Originally Posted By Bob Paris "they view adults who 'do Disney' without children as those who are immature" I've never understood that. Especially at their prices AND considering that when I came in '01, my Aussie dollar was only buying 50c US(it's almost as bad again now). At THAT price, only an ADULT with serious spending ability could afford a seven week trip to the US. Couple that with, I think people who bring children or even worse, small toddlers to WDW are masochists. Even worse they are sadists because other people around them have to put up with the screaming and whining. And sometimes it's even from the kids.
Originally Posted By barboy ///Fastpass is a revenue EARNER, and a very cheap one at that./// You know X, word has it that FP has not really helped Disney sell their ice-creams, pins and shirts like Disney had hoped--- only relaying just what I read and I forgot from where my source came. Has anyone else heard about this?
Originally Posted By Mr X Could be, Barboy. That being the case though, it was certainly the REASON they put it out there in the first place. Not sure if that makes too much sense though (not saying you're wrong though), even personally I can recall many times where I have bought snacks, at least, in the 10-15 minutes before a fastpass was available. Maybe it's just my personal way...I dunno.
Originally Posted By SuperDry Also, it's my understanding that FastPass is wildly popular with guests at large, despite their being a core group of message board people that hate it. It definitely has a hard cost for every attraction every day to operate (mostly extra CM labor to operate the merge point and the FP machines, and in some cases an extra greeter at the entrance). It's certain that this has been looked at as a way to cut costs, and very deliberated been decided against.
Originally Posted By barboy ///That being the case though, it was certainly the REASON they put it out there in the first place./// Absolutely--- Disney thought FP would generate sales in the stores and counter service eats but I don't know if it has increased overall sales or not.
Originally Posted By barboy ///Also, it's my understanding that FastPass is wildly popular with guests at large, despite their being a core group of message board people that hate it./// ---sounds plausible to me but it kind of begs the question 'why'. Why would the hard core Disney clan oppose FP(generally) while the casual Disney follower readily welcomes the system?
Originally Posted By vbdad55 ^^^^^^^^^^^ because they likely feel they're getting something for nothing --perception becomes reality
Originally Posted By SuperDry <<< Why would the hard core Disney clan oppose FP(generally) while the casual Disney follower readily welcomes the system? >>> First of all, I dispute your claim that the hard-core Disney fan generally opposes FP. I think what is true that AP holders that are locals to the park or otherwise regularly visit for partial days despise FP. Before FP, it was easy enough to pop into a park after work, and take in a few E-tickets on most days. These days, standby lines are far longer than they used to be, and long lines last much later into the night than they did before FP, and FPs are all gone by the time a late afternoon or early evening arrival gets there. The same is true of a guest that may only have a morning to visit and then has to leave. The standby lines get much longer much quicker, and even if they get there at opening, they may be able to get and use only 1 FP before having to leave. I think that many people that fit into the above situation have seen a dramatic change in their ability to enjoy the parks, and have worked backward from there to conclude that FP is bad for guests overall.
Originally Posted By Mr X Post 88 for the first time shed light on a frequent message board complaint that I could never quite understand. Thanks.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo The way I know it has had a negative impact was when we were at WDSP this summer. One day, we went in where it was busy and we had a fairly pleasant day. The wait for Crush Coaster was at 1 hour. The wait for Cars was about 20 min. Magic Carpets 10, Tram Tour was 20, Tower of Terror 30min, Rock N Roller Coaster was 20. It was busy, but fun. 2 days later they were running a fast pass trial on Crush. We waited 20 min for a fast pass (time for FP when we got in line was for 10:45) Our fastpass was 3:20 pm and clashed with our reservations for dinner. Stand by for Crush was at 150 min, Cars 45, ToT 90, Tram Tour and hour, RNR Coaster 45. The pavement was mobbed. I had a chat with a cast member friend who stated that attendance was up by only about 10% that day compared to our previous day. It was then my fears were confirmed. Also, queing in a constantly moving queue is fine. FP creates a horrible stop start. And if an attraction goes 101, the FP double up makes it even worse.
Originally Posted By CarolinaDisneyDad >>>>>>>>>>>>Also, it's my understanding that FastPass is wildly popular with guests at large, despite their being a core group of message board people that hate it.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<..............................................................................................................................Count my family in that group. We love fastpass. I can't imagine them not being available. We get there at opening and immediately fastpass our favorite ride then go ride others, fast pass another along the way and do whatever. Without the pass we wouldn't have the freedom shop and eat as much because we would be in lines most of the time. I thought it was funny that in one post someone is complaining about children and in the next about fast pass. Which would you rather have, kids using fastpass or standing in line with you fidgeting, complaining, and fighting? I vote for fastpass. A week standing in lines with kids is not a vacation.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo We do on vacation. We find with little ones, it works out the best. We eat breakfast and then a three course meal with a bottle of wine at about 3. But we live in Europe with 2-3 hr lunches and lunch is the main meal of the day on the continent. Sadly in the UK it is more like the US, but we prefer to live a continental lifestyle where ever possible. Makes bookings for good restaurants in Epcot easy too!
Originally Posted By bobbelee9 ^^^And it gets you out of the hottest part of the day, gives the family a chance to revive itself, and prepare for the rest of the day. Well that's my thinking anyway.
