Originally Posted By AZDLDad #137 trekkeruss LOL I surely would not have posted a "BUSTED" myth. This is one of the funniest shows on cable.
Originally Posted By demderedoseguys I can't recall the exact verbage on the warning signs, but perhaps stronger language should be used such as "Persons should be in good health before riding this attraction or serious injury or even death may occur". I know this may sound a little extreme, but let's face it, with all the warning signs on virtually every attraction, many people may view the warning signs at MS as just another sign. The ride is intense and not for everyone and maybe Disney should try and differentiate it from the rest of the rides.
Originally Posted By wahooskipper The problem with the first death is that the victim had an UNKNOWN pre-existing condition. That very well might be determined to be the case with the second death. No matter what verbage you put on the signs, someone who doesn't know about a pre-existing condition probably isn't concerned about the warnings. A similar situation happened at Cedar Point in Ohio back in the 90s. One season a guest died of a brain anneurism (spl) after riding a tradition compact coaster called the Wildcat. There is nothing really extreme about the ride. It isn't the tallest, fastest, or anything like that. The very next season (roughly a year later) the very same thing happened again with another guest, on that same exact ride. A tragic coincidence. There have been no incidents since. Perhaps two at Mission: Space is just a tragic coincidence but if there is one more death I think there has to be a serious rethinking. In the case of the Wildcat there were no other significant reports of illness. In the case of Mission: Space I believe others have gone to the hospital after riding, though they did not die. There are forces on that ride that the average person never experienced on an amusement park thrill ride before.
Originally Posted By englishboy RoadTrip pitched: "I don't know. Two deaths in a year. I LOVE Mission Space; it is my favorite Disney attraction. No doubt the medical examiner will find that there is an underlying problem here too. But people can go on the other WDW rides with that same underlying problem and live to tell about it. It not appears that you can't say that about Mission Space. Can perfectly healthy people ride Mission Space? Yes. But many times people with some type of heart defect don't know about it, and therefor cannot make an informed decision about experiencing the attraction. I hate to say this more than you can imagine. But I think it is time for Disney to close the attraction." ++++ I agree, RT. I said everything I was going to say about this ride last summer. That the company who built it had strong reservations about its operation at the park, that no substantial testing occurred (other than to check for malfunction) after the death last summer, that the ride is open days after the death earlier this week, I will only offer this: I cannot believe that Disney is still operating this attraction. It tells me quite a lot about the Disney operation in Florida. I am thankful that in California the park's are held to a much high standard of legal safety for amusement rides than in Florida. Also I'm thankful an extensive investigation of any such death is handled by an outside agency in California. In the case of both deaths, the victims visited many other Disney World attractions without experiencing a life-threatening medical condition. It is likely that both had underlying medical problems, but the unique technology used on M:S combined with their medical conditions lead immediately to their deaths in a way unlike the experience of any other Disney World attraction.
Originally Posted By englishboy One more thing: please stop comparing M:S to air travel. Sure, a lot of people die while in airplanes. Also, a lot of people die while sleeping. Or even eating. Hell, let's throw cars in there as well. Or what about, exercise. Tons of people keel over while jogging each year. But here's the thing: M:S is an amusement attraction lasting 3 minutes. Its benefit is that of 3 minutes of amusement. Transit--air, bus, car, whatever--comes very close to being a necessity in American culture. Transit is required for many jobs. Transit is required to reunite famlies. Do some people use transit for amusement or as a means to arrive at amusements? Sure. But the value of transit is FAR GREATER to society than the value of amusement attractions. To equivicate the deaths (in terms of social costs) caused by amusement attractions with deaths caused by transit is simply rediculous.
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA <There are forces on that ride that the average person never experienced on an amusement park thrill ride before.> Or anywhere else in their lives for that matter.
Originally Posted By pixiedust1 <<I am thankful that in California the park's are held to a much high standard of legal safety for amusement rides than in Florida.>> We are also thankful that YOU are California.... I would not want someone who makes a statement like that living in Florida.. please stay where you are... God Help Us... amen...
Originally Posted By englishboy ^^^ Issues regarding legal "self-governance" of ride safety at Disney World is a significant problem in my opinion. Also the State of California has recently made operators of amusement attractions legally accountable to the same standard public safety as is required of operators of mass transit. In Florida, it's a lower legal standard. If you think Disney World's self-governance of safety and the Florida standards of safety are fine, that's OK. For me, I wish that Florida would adopt similar standards and OSHA procedures as required in California. I'd feel safer at the WDW parks. Also--in my opinion--I believe this would make the parks safer. When there was a non-death accident on California Screaming last summer, the ride closed for months while Disney and OSHA reviewed the accident. In Florida, after both deaths, M:S reopened within two days.
