WDW Social 'Media' and Conspiracy

Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer

>>>He wanted ... DISNEY wanted ... to show these people ... these truly independent voices what it was capable of doing. And he hoped ... believed ... that even if Disney got some bad reviews they could use that information to better gauge the product they were selling. To learn what worked and what didn't and why.<<<<


They can't do that anymore... lots of things don't "work"... becuase they don't want them too.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

>> Well, he is German (at least I think you are talking about the Ring of the Nibelung here),

Yes Die Walküre, the second of the four operas that make up Der Ring des Nibelungen.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

>>
I can't comment on US dentists offices, but I can tell you that The New York Times is pretty well known here in Germany. The German newspaper I read - Süddeutsche Zeitung, the newspaper with the highest distribution in Germany - has a supplement every Monday with selected articles from The New York Times. <<

It's a shell of what it once was.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<I 'vill agree 'vith da German >>

<<Hey, are you implying that I don't know my Vs from my Ws? I can assure you that I can pronounce both rather perfectly, even with a lovely British accent! ;-)>>

You are very intriguing. And I say that vith the utmost in respect!

<<People will always go to Disneyworld.com ... and TripAdvisor.com ... and allears etc ... waaaaay before they ever hit one of these other sites.>>

<<Yes, those sites (and even a guidebook like the Unofficial Guide or the Passporter) will keep them busy enough. Last trip I traveled with my sister. It was her first trip to WDW and she was very excited and spent lots of time reading about the place. And those big sites did offer enough information for her. I think she spent several evenings on allears looking at the different resorts and trying to figure out where she would want to stay. I tried to send her links to stuff she might find interesting on more "obscure" websites, but very often she plain did not have the time. I think this is something we as fans tend to forget: how much knowledge about that place we have collected over the time. For a first timer the real basics are daunting enough. >>

Of course, your sister also was able to rely on all your accumulated experience and knowledge. In other words, she likely could have done no research at all and you would have ensured she had a truly MAGICal WDW vacation. Again, that's old-fashioned word of mouth.

But the first-timer doing planning simply isn't going to rely on an obscure (and most are) site online for the very reason you state in your last sentence. WDW is huge and can be an incredible challenge for first-timers. These people don't have time to wade thru blogs about the many variations on the new Star Tours or the history of World Showcase or whether their toddler would be best suited for breakfast at the Crystal Palace, lunch at Cindy's Royal Table or dinner at Chef Mickey's.

They need the basics. And fan sites simply aren't the place to go for that.

They delve into the minutiae at an almost microscopic level (do we need sites specializing in one attraction or pages of photos of every detail of a resort?), which is what makes them a target for co-opting by the company. A new guest/consumer has questions that are easily answered by visiting the company's site and those same questions if posed on fan sites (even places like this one) can devolve into utter chaos because you're dealing with the most passionate buyer of the product -- and none of us view it (the good, the bad and the ugly) like a first-timer simply looking for a quality, value for money paid vacation.

As a famous TV character once said, (again, people under 35 probably don't know who I'm talking about, but should) 'Just the facts, ma'am.' ... WDW.com and/or TripAdvisor.com can more than adequately handle that ... absent the taint WDW Co's Social Media Dept has spread amongst many of the fan sites.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>>>(classice TV reference that no one under 35 would have a clue about, but they should)<<<

<<I do!!!!! lol>>

You are not typical, for better or worse ;-)


>>>Oh, and if anyone would like to contact Phil (Holmes, VP of MK) directly after experiencing Splash Mountain or BTMRR ... or CBJ ... or any of the numerous attractions that are falling apart, let me know and I'll find a way to make sure you have his number (not sure whether the powers here want me to put his private confidential voicemail out there, although I see no reason not to).<<<


<<If Splash ends up looking THAT bad for when I'm there, I'll go and give him a ring, and I'll probably visit City Hall.

Favorite ride, after all.

Also, don't understand how it looks so bad... It looked great last Christmas. And it's had a refurb since then! >>

I rode it in February, about 48 hours after it reopened. Some of it looked better ... there had been painting for instance. And the finale showboat scene looked better than I had seen it in years. But MANY of the AAs were still not working (as Kevin stated in his column), some were also missing.

