have had contact with in the last 12 months-- my 'influence' to change their opinions on something quickly probaly applies to 100-150 -- a fraction of the total amount.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

Hey, Celebration Place dudes ... I'd love to take credit for this piece, really ... hmm ... so ...

Today's NY Times Magazine, which reaches a helluva lot more folks than any blog or podcast and, more importantly, people with tremendous influence (and that means lots and lots of dollars) ran the following take of a family visit to the pixie dust capital of the world.

<a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/12/magazine/a-rough-guide-to-disney-world.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1" target="_blank">http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06...d=1&_r=1</a>

You see, Mr. Wardle (and all my dear 'friends' reading this ... even those who took the drive down the street so they wouldn't have a Team Disney ISP going to Doobie and Co, gotta have plausible deniability, right? ;-) ), this is precisely what happens when you give the real journalists and their well-established platforms the finger and you put out the white glove for fanbois/soccer moms/bored housewifes.

Wanna know what Burbank thinks about this ....?

Oh, and I do wish to address some of the great points made here Sunday ... just didn't have the time today dealing with work (and a nasty hail storm as well). But I just wanted to make sure the LP Community saw today's Times piece ... you know, some of the references peppered throughout the story, but especially on Pages 7 and 8, couldn't have been scripted better if a certain Spirit had been playing puppetmaster behind the scenes ... and we all know that couldn't ever be the case, don't we?

At the risk of being too self indulgent, there are some days I really love being me.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

Oh, one other thought ... it kinda came to me a few weeks ago when I got confirmation the above story was going to appear in print today.

I'm not exactly sure why, but it brought me back to a day in London five years ago. An afternoon when instead of being out enjoying the city, I was on a conference call with Karl Holz, the then Prez/CEO of Euro Disney ... my old buddy George Kalogridis (then the recent No. 2 appointment, now the fanboi fave Prez of the DLR before heading into Newport Beach retirement living in another year or two) was also there (although he didn't have much to say, which I found odd because Georgie hadn't ever been shy with me) and there were others on the call as well, who I won't name because they aren't public figures (and they're not of any moment to this discussion anyway).

I'm not about to indulge all of the details of said call, but they had to do with the Disney BRAND, where it had been and where it was and where it was going ... and much of it was in light of a particularly disastrous visit to DLP, one of many, by a delegation of top Chinese officials from Shanghai and Beijing who were deep in talks over building Shanghai DL. They had some huge misgivings and the visit helped almost bury the project (which in large measure would have likely been put off for years more if not for our economic meltdown, which hurt China as the top maker of all our crap, making it more important for the Chinese than it had been -- and much easier to get Beijing to sign off on something very few in leadership were/are excited about).

I don't really recall much of the conversation. I'd have to dig out my notes, but I recall Karl was very out of sorts. He just didn't seem to get what I was saying ... about the importance of the BRAND and integrity and being honest with consumers, especially your most loyal guests. I guess I might as well have been speaking Chinese because he sure didn't get it.

At one point, he abruptly hung up. I kinda thought that was rude and disrespectful. But 10 minutes later as I was trying to comprehend the absurdity of dealing with some of Disney's 'best P&R execs', Karl rang back. Wanted to stiffly apologize for the 'accidental' disconnection.

I'm a very forgiving Spirit. Usually ... ... ...

but one thing was clear in my mind at least, these execs had no real concept of the power of the BRAND and a complete disconnect when it came to how that BRAND translated to consumer goodwill, loyalty and equity.

Five years later, there's still a disconnect as many of us have discussed in this very thread.

Off tangent now and back to the topic (hopefully) tomorrow ... after I find out how much it's going to cost me to get all those hail 'dimples' off my baby Benz :-( ... Grrr ... friggin Florida weather ...

 

Originally Posted By figment1986

<<I will try. Would have liked to last month, but it wasn't a pleasure trip and I was kind of going from hour to hour. But I forgot that you are now a lot closer, which makes things easier.>>

So many people forget I'm near UCF now...

<<I don't know. I haven't been to DC yet. Want to, just haven't made it a priority. But I've never known someone who has gone -- and paid -- who has come away disappointed.

What you have to ask yourself is simply would you have enjoyed the experience just as much if you had paid for it, whether it was worth the price point and whether it was a quality experience all around. If you ever answer yourself with a ''... but it was free'' then you have a problem. And any online review/comments need to reflect that because your readers are going to be paying.>>

But it was free... though I am remembering how much it costs and have something "disney" to directly compare it to...

I've done the ray excursion on castaway cay before where you feed them and then snorkel with them...

it's really close to what we did at DC, that and I have another snorkel excursion for my cruise on June 21 on the Dream.

I always remember prices when it is something above and beyond the normal prices of $100 (hate saying that's normal now though)

 

Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer

>>>Off tangent now and back to the topic (hopefully) tomorrow ... after I find out how much it's going to cost me to get all those hail 'dimples' off my baby Benz :-( ... Grrr ... friggin Florida weather ...<<<<


That, along with the dent from your I-95 adventure, must not be fun.

 

Originally Posted By Scutr

Thanks for sharing that article, Spirit. A REAL-world family's REAL WDW experience, pot smoke & all.
And the kind of honest WDW critique swag can't buy.
Which is, no doubt, WHY the "Emperor" (TWDC) tries to pay-off so many people not to proclaim that he is, in fact, not wearing any pixie-dust covered clothes...

 

Originally Posted By ReelJustice

When will this article turn into an article about Disney and not something out of "High Times"? I'm beginning to lose interest.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

That was complete dribble!

 

Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer

Yeah, I got lost on about page 4...

 

Originally Posted By figment1986

<<When will this article turn into an article about Disney and not something out of "High Times"? I'm beginning to lose interest.>>

the hale stones causing the damage might be mickey shaped.. did that work?