Originally Posted By greatlakes Ok. I have been a long time reader of these forums and this is my first post so please bear with me. I actually come from a theme park management background (non-disney)but will not say how or where as a result of my employer's rules. The discussion in this thread is going on in the hallways and offices of every theme park company in the world right now. No matter what company you work for, there is always an atmosphere of "how can we improve the bottom line"? Therefore, one should note that this was being discussed long before the economy got bad. I have heard suggestions boarder from the mundane (let's change napkin vendors) to the extreme (let's demolish one of our newest multi-million dollar attractions because the maintenance costs outweigh the PR and per-caps we are getting from it). The point that I try to make here is that it's purely a business call. Sentimentalism is never discused unless it can be marginalized or quantified. If the sentimental issue is than, in favor of the economic issue, it will be considered. If it is not, it will be quickly tossed out. Trust me on this, I have been in the room when extremely unpopular ideas have been discussed. Since the sentimental attachment to the attraction in question couldn't be quanitified, the attraction was axed as easily as throwing out a used piece of tissue. Theme parks are a business and the bottom line ALWAYS rules. Although the current economic times may call for drastic measures, don't expect any attractions to dissappear at WDW anytime soon. There are SOOOO many layers to get through before that even begins to come in to mind. I just say this because we need to think of the solution in the minds of a business. Some of the suggestions here are right on cue (charge for Magical Express) but some aren't (do away with fast pass. It's worth too much in terms of PR). With that said, here are my suggestions (and they may surprise some of you). 1) Include a one time addition to the foods and merch divisonal budgets for customer research and product implementation. (it's not a problem of dwindling attendance in the parks. It's lower per-cap spending). 2) Implement a blue-ribbon committe to formulate a list of guest perceptional issues and vow to address them. There are better ways to milk money out of guests and still leave them thinking they got a great deal. It's time to come up with the next dining plan. Although this is a sad suggestion, it is a necessity if the property is to grow again. Concequently, this group should also be charged with evaluating the negatives of these types of existing programs as well. 3) Institute General Electric-style town hall meetings for Cast Members. This is a low-cost gurantee to boost Cast Morale. It would also elicit suggestions from the front-line CM staff. Given the format, suggestions would have to be answered by Team Disney sincerely and in a timely manner. A major CM morale boost alone could boost re-bookings and word of mouth first time bookings. 4) Be the first to NOT offer benifits to new part-time hires. We can thank Universal for this one. During the staffing crisis of the late 90's, Universal offered benifits to part timers. Ths directly effects staffing today. Disney is reluctant to hire new people. Current staffers in some departments are working HUGE amounts of over time because too many part-timers are collecting benifits. This increases fatigue related accidents and costs Disney a FORTUNE in overtime. Next time you see that guy sweeping trash on the midways, think that he could be a ride mechanic picking up extra hours at time and a half. I for one would love to get $45 an hour to sweep. Unfortunately, it's apparently cheaper than hiring new staff. 5)Open up the books to middle managers. Allow Mid-level managers to the same or close to the same financial data Team Disney gets. This opens the floor to ideas and suggestions. Upper management in any company gets stagnant in it's way of thinking and this is a tried and true way to let some fresh air in at the top. 6) Hold upper management accountable for financial AND blue-sky bench marks. Some of the best executives in the industry have set up bonus programs for upper level management if they meet certain financial and operational criteria. The fun lies in the "operational" criteria. It could be as simple as a request to begin work on one new E-ticket for each park. The trick is that the performance of the manager has to be such that their business arm can afford it. The theory is that the mis-management fixes itself. It's also important to note that this CAN backfire as well. 7) Require Team Disney members to take up one weekly front-line shift a year. Get them out of the stuffy office and back to where it counts. This is meant to get the manager listening to the guest and to the front-line CM again. I beleive Matt Omulet (sp?) in DL did this type of thing by getting out in the parks all the time. I have a whole lot more where that came from but at least it's a start.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo greatlakes, I am glad you are posting, nd that's a great first post. I agree with most of the ideas. As for the sentimentality element, I understand where you are coming from, and this is a common issue in all business areas (I run public service improvement businesses and the sae runs true in our sector). That said, I try to run my campaigns and business plans on what I feel is right for the people (something very different than my competitors), and do you know what? I was able to take a nascent business and become the largest provider in the UK within 3 years, with a 79% profitability increase. It can and does work. Sometimes the business case takes loss leaders. Whether it is refurbing It's a Small World, Jaws or a new Shamu show, sentimentality can help bolster the bottom line. Retail do this with loss leader products all the time - reduced price products or specialist only available at products to lure people in. I hope you do post Greatlakes as I very much look forward to reading your further thoughts.
Originally Posted By Spirit of 74 You had me with that post ... really ... and I am not that easy to have (REALLY!) until you said the following: <<Next time you see that guy sweeping trash on the midways, think that he could be a ride mechanic picking up extra hours at time and a half. I for one would love to get $45 an hour to sweep.>> Sorry ... unless I'm missing something (and I have had my evening spirits) you are suggesting something that just doesn't happen. ... At this point, I'd go to work at WDW sweeping for $22.50 an hour and be quite happy for a year or two!