There are so many things not working on so many attractions from over a decade of reduced maintenance and just flat out neglect that one wonders if they ever know what needs fixing ...

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<I arrive to the thread to see there are 37 new messages in it for me to read...after I picked my jaw up from the floor....I was wondering...what about the children? (ZINK OF ZEE CHILDREN EXPO!)...Nickelodeon had a very powerful presence in the early to mid 90s, more than the Disney channel did at the time. We already have some Disney channel related attractions in the park, I would not be surprised if social marketing targeted young children or youth with more in-park tie ins such as nickelodeon did. As we've mentioned over the years, there will be less unique things to see at Disney Parks and more franchises.>>

How funny is it that TWDC officials had to sit through 'meetings' on how Nickelodeon had effectively integrated its product into the Chinese consciousness ... anyone who has every been on a subway/metro in China can speak to the remarkable penetration Nick has been able to achieve. Not to say Mickey isn't popular because he is, but Spongebob and Dora are everywhere. ... And how long have they been around in comparison?

As to your specific point above, I'd say we've seen that for years. From Bear in the Big Blue House to Doug: Live to Playhouse Disney to that new Phineas and Ferb meet-greet-and grope ... but it's still a very limited market. I wouldn't Handy Mandy if he came to work on my pipes (no jokes, please). Disney is splitting its audience again ... instead of attractions and products for the entire family, you have things with very limited demo interest (in the case here, something if you have kids under 5).

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<Winky hates it when she uses him to wipe the food from around my mouth off.>>

I know. He has written be about it ... you can feel his pain coming thru the computer. Poor little fella ...

<<I don't think Disney has anything to fear from articles like that one. The New York Times has what, a circulation of a couple hundred thousand now, and you can find most of that number in the waiting rooms of Dentist around the country. After reading that article I can see why it's going bankrupt. Whoever the editor of that section was should have been taken outside, and publicly flogged. Chances are the only people that actually read the entire piece are folks high on pot or those of us right here on LP or a combination of those two groups.>>

Well, when last I checked, the Sunday Times had a physical circulation of around a million and a half, so that is a bit higher than what you believe. And that number assumes that only one person reads that copy be it in a home or a dentist's office or wherever. That also doesn't include all the online eyes as well. Millions of folks ... many millions read the content.

But I don't want to get off topic too much and focus on the story or the outlet.

I can tell you something like this makes folks in Burbank, including Iger (who I can guarantee you has read it) just cringe ... and one of the top audiences for a piece like that is all those investment bankers and analysts on Wall Street who still subscribe to the Times, and the people who can/would book two weeks at rack rate at the GF.

<<As you know I can not stand narrow minded people that feel a necessity to put forth their own little agenda while mixing it in with comments about Disney. There is something sickly perverse about that. When you are in a Disney park with your wife, and kids, and you are sneaking off to smoke dope speaks volumes about one's character and motivation for writing this article.>>

Oh, Pierce we all do that to some extent, even if we try not to. I don't want to focus on the writer because I basically agree with you about the whole sneaking off for a toke deal. That said, I can remember as a kid being on Disney attractions (not in Anaheim) and smelling the unmistakable whiff or wacky tobacky. And what does it say about me stopping at the Tambu Lounge or Territory Lounge for a drink or three before attempting an MK viist? ;-)

<<Then we have the health conscious little Peruvian lad who was mesmerized by all the large people around him on his once in a lifetime trip to WDW. It was so out of the ordinary for him he felt compelled to take pictures of their behinds. It seems if he wanted to take pictures of FAT A$$E$ he should have snapped pictures of his chubby little classmates. Let me take a quote from a Global Obesity web site.>>

I am sure Peruvians are getting fat just like us ... but you know anyone who has been to WDW that there's no greater concentration of morbidly obese folks anywhere. And those spandex monsters I guess don't just scare me! ;-)

Poor 'wittle Lucha ...

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

Just a quick question here before heading to dinner ... but it came to mind when reading Leo's comments about the 'comments' left on The Disney Parks Blog on the thread regarding the increase in ticket prices this week:

How many of you think/believe/suspect/or wouldn't put it past them that Disney's Social Media Dept actually makes up some of the comments on its own site (both positive and negative) to frame issues in a certain light that corporate desires?

