Originally Posted By -em >>One of the problems is how to react when something goes down. Where do you get more buses from? Which beam do you pull a monorail from to increase capacity somewhere else.<< One would think that math would already be in some excel document somewhere of under normal/busy/park dump operations the amount of 'rails/busses/boats/trams needed to exit a park and what backup plans exist for when things go wrong and how to best pool limited resources for the greatest good.. Sometimes it is just a numbers game
Originally Posted By sjhym333 True, but you and I both know from experience that if ferries go down the bulk of the exit goes to monorails who can really only run 4 exterior trains. Though I am surprised that they didnt start loading ferries from the Ft Wilderness dock at the MK.
Originally Posted By brotherdave Could the problem have been the dock at the TTC??? If I recall, there's only one dock there, right? (Or is it two?? Been so long since I took the ferries at WDW due to bus service or monorails...)
Originally Posted By -em >>True, but you and I both know from experience that if ferries go down the bulk of the exit goes to monorails who can really only run 4 exterior trains<< True- Its far better to have the 'rails go down vs the ferries due to capacity- Even if the TTC dock had issues why couldnt they have run the smaller boats to the Poly dock- not the best solution but a LOT closer than walking... They could've easily used the MK1 and the MK2 as they had just come off service 10 min before -em
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer >>>Could the problem have been the dock at the TTC??? If I recall, there's only one dock there, right? (Or is it two?? Been so long since I took the ferries at WDW due to bus service or monorails...)<<< One, which is a problem. People rush off the boat coming, as you try to get on. They should cycle...
Originally Posted By brotherdave Screamscape is now reporting that the ferry was closed due to high winds that night. Regardless of the reason, they should be prepared for such issues on one of the most crowded days of the year.
Originally Posted By sjhym333 ^^^While I agree the problem is how? On a busy night like that every bus and driver is already assigned to other routes that are also very busy. Do you pull a hotel bus from the EPCOT route when you have hundreds of guests waiting to return to their hotel? From experience it is easier to state the obvious, the problem is how to fix it. Each dept does what it can. It's not like there are buses and drivers just sitting around waiting to do something. Monorails probably added trains to both the express and hotel monorails lines and buses probably sent several busses but neither could match the capacity of a ferry boat.
Originally Posted By brotherdave Good points, sjhym333. It's always good to get viewpoints from someone who has "been there" in management. Perhaps they need to figure out a permanant "pedestrian" fix to allow people to walk if they choose to. But I realize that this is almost impossible due to the way that the water bridge is constructed. Perhaps a walkway to the Grand Floridian (something that I believe was originally proposed when the "Walk Around the World" bricks were being sold back in the early 90s) should be looked into again. Granted that this is a rare occurance, but what would happen if they ever really needed to evacuate the Magic Kingdom quickly???
Originally Posted By wahooskipper What is the distance from the TTC to the Kingdom gates via the permimeter road? That has to be at least 1/2 mile or more. Not an easy walk at the end of the night when you are towing a couple of sleepy kids.
Originally Posted By sjhym333 The water bridge makes it hard on the Contemporary side and the water way into storage for the Electrical Water Pageant makes it hard on the Grand Floridian side...especially because the barges are so tall. I believe that the distance is over 1/2 mile to TTC. And like I said, in the 80's we used to run trams to the MK on the busy days. Not very effective but at least you are moving people. And though the tram turn around/loading are is still there on the TTC side (to the right of the EPCOT monorail station), the MK side has now been redesigned for buses. If I were still in monorails I would have put 4 trains on the hotel and express beams and stood on the platform and take control of the cycle times on both ends of the system. If you do it correctly, the monorails can handle the extra crowds. Its a matter of getting them in and out on both ends.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper Maybe on those busiest of nights they should make both monorail lines express to the TTC. Poly guests can certainly walk from the TTC and Contemp guests could walk. I guess the problem is that the only ones REALLY hurt are the folks at the Grand...and they are your $$$ guests. In that case more direct boat trips to and from the Grand?
Originally Posted By sjhym333 Its a tough balancing act to make day guests and hotel guests happy. I have had several heated conversations with a hotel manager when there are monorail problems since the hotel guests tend to go to their front desk to complain. On the up side. Everyone eventually gets back to their final destination within a reasonable time. The problem is usually heightened because its late in the day, people are tired and just want to get to their hotel or home and because the sea of people looks chaotic.
Originally Posted By SeventyOne The answer seems pretty obvious to me...when the forecast indicates high winds will most likely shut your boats down at closing time on a night when historically you will be near capacity, immediately do a stage 3 or 4 closing and divert guests to EPCOT, where most just walk back to their cars without any transportation. By mid-afternoon, they must have had a sense the boats were probably going to be docked. Of course, that will kill the bottom line on food/merch sales, so I'm sure it was never an option. Em, on the DIS someone reported security and even O.C. deputies tried to halt the stampeded at one point, with little success. Did you see any of that?
Originally Posted By -em >> If I were still in monorails I would have put 4 trains on the hotel and express beams and stood on the platform and take control of the cycle times on both ends of the system. If you do it correctly, the monorails can handle the extra crowds.<< Exactly what I would've done- People tend to be more patient when it looks like everything is being done to get them out of there... While I wasn't watching the 'rails that close I didn't notice any so they wernt moving that quick.. >>Em, on the DIS someone reported security and even O.C. deputies tried to halt the stampeded at one point, with little success. Did you see any of that?<< That was prob after I went by as I seemed to go by the mid part of the first wave of guests..
Originally Posted By Ursula I don't know the area as well as our dear Em, but why are pedestrians allowed access to streets that have no sidewalks in the first place? Shouldn't it be closed off?
Originally Posted By Kennesaw Tom Routinely relying on the monorails to pick up the slack if the ferry boats are down is obviously not the solution. Plus, what is the expectation if ever the ferrys and monorails were for some diasterous reason all shut down. In my opinion I believe that Disney should create sidewalks and walkways so that there is complete access for quests to walk around the seven seas lagoon. This might be "in a perfect world" thinking but honestly I don't understand why Disney hasn't done this already in at least one direction. I mean come on, Disney can build half a billion dollar DVC after another, but they can't build a simple pedestrian walkway becide the tunnel under the water bridge? Disney certainly mastered their ability to build good pedestrian walkways between Epcot, Boardwalk and Disney's Hollywood Studios. It's a lovely walk and an efficient means to get around. There are examples of pedestrain walkways all over the Disney property that go under roads, over water that boats transverse. I know it would be expensive to build an additional tunnel along side the water bridge but it's time might have arrived.
Originally Posted By EPCOT Explorer Been the other way around as of late... Had to take the Ferry all through my trip, as opposed to the Mono.
Originally Posted By CuriouserConstance If I had to choose one person to place all of the blame on for this situation, I think I'd go with........Epcot Explorer. Yes, definitely, Epcot Explorer.
Originally Posted By CuriouserConstance Mostly because you're really the only WDW poster I kinda know.