Originally Posted By mrichmondj Maybe Disney should suggest that riders of M:S be in good physical shape, i.e. exercise vigorously at least 3 times a week. That would give guests a better way to judge their physical condition and susceptibility to an undisclosed ailment if they have not been pre-diagnosed. After all, we are training to be astronauts, right? Maybe there should be a physical fitness test before you board?
Originally Posted By RoadTrip pixie... It is fine to disagree with englishboy, but you might want to try putting some intelligence into your posts.
Originally Posted By Coachbagfanatic1 englishboy - You can argue this post until you are blue in the face. I agree that everyone has the right to their opinion and I for one would not knock anyone for that. MS scares me the you know what out of me. Before these two unfortunate accidents, I was too scared to ride. Just because two people have passed on does not change my mind about the ride, I still feel the same way which is scared to ride it. I am way too chicken to go on it and I am in good health. I workout everyday, eat healthy, take my physicals when I need to and my blood work is great. But who is to say that if I do muster up the courage to go on it (NOT) that there is not some underlying issue with my health that has not been picked up by any testing. You just never know.
Originally Posted By demderedoseguys >Maybe there should be a physical fitness test before you board?< What would happen if people started dropping during the physical, or if they pronounced good to go and something bad happened anyway? This would only make matters worse for Disney. They are much better off with a "rider beware" policy.
Originally Posted By leemac They really do make it patently clear the type of forces that you experience on M:S. It isn't just the usual blurb at the entrance. It is force-fed into you throughout the three queue experiences. I really don't see what Disney could do differently.
Originally Posted By leemac <<For me, I wish that Florida would adopt similar standards and OSHA procedures as required in California. I'd feel safer at the WDW parks. Also--in my opinion--I believe this would make the parks safer. When there was a non-death accident on California Screaming last summer, the ride closed for months while Disney and OSHA reviewed the accident. In Florida, after both deaths, M:S reopened within two days.>> There is no evidence to suggest that OSHA will make any theme park safer. Closing Screamin' was overkill and unnecessarily ruined a lot of guests' experience at DCA. The report could have been compiled a lot quicker but got tangled in the usual CA bureacracy. If it makes you feel safer then it is a false sense of security. Until OSHA has the opportunity to show it has teeth I don't see any reason why a state like FL should adopt a similar strategy.
Originally Posted By t1lersm0m <<Maybe Disney should suggest that riders of M:S be in good physical shape, i.e. exercise vigorously at least 3 times a week. That would give guests a better way to judge their physical condition and susceptibility to an undisclosed ailment if they have not been pre-diagnosed. After all, we are training to be astronauts, right? Maybe there should be a physical fitness test before you board?>> According to what I've read on these boards, ridership on M:S is already suffering. Well known LPers have said that M:S is usually a walk on. So now you can eliminate 60-75% of the riders by making them take a physical fitness test, and have to pass it. You might as well close the attraction now. LOL
Originally Posted By leemac <<Well known LPers have said that M:S is usually a walk on. >> Last week it was posting wait times up to about an hour. It isn't a Test Track or Soarin' but it still seems to be fairly popular. It does have a pretty high throughput too.
Originally Posted By englishboy quote: There is no evidence to suggest that OSHA will make any theme park safer. Closing Screamin' was overkill and unnecessarily ruined a lot of guests' experience at DCA. The report could have been compiled a lot quicker but got tangled in the usual CA bureacracy. If it makes you feel safer then it is a false sense of security.>> Because of the tests a new braking system--or partial braking system--was added to the attraction. But it seems like the brunt of your response centers around that the test affected some vacation plans. That's not a safety issue. Yes, it's probably true that with a government agency there is procedural activity that takes more time than it should in an ideal world. But still, I'd much rather have a government body overseeing ride safety than any park itself, which stands to gain or lose financially from the operation of its rides. You can disagree--as you probably will--if you'd rather have ride owners and operators overseeing the safety of their own rides. Seems like a bad plan to me.
Originally Posted By leemac <<Because of the tests a new braking system--or partial braking system--was added to the attraction.>> Which the manufacturer stated was not necessary to the system in place. <<But still, I'd much rather have a government body overseeing ride safety than any park itself, which stands to gain or lose financially from the operation of its rides. You can disagree--as you probably will--if you'd rather have ride owners and operators overseeing the safety of their own rides.>> Precisely. It is in WDW's best interests to keep their attractions maintained to the highest standard. Same for Universal, Sea World, Cedar Fair etc. If word got out about failings it would kill their attendance. IMO the system isn't broken in FL so there is no need to fix it. WDW and the other local parks have an excellent safety record. Far superior to an older park like Disneyland.
Originally Posted By englishboy ^^ Leemac, A ride systems manufacturer claiming that their ride is safe as built after an accident sounds a lot more like statement to avoid a lawsuit than an assurance of ride safety. Seriously, did you expect them to say, Oh yeah, it was our fault. There was a small problem in the brake design. Hence, the reason why such testing should be done by an outside agency.