Seriously. Thoughts?

 

Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer

>>>I rode it in February, about 48 hours after it reopened. Some of it looked better ... there had been painting for instance. And the finale showboat scene looked better than I had seen it in years. But MANY of the AAs were still not working (as Kevin stated in his column), some were also missing. <<<<

Well, I'll see it in a few hours... Were the missing AAs THAT noticeable, like a gap of them? Or just one here and there.

 

Originally Posted By MousDad

>>How many of you think/believe/suspect/or wouldn't put it past them that Disney's Social Media Dept actually makes up some of the comments on its own site (both positive and negative) to frame issues in a certain light that corporate desires?

Seriously. Thoughts?<<

They do it on other sites, so why not do it on their own?

 

Originally Posted By Bolna

<<As a famous TV character once said, (again, people under 35 probably don't know who I'm talking about, but should)>>

People in Germany don't know who you are talking about either...

<<Just a quick question here before heading to dinner ... but it came to mind when reading Leo's comments about the 'comments' left on The Disney Parks Blog on the thread regarding the increase in ticket prices this week:

How many of you think/believe/suspect/or wouldn't put it past them that Disney's Social Media Dept actually makes up some of the comments on its own site (both positive and negative) to frame issues in a certain light that corporate desires?>>

In a way, I guess I am a bit too naive and think that would take micro-managing too far. So I don't really suspect them of doing that.

But then there was something in the 2010 ticket price increase discussion which had surprised me. As I had pointed out on that other thread both in 2010 and in 2011 there are negative comments on the official blog about the price increase. In the 2010 discussion (<a href="http://disneyparks.disney.go.com/blog/2010/08/new-information-about-tickets/comment-page-2/#comments" target="_blank">http://disneyparks.disney.go.c...comments</a>) in post 62 there is the following comment:

<<Mr. Smith, it seems your answers are very short, and more importatnly, it seems you do not answer to questions such as…”why are the prices going up with the economy the way it is?”
I too love Disneyland, and go there with my nephews a few times a year, however it is already very expensive just for tickets alone, not including the food you have to buy in the park, which we all know is way over priced. I understand you get what you pay for, the park is very clean, the staff is awesome and friendly and very personable, and not to mention the bands and the charcters walking around for the kids, but come on. As many have stated above this will definitely affect future disneyland trips for myself as well as my family and families all across the U.S.
So with that being said, can you finally answer? Why are the prices going up….again? Since they are going up, can you look at lowering food expenses in the parks, so the general public can afford a little more?>>

No official answer to the post - even though the blog has the ability for official answers and they happen. But then in post 76 we read this:

<<I’ve noticed many of the questions that are on here are asking “why raise the prices in this economy?” I’m certainly not a representative in anyway for Disney, but since no reponses have been posted yet… I might as well say something.

Just because this is Disney doesn’t mean they are immune to the recession. Quite frankly, if you can’t afford to go to the parks or you simply do not want to pay that much, then here’s the solution: don’t go. There are plenty of other people, such as myself, that would enjoy fewer people in the parks [means less time waiting for Indiana Jones ] To be fair… the one day tickets have only been raised a few dollars for the DLR. If you really, REALLY need to visit the parks then settle for one day. One day, two day, three day, its still Disneyland, there are still plenty of memories to be had.

Or if you prefer second hand parks such as Universal Studios, who are not nearly as clean, friendly, entertaining or family friendly as Disney then go there instead. There are only 2 main rides at Universal Studios Hollywood that are worth going for: The Mummy, and Jurassic Park, while there are 30+ attractions at Disneyland alone (excluding CA Adventure). I can assure the difference between Disney and the others will become very clear the minute you enter the gates.

If it were any other company but Disney I’d agree that the prices are getting way up there, but Disney has the highest standards across the world, it might be worth it to pay a little extra to enjoy the magic that makes it DISNEY.>>

Wow - and then there are quite a few people wholeheartedly agreeing with this. There are some topics in this post which makes it sound unofficial (like the advice not to go to DL), it also sounds a bit like what the company might want to say in an unofficial way. Perhaps they just were very lucky with a fan sending this in, but there is a small doubt about that.

