Originally Posted By dshyates They way I see it is either regulate it or bail it out later. Our choice.
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 <<Actually [the Catholic Church's position is] more of a if it happens, it happens approach. (Which will depending on the biological mix of the parents happen)>> Well, that's a sure formula for rampant reproduction, isn't it? Predictable sex urge x fertility rate = many Catholic babies. <<It's the sect of Christianity that I forget what it's called that the Duggars practice that encourages HUGE families (Although the founder of the movement is single and doesn't have any kids, pretty much doesn't practice 90% of what he preaches).>> Okay, the Catholic Church doesn't mandate having "huge" families. But by proscribing all effective methods of birth control, it pretty much ensures that big families will happen. And it celebrates (i.e., applies pressure toward) having big families. <<The edicts from the Catholic church come from a time when having lots of kids = lots of hands for the farm.>> Of course. Most religious rules are codifications of societal guidelines that were culturally adaptive at one time. Eating pork used to spread trichnosis. Hence the Jewish rule against eating pork. Families/cultures used to need to reproduce as much as possible to produce additional members to till the fields and fight the opposing families/cultures. Hence the religious rules against masturbation and homosexuality -- every sexual urge need to be channeled into procreation. But having sex with an immediate family member frequently resulted in a defective offspring. Hence: religious prohibitions against incest. It all made perfect sociological sense then. And, when you look at it anthropologically, that's what religion is all about: appealing to the supernatural to enforce rules that will benefit society overall. Some of those ancient religious rules are still culturally relevant. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you," for example. But others are long out-dated. Trichnosis has been wiped out. It is perfectly safe now to eat pork -- even when it's cooked medium or rare. But the Jewish mandate remains for believers. We no longer need to raise huge families to protect our fiefdoms. The "holy" proscriptions against masturbation and homosexuality are now ridiculously out-dated and irrelevant. But the Church still preaches against masturbation and homosexuality. Another child is born into poverty. Praise God. Let's just hope it doesn't grow up to be gay.
Originally Posted By avromark <<Let's just hope it doesn't grow up to be gay.>> Definately. Could you imagine, that child might even masturbate when older. The church may say no contraceptives, but considering at least in North America "the average" Catholic isn't even very church going. The average Catholic pretty much practices the ten commandments. Although I came from a bi-religious family I went to a Parochial school as a lad. Out of the Catholic families, One had 8 kids. Most had 3 or less. Besides sex until marriage is evil. Evil I tell you. My guess is many people are selective of what they believe. (I doubt all anthropologists are agnostic or atheist). Poverty is not by its nature all bad. People are not bad because they are poor. I've been to less industrialized and yes they may not have the niceties, But many of those families still raise their children with good moral upbringing, sense of honour/family etc. It's the trailer-trash aspect of this that is appalling not the socio-economic position. BTW The Philippines is a predominantly Catholic country (Except the south or north I forget which) and it has got to be one of the most gay friendly countries I've been too. (Guys openly displaying affection in public, not being hassled). Things in some countries would probably get them mugged or worst. I didn't notice any of this in Thailand for example. I'm sure there are poor LPers, or other economically depressed individuals. I wonder how many of them think, hey lets get ourselves enough kids to start out own Scout Troop is on their minds. I wonder is this lady (for lack of a better word that would escape Admin) is a Catholic? Maybe, but I doubt it.
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 <<Sorry for my demented pov.>> Are you kidding, avro?! I love reading your take on things.
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 <<Isn't the white population as a % declining with smaller average family sizes and increased immigration from non European sources?>> Yes, and I think this is a motivation for some white Americans to have kids. We gotta make sure the blacks and latinos don't outnumber us.
Originally Posted By Inspector 57 <<The church may say no contraceptives, but considering at least in North America "the average" Catholic isn't even very church going. The average Catholic pretty much practices the ten commandments.>> Studies show that 95+ percent of US Catholic women who consider themselves "seriously religious" use artificial birth control. <<My guess is many people are selective of what they believe.>> Amen, Brother Avro. People take out of it what they need and they rationalize the rest. Hmmmmmmmmm. Religion when -- and ONLY when -- it's convenient.
Originally Posted By tinkerbell1962 Ok, religion, no religion ... this woman had 8 babies!!!! I was a single mom raising two young children after my ex-husband left - I'm college educated and had a difficult time financially. There is something wrong with her. What does this family think, after having 8 babies she could just quietly fit into the neighborhood? What did this "Ed" say, they had a big house somewhere. Who cares! We're all going to end up paying for her diapers and formula. This morning on the news they stated the hospital had some nursing volunteers come in to help out. WHAT!?!? They're all crazy.
Originally Posted By mele Lady Starlight posted this article in another thread about this subject. <a href="http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090131/ap_on_re_us/octuplets" target="_blank">http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200...ctuplets</a> This one line really got to me: Yolanda Garcia, 49, of Whittier, said she helped care for Nadya Suleman's autistic son three years ago. ... "She told me that all of her kids were through in vitro, and I said 'Gosh, how can you afford that and go to school at the same time?"' she added. ***"And she said it's because she got paid for it." *** This woman is getting paid for it? What the hell does that mean? What group of sickos is this woman working for? It sounds like some crazy CSI storyline.
Originally Posted By DyGDisney She probably meant welfare. Maybe their huge house is in a different country, and that's why we'll never find it.
Originally Posted By DyGDisney Or maybe...... This super fertile woman is being paid to birth and raise a breed of super-humans. I mean, maybe it wasn't even her egg -- maybe they are aliens that live on an island where women can't have babies, but the "people (aliens that look human)" have super powers that have been given to them by the island. And their leader is a guy named Richard who is an alien/superhuman who never ages and collects children who are special for whatever reason and, oh wait, um, nevermind.........
Originally Posted By Mary Poppins I also disagree with someone having 8 more children with 6 still at home. We'll see in days to come what public support will come their way.
Originally Posted By avromark Now if she had the support system of the Duggars it would be "less wrong" but do you really need that many offspring in that short of a period?
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<Aliens aren't named Richard>> Thank goodness.. I was starting to look at my son differently! Oh wait we look at him like that because he's 12!!! While I don't understand continually having babies...The Duggars support themselves. I wonder how with 18 kids she is able to really enjoy any of them on their own.
Originally Posted By avromark ^^^ Discovery Channel paid at least in part for the Duggars house (that said he worked high up in gov't so... )
Originally Posted By avromark I'm sure she's worked. Worked on her tan, worked on her... well TMI there That said the Duggars have a "system" in place but seems like too many kids. I think I'll call it quits at 9 when I marry
