Originally Posted By SeventyOne <<I just flat out don't agree with your last argument, SeventyOne. Anyone going to WDW for the first time is going to be totally blown away by the place. They're not going to see any of the things that regulars here complain about. They're not going to care that the MK is light on new E ticket attractions. They're just going to be amazed that there is so much more to do than at their local Six Flags. >> <And I flat out disagree with the above. Or some of it. I do think many first-timers will visit the Walmarted WDW of 2011 and absolutely be blown away by all of it. BUT ... I also think there's a significant amount of first-timers who visit and find it overpriced, crowded,poorly maintained, staffed by unhappy and/or clueless CMs and truly not only aren't happy, but come out disliking the place and vowing to never return.> Sort of inherent in my thinking was--given DCL and DVC prices--the "refusers" at issue aren't Six Flags loyalists or something. I assume they're experienced travelers used to high-end accommodations, like on DCL. They aren't going to find that at WDW's 3-star hotels (even the one THEMED as a 5-star) or post-DDP restaurants (a handful of signature places excepted). I have a friend who runs a VIP tour company in town. He tries to steer clients away from WDW resorts because he knows they won't meet their needs (generally to the JW or Ritz, if you were curious). Throw in the relative disrepair of the parks and crowds as compared to the ships, and yes, disappointment. (The Spirit already said it better, but just trying to clarify what I meant initially).
Originally Posted By Tony C <<Honestly? You've never encountered anything overpriced at WDW? You must be made of money, man.>> Well despite some here who are regulars a WDW vacation is something most people save up for a few years. Which is why I only go every five years or so. I'm not due back for another two years. And I've already spent money to go there, the prices really aren't that big a shock. <<Not to mention you've never witnessed poor maintenance at the parks? I guess you've never ridden Everest or 99% of the other attractions that have broken effects.>> Last time I rode Everest was 2006, the effects were just fine. As for the other attractions I'm sure a few had a glitch here and there but nothing I remember as being noticeable.
Originally Posted By DlandDug I think we're in a classic "glass half empty/glass half full" argument here...
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom <<Not to mention you've never witnessed poor maintenance at the parks? I guess you've never ridden Everest or 99% of the other attractions that have broken effects.>> I guess if your a first timer and didn't know that the Yeti was suppose to move then you wouldn't realize it was broken. But how could you not notice the limited selection of menu choices and prices of food on property. I know I'm not the only ones who believes that on property food is expensive, with the Disney refillable mug wars going on!
Originally Posted By SeventyOne <I think we're in a classic "glass half empty/glass half full" argument here...> But the crowd we're talking about are used to full glasses.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> Last time I rode Everest was 2006, the effects were just fine. As for the other attractions I'm sure a few had a glitch here and there but nothing I remember as being noticeable. << Must've been within the first few months of operation, because Yeti's been on the fritz for most of its lifespan. >> Well despite some here who are regulars a WDW vacation is something most people save up for a few years. Which is why I only go every five years or so. I'm not due back for another two years. And I've already spent money to go there, the prices really aren't that big a shock. << The prices aren't necessarily a shock, because I expect Disney to be outrageously priced. Thank Eisner for that. But that doesn't mean the place isn't still overpriced.
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom <<I think we're in a classic "glass half empty/glass half full" argument here...>> I disagree, when we practically have a daily update on fan sites of just how many figures on It's a Small World are not functioning. Not to mention pop culture's impact on today's society reminding us that things many not be just right at the Magic Kingdom. <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KC5zts4ZsGo" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...zts4ZsGo</a> It's pretty cut and dry that things are lacking at WDW. First off as you drive onto the property and see contruction "everywhere" with DVCs, upscale houses, new hotels. Then you get to say DHS and either way you look at DHS is either half empty or half full.
Originally Posted By Tony C <<But that doesn't mean the place isn't still overpriced. >> Very few things are these days.
Originally Posted By Tony C <<But how could you not notice the limited selection of menu choices and prices of food on property.>> Again it's part of the deal.