As I pointed out in that other thread there appear to be about 20% negative comments in 2010 and in 2011. I am not sure about them making up comments. But I am very sure that there is a reason for which comments appear and which don't - and that the 20% is the quota set for negative comments on unpopular issues which they have to cover.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

>> As a famous TV character once said, (again, people under 35 probably don't know who I'm talking about, but should) 'Just the facts, ma'am.' ... WDW.com and/or TripAdvisor.com can more than adequately handle that ... absent the taint WDW Co's Social Media Dept has spread amongst many of the fan sites. <<

>> People in Germany don't know who you are talking about either... <<

Sgt. Joe Friday of the TV series Dragnet, played by Jack Web. I still remember the hand, and hammer pounding out the name of his production company at the end of the show.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

You can't even imagine the restraint I've used to keep from going on a tangent on some of these post.

If Burbank worries about articles like you posted, I think they need to join the author in the park for a toke or two.

 

Originally Posted By MPierce

>> Oh, Pierce we all do that to some extent, even if we try not to. I don't want to focus on the writer because I basically agree with you about the whole sneaking off for a toke deal. That said, I can remember as a kid being on Disney attractions (not in Anaheim) and smelling the unmistakable whiff or wacky tobacky. And what does it say about me stopping at the Tambu Lounge or Territory Lounge for a drink or three before attempting an MK viist? ;-) <<

What does Maryjoewana smell like?

If you stop at the Tambu Lounge or Territory Lounge it says you're probably a drunken sot to begin with. It's still legal though to have a drink or two. Besides that you don't have small children with you. Which in my opinion is an even bigger reason to belt back a few before hitting the parks.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<Also observe that some of these negative ones are not completely negative...

#21. <<This was totally unexpected to me! Price increases usually occur in August…..>>
(Translation: "Nothing surprising that the prices are going up, just surprising when they're increasing!")

#25: <<I won’t lie, the Disneyland AP increases hurt! Thank you for the monthly payment option, we’d never be able to have them without it!>>
(Translation: "I don't like the price increase, but thanks for helping me fork over the money!")

#42: <<I’m literally crying my eyes out right now. Our family of 5 now has to come up with an additional $250 in order for us to get the Premier Passes again?!?! The economy is hard enough, now we have to save up more money for a trip we’ve been planning since last September. Guess we’ll be avoiding the gift shops in the parks. Our extra spending cash will be wrapped up in just getting through the gates >>
(Translation: "You're going to get our money one way or another. Guess we'll plan not to buy souvenirs until the kids start screaming and crying and we'll break down and max out the credit cards in order to buy them some princess crap.") >>

Leo 'MAGICal Potties' Bloom did these terrific translations on another thread, but they speak to Disney's use of Social Media so I am reposting them here and want to address some of what troubles me most about the 'official' Disney Parks Blog and the 'control the message' mentality as shown in these posts.

As Leo and others have pointed out, it is a closed forum, a one-side only outlet. Even when comments are allowed, they are handpicked. Not approved based on any terms of service, but placed on the web to push a very definite agenda from Disney's Social Media Dept. This is antithetical to the idea of a forum.

Again, people disagree in the real world. They have different opinions and thoughts. Like they do here.

Think about the above postings, they were in response to the recently announced price increase. Now, as many have said, it's not reasonable that people would be writing to the blog to encourage/applaud/gush over a price increase. So Disney knew it had to open comments and open them to critics. BUT ... of the 64 comments I reviewed, many of them were redundant and asked (and were answered) about extending the 'pay by the month' plan. Not really a complaint or a comment, more a 'we want Disney sooooo bad, please let us use the payment plan to make our dreams of a MAGICal Disney vacation come true'.

One post, one answer would have sufficed.

But you had the same question, asked multiple times and ways. Each answered.

Then, you had the select posts like those Leo pulled from the blog. I must say they sound an awful lot like what a publicist might write when at a meeting where the task at hand was to 'criticize' the price increase from a guest's perspective.

I've read far too many press releases. Hell, I've written some. I know the style.

Take #21. "This was totally unexpected to me! Price increases usually occur in August…" Really? You could see a guest writing this? Down to the punctuation...?

