Originally Posted By oc_dean >>Yes, but given the different ownership structure it is pretty irrelevant to compare the two.<< In what way is it irrelevant?
Originally Posted By RoadTrip Disney didn't fund TDL or TDS. Oriental Land Company did. They are a consortium of three largely privately held companies, specializing in leisure, tourism and land development. OLC pays Disney for character and likeness licenses, and leased the Imagineers to design and build the parks. Disney had very little (if any) of its own cash involved. On the other hand, Disney is a widely held conglomerate having to answer to shareholders who's main concern is return on investment. If some super-rich person wanted to give Disney a blank check to develop a Theme Park exceeding any other I am sure they would be glad to comply. Not sure though that Disney would want to give up ownership of a U.S. Park.
Originally Posted By oc_dean Well that's a bit sad is it not? Only some rich conglomerate other than Disney (OLC) will build something that will exceed expectations. If that's suppose to be "Responsible Corporate Stratedy" ... then Corporate America is f.... ffff ..... You get what I'm saying! :/
Originally Posted By FerretAfros Low ambition = low risk = low reward potential And people wonder why so many huge companies have had trouble in the last 5-10 years. Seems pretty obvious when you think about it...
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "Even with peak crowds, it's rare to see the E-ticket waits above 75 minutes, and there are plenty of 'lesser' attractions that never go over 30 minutes" True, but I'm not keen to ride the carousel or the canoes or Tarzan's Treehouse when I'm just there for a day. Remember you have a whole different perspective when DLR isn't in your backyard, and I live far enough away that I can't easily visit every day, week, or month like you did when you lived in Southern California. On a short visit I want to hit as many headline attractions, shows, and parades as possible. I had an opportunity to visit Disneyland when I was in Anaheim on business recently and I decided not to go. I figured it just wouldn't be worth it due in part to the short amount of time I had available and reports I heard about the massive crowds. I really don't enjoy paying full price for a short one day visit when the place is overrun with people.
Originally Posted By trekkeruss "Low ambition = low risk = low reward potential" I think Disney was swayed to take a more measured approach after they took the high ambition route with DLP and found that the reward was more difficult to come by than they had imagin(eer)d.
Originally Posted By FerretAfros >>Remember you have a whole different perspective when DLR isn't in your backyard...<< That's very true, but all of my DLR visits in recent years have been during peak holiday crowds (typically Labor Day, Thanksgiving, and Christmas) and I've managed just fine. It takes some strategy, but if you can commit 8-10 hours for park time I think most people could have a reasonably successful day even in the worst conditions. If you can only go on a Friday evening, then I don't think it would be worth the hassle and price >>I think Disney was swayed to take a more measured approach after they took the high ambition route with DLP and found that the reward was more difficult to come by than they had imagin(eer)d.<< That's true, and the small park strategy was only reinforced by the successes they had with MGM and DAK (though it could be argued that they both benefitted by not being a 1st or 2nd gate). The majority of DLP's financial problems were due to overbuilding the hotels and having unrealistic expectations of the park. Even in its first year, DLP was the highest attended tourist attraction on the continent; it's hard to imagine a realistic business plan that needed significantly more guests than what they got, considering the other factors at play I'm hopeful that they've learned their lesson and the park in Shanghai will be built a little more like DLP and less like HKDL
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt If you can only go on a Friday evening, then I don't think it would be worth the hassle and price." Which is basically what it boiled down to on my last visit. The conference I attended ended on Thursday night, and by the time I ate and got checked out on Friday it was after 10:00am, which means I wouldn't have walked through the gates until nearly 11:00. It was either go to DL (alone) and battle the late morning crowds for $100 or head up to Santa Monica and get my weekend started by hanging out with my friends at the beach. It was a tough decision, but I chose to skip DL and save it for another time.
Originally Posted By monorailblue If you ever only go for an evening, you can't expect to get a lot done. I also have frequently questioned friends who tell me that they didn't go because it would be worth a whole day to do 5 or 6 rides (or similar). In my view, that's absurd. It is easy to avoid the 10 busiest days of the year. Every other day, if you go with me and we arrive within 30 minutes of opening (before or after, you pick) and stay until at least closing or 10:00 p.m. (whichever is later), I guarantee you an amazing day of at least 20 rides. Will it work if we get there at 10:00 a.m., spend an hour having breakfast, and shop for 2 hours in the afternoon? Of course not. But if you want it to happen, are willing to manage your day sensibly, and talk to people who know what they are doing, it is going to happen.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt I don't think I've ever been to any theme park on Earth and ridden 20 rides in a single day, and I've spent an entire day at DL from opening to close in the summer on several occasions. Maybe I have done, but I don't think so. I guess I'm not one of those people who likes approaching the parks as if I'm going to war. There's nothing appealing about that to me.
Originally Posted By berol I used to do a regular 30+ from lazily wandering all day. I avoided summer and hopped on any attraction with a short wait. Donald's boat and chip/dale's treehouse were an easy 2.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip I think my all time record is 14 rides at WDW's MK. I guess I'm just too picky. I have to actually be interested in an attraction to ride it.
Originally Posted By Dr Hans Reinhardt "I think my all time record is 14 rides at WDW's MK. I guess I'm just too picky." Me too. I think I did Donald's Boat at DL's Toontown back when it first opened and I haven't been since.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip My attractions list it pretty well set for WDW. Always do: Pirates Big Thunder Haunted Mansion Small World Peter Pan Pooh People Mover Carousel of Progress Buzz Lightyear Sometimes do: Jungle Cruise Tiki Room Country Bears Hall of Presidents Mickey's Philharmagic Space Mountain Laugh Floor If I can hit my nine "Always do's" during a 10 hour visit I consider it a successful day. At 62, 10 hours in a park is about all I want. When I was at WDW last fall FP+ was unavailable for the Mine Train. I should have logged in when the window first opened for hotel guests but I missed it by a day or two. The standby line was about two hours and I don't wait that long for anything. I will try it in the future.
Originally Posted By monorailblue Of course, to each her/his own. But I take my kids, walk through Sleeping Beauty Castle, and do 10 Attractions before even reaching the Matterhorn. OK, so I do that without my kids, too. My must-do is just keeping doing. It is far too costly to do too little. That said, I generally always skip: Astro Orbiter, Pirate's Lair at Tom Sawyer's Island, Columbia, Davy Crockett's Explorer Canoes, all Toontown rides and all MS vehicles. But I generally do pretty much every other ride, if possible. WDW isn't a great comparison because Disneyland + DCA = more rides than MK + Epcot + DHS + AK combined . . . so visitors should be doing many more.
Originally Posted By monorailblue Look at it from a Westside route if you prefer: Jungle, Indy, Pirates, Mansion, Splash, Pooh, Twain, Thunder. That's already 8. No one can get to the park anywhere near opening and not be able to do all of those before early afternoon 95% of the year. (Use of Splash FP may push that to later in the day, but will eliminate most waiting.) When you've done those 8, wander back to NOS and take the RR back to MS and go. That's 9, and it definitely did not take all day.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip Oops... I forgot the Railroad. I always do that also. I guess at times I consider it transportation (like the monorail at WDW) rather than an attraction.
Originally Posted By CuriousConstance When we go for five days at a time, I have to ride Pirates every day. And usually Haunted Mansion, and Splash Mountain daily if at all possible too. A trip without multiple Pirate rides just isn't a complete experience for me. Same with HM and Splash to slightly lesser degrees. Getting on Pirates is a near zen like experience for me. I just like to sit there and take in the sights, sounds, and smells.
