Originally Posted By Dabob2 " In my estimation its getting worse." You need to look at facts, not feelings. Feelings are more easily manipulated, and the modern media is masterful at that. So look at facts. Until the huge downturn (brought on by Republican policies), the general trend was not getting worse. Economically things were largely flat, except in the 90's. Certain other things, like crime and teen pregnancy rates, have actually gotten considerably better... but you'd never know it from the media. It's classic "truthiness" - don't fall for what seems to be true or what the media makes you feel "must" be true - look at what's actually true. And sorry if the Scandinavian model is inconveniently successful for you. But they're not Mars. They're modern western democracies. Not exactly like us, but certainly proving the lie of the idea that welfare and the goal of a more equal society is somehow doomed to fail. It can be done quite successfully.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer Plano, what you're saying seems to be answered by this: "We know that churches and charities can often make more of a difference than a poverty program alone. We don't want handouts for people who refuse to help themselves, and we certainly don't want bailouts for banks that break the rules. We don't think the government can solve all our problems. But we don't think that the government is the source of all our problems, any more than are welfare recipients, or corporations, or unions, or immigrants, or gays, or any other group we're told to blame for our troubles. Because -- because America, we understand that this democracy is ours. We, the People, recognize that we have responsibilities as well as rights; that our destinies are bound together; that a freedom which asks only what's in it for me, a freedom without a commitment to others, a freedom without love or charity or duty or patriotism, is unworthy of our founding ideals, and those who died in their defense. That was from Obama's speech tonight. I agree with you that there is a spiritual malaise in this country though it's not necessarily a religious one. Perhaps a rebirth of the notions of citizenship and community, and with it the social stigma that used to drive people to be productive members of the community, would be part of the solution to the problems you see. What effect do you think a Romney presidency would have on the communities that you are concerned about. Would his policies and passions improve their lives?
Originally Posted By dagobert Although I'm from Austria, I made that survey as well. 91% Jill Stein 81% Pres. Obama 28% Mitt Romney Who is Jill Stein? Since I'm already a Democrat over here, I'm not surprised that I'm a Democrat over there. I guess many conservatives here would even be Democrats in the US.
Originally Posted By ecdc Jill Stein is the Green Party candidate, the true liberal of the bunch. I always say, if you're a moderate, then Barack Obama ought to be your perfect President. There is not one issue that he's tackled that he's been a diehard progressive about. Healthcare? Obamacare is the Republican plan from the '90s they proposed as an alternative to Clintoncare.
Originally Posted By EdisYoda 83% Barack Obama 77% Jill Stein 66% Gary Johnson 31% Mitt Romney 82% Democratic 79% Green 28% Libertarian 27% Republican
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 93% Gary Johnson 65% Mitt Romney 39% Barack Obama 72% Libertarian 46% Democratic 39% Republican <a href="http://www.isidewith.com/results/96446185" target="_blank">http://www.isidewith.com/resul...96446185</a>
Originally Posted By WilliamK99 Ecdc, I disagree, if it wasn't for Obama's stance on immigration, I probably would vote for him. But his stance is so extreme I can't support him. With unemployment at a record high and social services all at a breaking point, we need to focus internally before we help others who are here ILLEGALLY . Illegal immigrants should be deported, not given any social services.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer <a href="http://www.whitehouse.gov/issues/fixing-immigration-system-america-s-21st-century-economy" target="_blank">http://www.whitehouse.gov/issu...-economy</a> What is the extreme position that you disagree with? He wants a path to citizenship for those who were brought here as kids, as long as they have a clean record. That path includes serving in the military or getting a college degree. He wants every illegal immigrant to be registered, and part of the registration process is to conduct background checks. He wants to create a easier way for farmers to hire seasonal labor, and to make it easier for them to hire legal workers rather than illegal workers. His administration has deported about as many people in the past 3.5 years that the Bush Administration deported during his entire 8-year presidency. What is the extreme part that you disagree with?
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 Looking at my results again. It's somewhat interesting that I side with Romney at 65% yet I only side with the Republicans by only 39%. Whereas I side with Obama at only 39% yet I'm with the Democrats 46% of the time. I'm not surprised though that I've sided more with the Libertarian viewpoint. I've felt I've slowly gravitated towards that way.
Originally Posted By TomSawyer You know that Romney is also for giving the children of illegal immigrants citizenship if they serve in the military, right? <a href="http://www.mittromney.com/issues/immigration" target="_blank">http://www.mittromney.com/issu...igration</a>
Originally Posted By WilliamK99 And you know I am not voting for Romney either. I will vote for other offices but for President I am voting "none of the above"
Originally Posted By wahooskipper I came up 62% for Romney. But, the glaring absence in that survey was the issue of trust and I have a hard time trusting either of these candidates. I could think a woman is hot, funny, smart, etc but if I don't think I can trust her I'm not going to marry her. I take voting pretty seriously so not feeling like I can trust the candidate weighs heavy on me. For the record, I trust my hot, funny, smart wife.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>I will vote for other offices but for President I am voting "none of the above"<< I did the same thing in 2004.
Originally Posted By skinnerbox <<Citizenship for children, it encourages more illegal activity.>> Every time someone voices this opinion, I just cringe. Let me understand you correctly, William. You have ZERO problem with taking an undocumented young adult who has lived in America for most of his/her life, and deporting them to the country of their birth which they don't remember nor have connections to via friends or family? Why does this not strike you as immoral? Seriously... I just don't understand how anyone can advocate punishing someone who's here through no fault of their own, who's actually making a better for themselves and contributing to our nation in a positive manner. The Republicans hate the DREAM Act because it will create a whole new generation of educated Democrats. Is that the real reason you hate it, William?
Originally Posted By EdisYoda This country needs to have "None of the Above" and/or "Abstain" on each ballot for each vote as an option. These would then get reported, and we would actually see in black and white how many chose NOT to vote for a candidtate or an issue instead of having to look at all the numbers. Also it would be much harder for the spin machine to do their work of saying that the people spoke. While I was taught it was a "right" to vote, I was also taught that it was also my civic obligation to vote. There are many times I'd vote none of the above, if given that option, rather then vote for the "lesser of evils". Also, given that option, I would make it somehow mandatory to vote (if elegible, that is). Just my $0.04 worth.
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 I have a feeling just like in 2004 it's going to be better the devil you know than the devil you don't for the Independent and undecided voter.
