Originally Posted By Mr F I'm sorry but this is a site for Disney fans and A LOT of disney fans and disney employees are Gay, so the "YES ON 8" ad ON THIS SITE is a TOTAL insult.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder The proprietors of this site don't have any control over some of the ads that appear.
Originally Posted By avromark Who isn't happy?! I just have Swarovski. See you need a non US IP so you don't see the political ads
Originally Posted By Jim in Merced CA <Bottom line is, none of your rights are being threatened hear. Yet you are advocating a right be taken away from the gay crowd. You're going to stir up the wrath of quite a few people doing that> No to mention just plain ol' bad karma.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains It's been gone from my computer since I came back on about 30 min ago.
Originally Posted By markymouse The ad does seem to be gone. Good riddance. That ad upset me so much I had to read "King and King" to three different kindergarten classes before I felt sufficiently gay again. OK. Actually, I read "Today is Monday", "The Wheels on the Race Cars" and "The Little Mermaid" to one preschooler while their other dad read with our first grader, and our fifth grade read a book of magic tricks. I doubt we're turning them gay, but there is a good chance we're turning them literate.
Originally Posted By Elderp "Bottom line is, none of your rights are being threatened hear. " I don't care about the spelling mistake, anyhow, I have to differ on this. I have already seen an increasing number of threats on my rights and of those I know. On these boards I have outright read people telling me my church "should get all it deserves" and "it's tax exempt status should be repealed" based on this issue. In San Diego I know of a doctor who is getting sued right now because he refused to perform a artificial semination on a lesbian couple, despite the fact there were many other doctors who were willing to perform the procedure. I know of two lawsuits in which churches were put on trial because they refused to rent out their facilities to gay marriages (in those cases they won, but that was before prop 22 was repealed). Those are actual cases. I wont even go into the theoretical cases, because if prop 8 doesn't pass I wont have to. I can almost guarantee LDS and Catholic Social Services will have to close shop (at least on the adoption part of their operations). I am sure after those go down many others will follow. The lawsuits by the gay community wont stop as they will see the defeat as a rally cryto bring forth more lawsuits. In fact at this point I am pretty much resigned to lawsuits no matter what, but at this point I'd much rather have the constituion on my side than not.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***I have already seen an increasing number of threats on my rights and of those I know. On these boards I have outright read people telling me my church "should get all it deserves" and "it's tax exempt status should be repealed" based on this issue.*** That has nothing to do with "your" rights, Elder. If your group choses to act as a PAC they should be taxed as one. That is simply following the law, and has NOTHING to do even with the particular issue at hand. ***I can almost guarantee LDS and Catholic Social Services will have to close shop (at least on the adoption part of their operations).*** More lies, over and over. Care to explain why the LDS adoption agency in MASSACHUSETTS is still open and running, and perhaps if you're not too intellectually dishonest you could also explain WHY that situation differs from the Catholic churchs', and why your lie would hold true for California as well. Do you have ANY sense of decency, buddy? Really, how do you sleep at night? If I were as religious as YOU claim to be, I'd be really worried about hell if I were you.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***In fact at this point I am pretty much resigned to lawsuits no matter what, but at this point I'd much rather have the constituion on my side than not.*** And now we have the most ludicrous statement ever made. Congratulations. The constitution is designed to SEPARATE church and state, NOT to assist it. Try reading it sometime.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<In San Diego I know of a doctor who is getting sued right now because he refused to perform a artificial semination on a lesbian couple, despite the fact there were many other doctors who were willing to perform the procedure.>> If that is true - not saying it is or not - but since you personally know this guy I would assume you know that is why... I doubt it wasn't because he refused to do it - but because he refused to do it because she is gay... Had he/she simply refused to do it there would be no lawsuit. But once someone in a business denies a service simply based on ones sexual orientation then they bring this on themselves... No different than someone denying you service because you are heterosexual.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<On these boards I have outright read people telling me my church "should get all it deserves" and "it's tax exempt status should be repealed" based on this issue>> Not because of this issue - but because your church has decided to go against tax-exemption guidelines and openly campaign for an issue.
Originally Posted By mele This isn't a chicken vs. the egg situation. The campaigning came first...thus the backlash.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<I know of two lawsuits in which churches were put on trial because they refused to rent out their facilities to gay marriages (in those cases they won, but that was before prop 22 was repealed>> If these facilities were rented out publicly for people not members of their church then yes they were violating a law. But like our Catholic Church does not rent out it's hall for any non-Catholic events - so they could to refuse rent it out for a Gay event.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder "<<On these boards I have outright read people telling me my church "should get all it deserves" and "it's tax exempt status should be repealed" based on this issue>> Not because of this issue - but because your church has decided to go against tax-exemption guidelines and openly campaign for an issue." Exactly. He and josh have been told literally hundreds of times by now that they can do whatever they want within their church- just don't try and impose their morality on the rest of us. But no, they "know better".
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<I can almost guarantee LDS and Catholic Social Services will have to close shop (at least on the adoption part of their operations>> As posted before - only if they operate as a public service therefore placing children in homes other than there own religion - and they receive federal or state funding - which is what happened in Mass with the Catholic Social Services.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<<at this point I'd much rather have the constituion on my side than not>>>> That is the point Elderp - you want the consitution to be amended to fit your beliefs.
Originally Posted By gottaluvdavillains <<<<<On these boards I have outright read people telling me my church "should get all it deserves" and "it's tax exempt status should be repealed" based on this issue>>>>> You know elderp - All the issues have bothered me... but this one is near the top! The Church of LDS knew this campaign could jepordise their tax-status and yet they still felt it was more important than their status. So if they lose it - it's because they made that decision before they threw their hat in the ring! UtahJosh(I think it was him) mentioned in one of the threads on this that losing their tax-status wasn't a big deal - and worth it.
Originally Posted By SingleParkPassholder And as has pointed out many times as well, now they're playing the persecuted victim here, after going after gays like they have. Utterly shameful.
Originally Posted By Mr X ***UtahJosh(I think it was him) mentioned in one of the threads on this that losing their tax-status wasn't a big deal - and worth it.*** It could be a bigger deal than he thinks, and not just for tax reasons. There is very much a "hands off" attitude towards religion as it pertains to bigotry or sexism or any of the other antiquated stuff they promote...but the gloves come off when it's revealed that these guys aren't acting as a church at all but rather as a political committee. The delicious irony here is that, due to THEIR insistence on turning this whole morality issue political...a lot of the "horrid" things they're so afraid of like being forced to allow equal treatment for women (any role in their group is fair game, right on up to "chief prophet" or whatever the title is), and yes perhaps even being forced to allow equal treatment for all in terms of their marriage ceremonies and all that (much like Las Vegas)...and guess what? NOT because of this issue at hand, but rather thanks directly to their arrogance in trying to force their beliefs on everyone else. So to all you gay folks out there dreaming of a Mormon Temple Wedding...you might just get your chance.
