Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Emirates is luxury, whereas BA, Virgin, and Continental feel like Walmart in comparison (or at least J C Penny)
Originally Posted By Anatole69 Yeah that's great, though this thread is a little OT to this category... as well as the Emirates using near slave labor to create their oasis in the desert, and near police state enforcement of it's laws e.g. a producer with the BBC was jailed for having remnants of a poppy seed muffin he ate before boarding his plane which their drug scanners read as an illicit drug and so he was imprisoned. Good luck selling that to the average Joe from America: enjoy your vacation in Dubai, see the towering office buildings, give alms to the poor Philipino workers, and spend a couple of years in Jail. You can't get that vacation experience at DCA, at least not yet! lol. - Anatole
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I would never call it slave labour. Most of the labourers are paid a fortune compared to what they command in their home countries. That is why they go there. Careful of the stereotypes you put out there. I could start talking about the dangers of car jacking going from the airport to a Disney resort, and then a justice system that would not then give any. Not to mention I can carry a gun in the Us, but god forbid my wife would wish to sunbathe topless. There are pros and cons of every society.
Originally Posted By Anatole69 But are they paid a fair price for their labor, that is the question. Not to mention reports of them not being paid at all, but only promised pay for the work they do and then have it held from them unless they do more work, ad nasuam. Yes, it's true every society has plusses and minuses... only some have bigger minuses in comparison to it's pluses. - Anatole
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo Well, having been to Manilla, Mumbai and Dubai, they are paid well for their work and are glad of it(better than market rates, and the cost of living is lower too, not to mention it's tax free). The same thing has happened on US and European contracts. It is illegal in Dubai, just as it is in the West. If caught, the contractors are punished. Heck, I've known colleagues taking up jobs in the west and having the same problems. The media pick up on these stories because they sell. Have you ever been to these places Anatole? Having travelled recently to the US and Dubai, the US is in decline, Dubai (and it seems Macau) are in accendency. It makes me really sad as a proud American. I would rather see Disney (and others) wow us in the US rather than cut back.
Originally Posted By Anatole69 I am well aware that there are problems in the US and I hope we can change them over time. However, we still have relative freedom of the press and can report on the issues the lower classes face here. We also have a seperation between government and business to some degree (depending upon who you talk to, ha ha) which allows for problems in one to be addressed by the other. These things are both lacking in Dubai, and there have been many reported problems with the labor situation in Dubai including protests and riots by the workers, and warnings by Humans Rights Watch. Here is an article by Mike Davis (with an avowed liberal slant, though the article is well referanced and the facts reported are given links for verification): <a href="http://newleftreview.org/?page=article&view=2635" target="_blank">http://newleftreview.org/?page...iew=2635</a> The stuff about the labor situation is near the end of the piece. - Anatole
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo A facinating and enlightening article. It seems the world has not moved on from the Chinese immigrants on the western railroads. Heck, there were suicides by folks working on WDW. But some of this stuff is really disturbing. I wonder if there is anything we can do? I am really torn. On one side I LOVE the idealism and push to stretch for the best in Dubai (like the reason I fell in love with Walt Disney). But I am adhored by inequality of opportunity. I spoke with some of the construction crews at Dubai airport, and they seemed happier in dubai than back in Pakistan or India. I wonder how real that was (seems pretty genuine). Is this a case of a few bad apples, or a whole crop of abuse? We don't know.
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt This discussion makes me want to book a trip to Dubai. Seriously. And Emirates has just begun service from San Francisco. Thanks for the info davewasbaloo.
Originally Posted By davewasbaloo I love the gold souk, as well as the spice souk, and the national museum is very cool too. Kebab in unlevened bread with watermelon juice for $5 - excellent
Originally Posted By Westsider What fascinates me is Dubai's desire to build multiple theme parks and operate them at a Western level of showmanship and sophistication. And to do that they are going to need to import a great many Westerners to staff the parks, particularly when it comes to entertainment, management, and operations. Perhaps 15 or 20 years from now when they have established a hospitality/entertainment culture there they can staff the operation with more locals. But for at least the first 10 years they are going to have to rely on a big chunks of expats to staff and manage the parks. And those main theme park operations departments, particularly entertainment, have a high level of gay folks working in the theme park industry. OOPS! I wonder just how many gay Americans or Western Europeans would go to Dubai to work the stage shows, parades and spectaculars at a Universal Studios or Six Flags when they learn the official Dubai government position on gays and their rights, or lack thereof??? Particularly in the 21st century when gay folks in the USA and Western Europe no longer allow themselves to live in the closet and deny who they are, an influx of dancers, entertainers and white collar creative types in a political and cultural system as sexually and religously repressive as Dubai would likely pose quite a problem when it comes time to recruit for the new parade. How do you justify going to work there to dance in the parade, when the governments religious position officially condemns you to death? Fascinating comments here though everybody!
Originally Posted By woody Westsider: You're talking about theme park shows. It doesn't require overt sexuality to perform the shows. You're getting hysterical. Certainly, there are gay performers, and Disney has them, but they won't be doing anything to advertise their preferences. I expect the shows to be tamer versions of the shows you can expect in Japan and Hong Kong.
Originally Posted By Westsider I just wonder how these big parks will recruit Westerners to come work there, particularly in entertainment. "Come To Dubai For A Fabulous Career! We'll Condemn You To Death If You Admit You Are Gay!"
Originally Posted By Hans Reinhardt "I just wonder how these big parks will recruit Westerners to come work there, particularly in entertainment." They will pay them lots of money, that's how.
Originally Posted By woody I'm sure the foreign population will live in separate areas. If there are any misunderstanding, deportation is most likely rather than having a public beheading.
