Originally Posted By barboy TS was taken from: ""I would take 15% of the tables at all TS restaurants"" so that wouldn't make much sense unless he was talking about pulling 15% of tables from a sitdown joint or maybe it was just a redundancy?
Originally Posted By SuperDry The full quote is: <<< Also I would take 15% of the tables at all TS restaurants for walk up or at least same day reservations to bump up the potential additional revenue to the DDP users. >>> I think what he's saying is that they could set aside 15% of the tables at table-service restaurants that could not be reserved in advance. This way, not every table in every restaurant during free DDP times is taken up with DDP users - there would still be some room for people that walk up and pay the menu price.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< And longer hrs. don't significantly get more guests to come. Most don't care or at the very least don't let shorter hrs. affect their decision to show up or not. Remember guests(**genereally**) unlike at the other 4 destinations are on vacation and they view time differently than the single day visitor. Hrs. should be shaved off to save on operating costs. >>> I have to disagree with you there barboy. You say "longer hrs. don't significantly get more guests to come." I'm not sure if you mean to a particular park on a particular day or to the resort as a whole. In my experience, EMH most definitely affect park attendance. The MK in particular is most packed on the day when it has evening EMH. I agree with you in that EMH probably does not affect many people's decision as to whether or not to take a vacation to WDW. But all of the above misses an important point. Remember that until a few years ago, instead of EMH, they had hard-ticket "E-ride nights" or something like that, where you paid extra to stay in a certain park. They did away with that and replaced it with the "free" EMH. Now that doesn't sound very Disney to me, now does it - change something that they used to charge for and make it free? It doesn't make much sense until you fill in the final piece: Since attendance was limited for E-ride nights (that was the selling point in fact) and it was an extra cost, it would affect only those people willing to pay extra, and only up to the limited attendance number. It certainly was extra, easily-measured revenue. But when you consider how it's run now, EMH is open to ALL on-property guests, but only those guests. So, even if you really want to use EMH only once or twice during your week-long WDW vacation, it forces you to stay on-site, very likely for your entire stay. Especially as the quality of the on-site resorts continues to slip and good off-site options continue to become available very close, the value proposition of the on-site resorts really needs these "can't be purchased by off-site guests at any price" features in order to make them special. I would guess that Disney thinks the extra on-site nights they get from EMH far exceed the costs of the extra hours.
Originally Posted By barboy WDW will be hit far worse than the other 4 destinations and I won't be surprised if it will take some very bold steps to stay afloat. WDW is particularly vulnerable due to its vast setup, countless rooms and a relatively small host city. Here is what WDW should do if things become dire: concentrate resources on (1)the parks followed by (2)select hotels---7 Seas Lagoon and Epcot stays--- and then (3) golf course(as in one). Let weeds grow and the crocodilians, Eastern coral snakes and frogs take over the Wide World of Sports, Fantasia mini golf, Downtown Disney and the residual hotels and courses.
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< in recession you would suggest luxury? Do I really have to say this.....the days of Porshe, cosmetic surgery and caviar are over for the foreseeable future. dave, there is no market >>> I think you underestimate the number of people out there that still have money. They may be a tiny percentage of WDW guests, but given that that's the case, there probably is a market for special experiences for them that might be on the scale of $200-400 for a day or full evening. Prior to the economic problems, weren't they considering a 5th gate that would operate permanently on that type of pricing model? Even though that's off the table now, I suspect that providing something special on a reduced scale and with mostly existing facilities would still find a market.
Originally Posted By barboy ///You say "longer hrs. don't significantly get more guests to come./// Yes, I believe that. ///I'm not sure if you mean to a particular park on a particular day or to the resort as a whole./// --to WDW as a whole. The hrs. have absolutely nothing to do with(again, generally speaking) getting a family to come from Chicago, London or Sao Paulo; they would come whether a park hrs. were 10am to 6 pm or 8am to 12 midnight. ///In my experience, EMH most definitely affect park attendance.// You bet!
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< //I'm not sure if you mean to a particular park on a particular day or to the resort as a whole./// --to WDW as a whole. The hrs. have absolutely nothing to do with(again, generally speaking) getting a family to come from Chicago, London or Sao Paulo; they would come whether a park hrs. were 10am to 6 pm or 8am to 12 midnight. >>> We're definitely in agreement here, but I'll repeat what I said before: EMH may not affect whether guests come, but it encourages them to stay on property.
Originally Posted By barboy ///EMH may not affect whether guests come, but it encourages them to stay on property./// Absolutely.....and that policy(early entry) has roped me in when I was on the fence 3 times whether to 'slum it' in $45 room out in Lake Buena Vista vs. living high on the hog at Beach Club.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>I think what he's saying is that they could set aside 15% of the tables at table-service restaurants that could not be reserved in advance. This way, not every table in every restaurant during free DDP times is taken up with DDP users - there would still be some room for people that walk up and pay the menu price.<< Here's the winner, that is exactly what I meant. Also, the PM means evening. And for the Limo, there is only an admin cost for Disney, so why not try it. When we went to California earlier this year, a limo was actually cheaper (as well as being easier) for my family of 4 than a shared shuttle bus. If Disney charges for DME to help offset the cost, this offers a choice. And there is always a market for luxury for special occasions (honeymooners, graduates etc.) There is no degradation of service, and marginal operating/marketing costs for this service. In my 14 years of efficiency/effectiveness advisory work, I have learnt that salami slicing (or pure cuts) means eventually a failure of service delivery. You have to change things and offer options, and that is what I have put together in this package of changes.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo >>>--to WDW as a whole. The hrs. have absolutely nothing to do with(again, generally speaking) getting a family to come from Chicago, London or Sao Paulo; they would come whether a park hrs. were 10am to 6 pm or 8am to 12 midnight<<< Actually they do. When we go to the US, we love early mornings because with kids, those first couple of days, they get up at 3 or 4 in the morning (if we are lucky, because in Florida, it feels like 8 or 9 am then, and in DL, more like 11am and noon), and they find the evenings nearly impossible until about the last couple of days of a 2 week vacation. And west coasters like the late nights. In the UK, New York and Vegas are very popular because people do not need to change their natural schedules when they travel around the globe, so I think extended hours either side can and do make a difference.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Also, if traveling internationally and you see WDW offers park hours of 10-6 (like DLP sometimes does) or DL offers 9-midnight, I think many of us would opt for DL giving us greater flexibility. Ok a small percentage of the population given the number of rubes who never consider anything other than WDW, but again it can make a difference.