Um ... ah ... yeah ... uhh ... call me (yet) again, a conspiracy theory guy, but those comments culled for a very controversial move were largely of a highly suspect nature. That's not the fan in me, or the theorist. That's the industry guy. I've been involved in similar exercises for major media companies, and ... boy oh boy, Pluto, do many of the 'comments' read like the sample ones an in-house exercise like I have described would deliver. Take a negative and restate in the positive (remember, it's never 'unfortunately' rather it's 'as it turns out').

#25 ... that's pure PR. That's just not feeling like something a fan or guest would write to a company/on a company blog.

#42 ... sounds like utter nonsense. You have a premier pass (the most expensive APs Disney offers in the USA) and will be renewing and have been PLANNING FOR A YEAR for THIS trip ... really? What about ALL the other trips on BOTH coasts you'd be taking IF you had indeed bought said pass? That $250 more has you crying your eyes out? Hey, there are less expensive APs ..

You could go comment by comment, as I think Leo and some others may well have done. Many simply do not add up. They are too corporate. They don't pass the Spirited sniff test.

Don't bother opening your blog to comments if you are either going to rewrite them or make them up to prop the corporate position up.

Again, it is insidious and dangerous. In whatever form it takes. This is beyond bad though.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<It's a shell of what it once was.>>

WDW?

Agreed.

The Disney BRAND?

That too!

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

>>How many of you think/believe/suspect/or wouldn't put it past them that Disney's Social Media Dept actually makes up some of the comments on its own site (both positive and negative) to frame issues in a certain light that corporate desires?

Seriously. Thoughts?<<

<<They do it on other sites, so why not do it on their own?>>

I dunno.

That's why I asked. But not many folks have answered thus far.

I almost wonder if it would be worth starting a new thread on it because I think if folks aren't following this thread, they are not gonna check in now because it has grown so large (like a typical WDW guest!) they may not wanna wade thru pages.

But the discussion is still happening here too ... so ...

 

Originally Posted By RoadTrip

<<What does Maryjoewana smell like?>>

It smells like teen(aged) Spirit!

;-)

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<As a famous TV character once said, (again, people under 35 probably don't know who I'm talking about, but should)>>

<<People in Germany don't know who you are talking about either...>>

That's to be expected. Unless you are an expert on American TV from the 50s and 60s!

<<Just a quick question here before heading to dinner ... but it came to mind when reading Leo's comments about the 'comments' left on The Disney Parks Blog on the thread regarding the increase in ticket prices this week:

How many of you think/believe/suspect/or wouldn't put it past them that Disney's Social Media Dept actually makes up some of the comments on its own site (both positive and negative) to frame issues in a certain light that corporate desires?>>

<<In a way, I guess I am a bit too naive and think that would take micro-managing too far. So I don't really suspect them of doing that.>>

Oh, I do. But that won't surprise many folks here. I'm more interested in what people like yourself think ...

<<But then there was something in the 2010 ticket price increase discussion which had surprised me. As I had pointed out on that other thread both in 2010 and in 2011 there are negative comments on the official blog about the price increase. In the 2010 discussion (<a href="http://disneyparks.disney.go.c...comments" target="_blank">http://disneyparks.disney.go.c...comments</a>) in post 62 there is the following comment:>>

<<Mr. Smith, it seems your answers are very short, and more importatnly, it seems you do not answer to questions such as…”why are the prices going up with the economy the way it is?”
I too love Disneyland, and go there with my nephews a few times a year, however it is already very expensive just for tickets alone, not including the food you have to buy in the park, which we all know is way over priced. I understand you get what you pay for, the park is very clean, the staff is awesome and friendly and very personable, and not to mention the bands and the charcters walking around for the kids, but come on. As many have stated above this will definitely affect future disneyland trips for myself as well as my family and families all across the U.S.
So with that being said, can you finally answer? Why are the prices going up….again? Since they are going up, can you look at lowering food expenses in the parks, so the general public can afford a little more?>>

<<No official answer to the post - even though the blog has the ability for official answers and they happen. But then in post 76 we read this:>>

Of course not.

Just like the only way you'll ever see a Social Media official wade in here is if they're about to lose their job (and some just might when things are all said and done) and they lose control (go ahead, guys ... you'll feel so much better!) Sorry for interrupting a very interesting point, Bolna!