Originally Posted By HokieSkipper <<Again it's part of the deal. >> No, it's not. Nor was it always "part of the deal". The menus have been getting better recently, but they still aren't what they used to be. And that's not okay, nor is it "part of the deal". Especially when Disney says it strives to be better than the rest.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <<Honestly? You've never encountered anything overpriced at WDW? You must be made of money, man.>> -- a lot of this depends on where on elives. I hear it all the time here beause although expensive, the restaurants at WDW don't shoick me because I'm used to it in Chicago. If one is coming from bums rush Iowa then yes, sticker shock my kill tem- but if you live in one of the nicer burbs- or visit downtowns a lot in Chicago / New York, Boston etc-- prices are very similar-- even if yes they're risen qa lot recently-- so have the places by me. I have printed menu's at the places I frequent in my town as well as Downtown Chicago before- really no difference. doesn't make one made of money- makes us numb. I have been paying over $4.20 a gallon now for over 2 months-- $4.60 for premium for my car.. in some places that's a crap load more than they are paying--
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom This is my experience around eating at in the parks. It use to be that you could always find a sit down restaurant in any of the parks. Sure you might have to wait a while ( under an hour ). But, for the past several years, because of the meal plan if you don't have reservations it's virtually impossible to get into a sit down restaurant. It's gotten so bad that on my most recent trip October of 2009 the Liberty Tree Tavern posted a hand written sign on an 8 X 11 white sheet of paper out in front that they were fully reserved that day for lunch and dinner. I had never, ever seen that before at a Disney restaurant. Sure they get fully booked but typically you walk up to ask if you can have a table and the receptionist would kindly inform you that they were fully booked.
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom <<a lot of this depends on where on elives>> Agreed! But where ever it is your driving in from you can't help but see that prices of gasoline off property and then see how much it costs at the Hess station on property (like crossroads). And if you venture off property you see the same franchises as back at home advertising prices for burgers, whatever. The price difference begins the minute you get off property. It becomes very apparent that Disney charges more for everything. This is very different than Chicago, New York City or Boston. There is no good explaination as to why McDonald's french fries cost more on Disney property as apposed to at a McDonald's off property.
Originally Posted By leobloom >> a lot of this depends on where on elives. I hear it all the time here beause although expensive, the restaurants at WDW don't shoick me because I'm used to it in Chicago. If one is coming from bums rush Iowa then yes, sticker shock my kill tem- but if you live in one of the nicer burbs- or visit downtowns a lot in Chicago / New York, Boston etc-- prices are very similar-- even if yes they're risen qa lot recently-- so have the places by me. I have printed menu's at the places I frequent in my town as well as Downtown Chicago before- really no difference. << Actually, I'm not talking about just the food being overpriced. I'm talking about everything: tickets, parking, food, additional ticketed events, etc. And I've lived in big cities my entire life and eaten at nice restaurants, too. But, frankly, I expect a gourmet restaurant to be expensive because, presumably, the food is special. It's worth it. The food at Disney's theme parks is not special, for the most part. And that's why I think the food pricing is outrageous. Not because a $100 meal is unreasonable, but because of what you're getting for that money.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 This is very different than Chicago, New York City or Boston. ----- sorry yo disagree but I can tell you McDonalds charges more downtown Chicago than other places. The restaurant prices are not set across all restaurants. ( My wife worked for McD Corporate HQ for almost 20 years and I could give you chapter and verse as to why ) - a Big Mac in downtown Chicago at times was 50 cents more than the McD a few blocks from my house. Why? a qucik few ( and I can give you as many as you like)- rents are not the same verywhere, most McD's are franchisees and they can charge what they want within reason - they can run promotions or not ( they pay for them) - different costs of doing business and yes also what they CAN charge to be in line with other stores around them. BP gasoline ( what I use most since I use a card and pay each month) is significantly more in downtown Chicago than 5 miles west of there for instance. Some of that is taxing differences- some of that is because again they can charge what they like. Downtown CHicago you can expect to be paying almost $5/gallon right now vs. $4.30-$4.40 most stations here). Park you car downtown Chicago $24/day pretty average -- go west 3 miles to the UIC campus and it's $12-$15. So you may say there's no good reason for the price differences at McD's-- that exists by me also--and I'll bet if you drive around Atlanta you'll find some differences as well..maybe not as much since 'downtown' is not as well defined as in the cities I mentioned..but still differences. He's the real kicker- most McD franchisees own large multiples 50-75 and more stores -- and they do not charge the same at their own stores either. They tend to charge what the market will bear.