Originally Posted By vbdad55 <But heck... I do appreciate that you kept the inevitable slam at DVC very subtle< I think an anti DVC paragraph is stored ineach and every doc for whatever reason, just in case one spirit might forget. We have worn on himover the years and he is less brutal on DVC than a few years ago though- you are right. I agree 100% with Trippy in that putting them on commision will then create the sales atmosphere you fear ( maybe that is the reason to do it ?)- Today that atmosphere does not exist. As for why pay them to sell ? Well how about the fact that since this is supposed to be a business model to reduce 25% of expenses - there is more than one way to change the dynamics. Oneis increase the revenue portion of the model. What other 'overhead' employees ( and I use that term endearingly since my entire team I manage is overhead and I constantly have to prove net worth for them-and me ) - bringsin revenue ? Removing revenue additions from a business model facing a recessionary period just not a good decision. While I agree there likely can be less the sales team- they are bottom line contributors today. btw- sidenote:attended Woodfield Malls ( Schaumburg IL)- Doorway to Dreams Disney store this weekend for my free member ornament - as well as to view the models of the Bay Lake units -- studio & one bedroom units. They are really nice ( and I'mnot a Contempfan) - and very high quality materials throughout - continues to improve if anything. Told 20% will have MK view.....can add on 50 points today- but has to be 100 or more after January 1 I know I have anaversion to clowns - just find them creepy -- Spiritobviosuly has the same for DVC costumes.. ;-)
Originally Posted By barboy I'm still having a hard time with this luxury plan of limos and charaters during mass layoff, foreclosure and stock meltdown days; if a setup like that lacked demand when everyone was dropping money left and right on swimming pools in the backyard, Porshe 911's in the garage and stainless steel/granite in the kitchen as well as trips to Tahiti why on earth would there be a demand in deep recessionary times? And SuperD I haven't disregarded your stance that still a small percentage have cash to drop--- it's just that the world should concentrate on why the masses show up: parks 90%, hotels/resorts 5%, golf and misc. 5%(no science, just my basic assessments). WDW needs to stick to the knitting if and when times really get rough. The truth is WDW runs a very real risk of denaturing like some unhealthy protein--- we may not recognize it in the near future. WDW's sheer size and cartographical position will be enough to seriously denature it if the aggregate economy turns even worse.
Originally Posted By barboy And dave you may not realize this but we represent perhaps the biggest anomaly among Disney themepark goers. People like us are not indicative of the WDW guest since we anatomize, analyze and theorize all things related to disney parks. If you think that any real percentage of travelers to the 'World' have park hrs. on their minds and it affects their decision to show up then I think you're gravely mistaken. The LP crowd is already more die-hard/fanatical than the vast majority of WDW vacationers and you are more die-hard/fanatical than the vast majority of LPer's.
Originally Posted By barboy ///Someone in another thread mentioned closing one park a day during the week./// If things get too economically crazy there had better be more closings than that.
Originally Posted By barboy ///Those business class januts and hotel stays and meals on the Chase Visa add up./// And that is one exceptionally admirable quality with Walmart..... I watched CEO Scott on TV tell us he stays in $49 rooms when he travels for Walmart; and he also rooms with another corporate officer to save his company money. See Spirit some Walmarting could do Disney some good.
Originally Posted By barboy ///At least in the U.S. when you move into upper income groups people generally kind of roll their eyes and look down their noses when you mention that you enjoy the Disney Parks./// I've seen that scenario several times. People just don't associate Disney vacations with high end/luxury/exclusivity. They associate Disney vacations with childish fun(and they view adults who 'do Disney' without children as those who are immature).
Originally Posted By trekkeruss <<I'm still having a hard time with this luxury plan of limos and charaters during mass layoff, foreclosure and stock meltdown days; if a setup like that lacked demand when everyone was dropping money left and right on swimming pools in the backyard, Porshe 911's in the garage and stainless steel/granite in the kitchen as well as trips to Tahiti why on earth would there be a demand in deep recessionary times?>> High-end services are already offered at WDW, but they are not widely advertised. I suppose Disney could be more aggressive in promoting these services, but I don't know if they would make that big a difference to the bottom line. There has to be a multi=pronged approach to generating business, not just one idea.
Originally Posted By -em >>I watched CEO Scott on TV tell us he stays in $49 rooms when he travels for Walmart; and he also rooms with another corporate officer to save his company money.<< Yeah that so didnt happen when they came to my hotel (not even the CEO- just higher ups)... Their rate was a LOT more than that...