<<I’ve noticed many of the questions that are on here are asking “why raise the prices in this economy?” I’m certainly not a representative in anyway for Disney, but since no reponses have been posted yet… I might as well say something.

Just because this is Disney doesn’t mean they are immune to the recession. Quite frankly, if you can’t afford to go to the parks or you simply do not want to pay that much, then here’s the solution: don’t go. There are plenty of other people, such as myself, that would enjoy fewer people in the parks [means less time waiting for Indiana Jones ] To be fair… the one day tickets have only been raised a few dollars for the DLR. If you really, REALLY need to visit the parks then settle for one day. One day, two day, three day, its still Disneyland, there are still plenty of memories to be had.

Or if you prefer second hand parks such as Universal Studios, who are not nearly as clean, friendly, entertaining or family friendly as Disney then go there instead. There are only 2 main rides at Universal Studios Hollywood that are worth going for: The Mummy, and Jurassic Park, while there are 30+ attractions at Disneyland alone (excluding CA Adventure). I can assure the difference between Disney and the others will become very clear the minute you enter the gates.

If it were any other company but Disney I’d agree that the prices are getting way up there, but Disney has the highest standards across the world, it might be worth it to pay a little extra to enjoy the magic that makes it DISNEY.>>

<<Wow - and then there are quite a few people wholeheartedly agreeing with this. There are some topics in this post which makes it sound unofficial (like the advice not to go to DL), it also sounds a bit like what the company might want to say in an unofficial way. Perhaps they just were very lucky with a fan sending this in, but there is a small doubt about that.>>

I can only say I've been in corporate sessions (non-Disney) as I stated and companies role play to 'act' like they believe their consumers will react to whatever they are about to do. The post above nails many of what Social Media would consider fan talking points.

1.) The I'm not Disney, but since I love the company so much and want to help my fellow fan ... I'll answer;
2.) Can't afford it, don't come ='s less of a wait for my favorite attraction;
3.) Only small rise in one-day tickets, which the vast majority of people don't buy because they are the WORST value, so just go for a day. You get your pixie dust and Disney makes a bundle off your family;
4.) Drop a few grammar mistakes/typos in for good measure (although this may also be plain old bad writing, no matter whether it came from a PR pro);
5.) Drop in a completely harmless error (in this case DL having 30 attractions when it has closer to 60) that if ever called on, makes Disney look even better;
6.) Position an attack on the competition (in this case, UNI-Hollywood) while not mentioning ALSO that it is a far less pricey option;
7.) Final (and most important) point: If anyone else BUT Disney raises prices, then you might have a point. But Disney is so special, so MAGICal that they don't exist in the real world. Besides, they ARE simply the best.

That is EXACTLY the type of post that would be planted on a site. It hits and nails all the points needed.

<<As I pointed out in that other thread there appear to be about 20% negative comments in 2010 and in 2011. I am not sure about them making up comments. But I am very sure that there is a reason for which comments appear and which don't - and that the 20% is the quota set for negative comments on unpopular issues which they have to cover.>>

20% is a very important number (actually 19%, but I'm not going to go into all the reasons right now) for many things Disney does from discounts to what it feels it can add to food costs. I am quite sure you have stumbled (or reasoned would be more accurate) across the rationale and ration for pro to con comments on Disney's official site.

 

Originally Posted By Spirit of 74

<<You can't even imagine the restraint I've used to keep from going on a tangent on some of these post.>>

I just assumed Winky had been using the computer for fetish towel animal sites!

<<If Burbank worries about articles like you posted, I think they need to join the author in the park for a toke or two.>>

They ALWAYS worry about their image. This IS Disney. And the NY Times, a shell of what it was 20 years ago, is still the NY Times. People read it. Especially powerbrokers.

Oh, and not that they're powerbrokers, but apparently (as it was conveyed to me today) the story was actually posted to the DISBOARDS (more pixie dust than even MAGIC by a great deal) almost immediately with people calling for arrests and bannings (not talking about Lou Mongello's tours here). And that site is most definitely not filled with Times regular readers.

It's all about losing control of the message. That's what makes the messenger so important, something not lost on all these podcasters and bloggers as they constantly tweak and Tweet their online images.