Originally Posted By Bolna <<Well despite some here who are regulars a WDW vacation is something most people save up for a few years. Which is why I only go every five years or so. I'm not due back for another two years. And I've already spent money to go there, the prices really aren't that big a shock.>> I like to splurge a bit when I am on vacation as well. But especially when I go on a vacation that I can't afford on a regular basis, I still want to get value for my money. I think the question is not whether there are high prices at WDW, but whether what you get for the money justifies the price. It always amazes me what people are prepared to pay for certain things, the last example is the Wild Africa Trek. It does sound like a lovely experience, but is it really worth $189 for three hours? There appear to be enough people who just willingly pay what ever Disney asks. But I think that there will be plenty who don't see the value and will be put off by constantly paying too much for what they get.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 Not because a $100 meal is unreasonable, but because of what you're getting for that money. ----------------------------- ---- I might agree if you take that one restaurant at a time--I contend some of them are 'special' expecially compared to chains or standard restaurants etc. And $100 meal at a 'gourmet' restaurant- not here in Chicago I can tell you-- at a nice restaurant yes, the gourment restaurants -- and the 'special' ones- quite a bit more. sit down at Charlie Trotters and it will cost you upwards of $160 per for an evening. Hell here it's easy to drop $35 at Olive Garden for a decent entree and either an appetizer or desert and maybe a coke. $12-$13 burgers all the rage right now-- - here's a place was just on DDD show on food network -- -<a href="http://www.kumascorner.com/food" target="_blank">http://www.kumascorner.com/food</a> there are dozens and dozens of these. Yeah the burgers are good but geez Louise it's becomoing the Norm. 2 ex- McD execs opening a chain of their own- just started here- same thing $10 burgers...burgers. <a href="http://www.tomandeddies.com/index.php" target="_blank">http://www.tomandeddies.com/index.php</a> this is now the norm here at most pub food places-- last time family of four to Outback - bill $140 before tip- one beer each adult. What is Todd English charging at Blue Zoo ? That is not Disney owned... expensive for FLorida- you bet. Worth it ? not to everyone- agree but out of line with other places of interest-- not anywhere near what is being portrayed... now I'm not happy it is as expensive as it is-- don't mistake my comments for that -- but I am used to it -- one day when I move somewhere cheaper I may find myself on the other side of this argument.
Originally Posted By Bolna <<Any Disney fan who travels to Paris and doesn't spend at least a day at DLP is doing themselves a great diservice. It's akin to folks who don't visit DL (or WDW for that matter) because they've been to the other. If you're not a Disney nut, then that's fine. But you wouldn't be here if that were the case (none of us would) so the rulez be different for us!>> I don't think your comparison really works, I still think that if you travel to a foreign country, it makes no sense to seek out the stuff that is a transplant from your own culture. Might be that I am a bit sensitive about this since I can regularly watch the long line of American tourists at the Starbucks in my German hometown buying muffins and American style sandwiches instead of going to the bakery right next door which offers German cakes and sandwiches. Therefore I really like the sentiment of rather wanting to experience France. So you can't compare not seeing DLP while in France with not traveling to DL. However, DLP is really a wonderful place and I would encourage everyone to go there if they are Disney fans! And if you are a fan and get into the back stories of the park, there is a lot of European specific things to find as well, so it isn't just an American park which landed in France...
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<Honestly? You've never encountered anything overpriced at WDW? You must be made of money, man.>> What everyone forgets is that WDW is an ENTERTAINMENT VENUE. Instead of comparing prices to your local Denny's compare prices to what you pay at a major league ballpark or concert venue. At WDW $20 buys me a pretty decent meal at a sit down restaurant. At the ballpark $20 buys me a beer, a brat, and a bag of peanuts! Last weekend Ann and I saw Elton John in Springfield. We bought a couple of T-shirts for souvenirs. Cost? $100!! WDW certainly isn't cheap, but it could be a helluva lot worse.
Originally Posted By RoadTrip <<I guess you've never ridden Everest or 99% of the other attractions that have broken effects.>> If you're a first timer, how are you going to know that there was ever something other than Disco Yeti at EE?
